Run a business. Spend within our means.
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OT: What next for Harry?
- Thread starter SUIYHA
- Start date
Run a business. Spend within our means.
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
but our means is down to our assets and dont get it twisted, before we got to this point where we could do that we had to put out a decent outlay to get players in..., think about it, what assets did we truly have to get the difference makers in?now we rotate players in and out in an upward spiral while still doing what big teams do but on a lower tier...all the while shipping off players that dont make the grade
so we do the same , we just dont buy everyone that has legs
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
We do what we do within our means, just like Arsenal do to be fair for them. We haven't done the real life equivalent of using a cheat code to get our relative success. We are where we are because of legitimate business practices, good investments, clever decision making and excellent strategic planning.
If we had any assets it was because that was our standing as a club and we were entitled to use them. Emirates Marketing Project got given a winning lottery ticket and used that. Way different. But I'm sure you know that?
We could buy loads of useless crap too, because we have already earned money to enable us to do that. QPR are doing it with money given to them by their owner, instead of putting in the years of hard work of building something. While football clubs are businesses, it's a sporting competition and it gives them an unfair advantage over other clubs that are doing the hard way (and proper way).
The difference to me is where the money comes from. The money that we (and Arse) spend comes from the fans, who pay exorbitant prices to support their team. The money that City/Chelsea spend comes from a sugardaddy owner, and yet their fans crow about their success and mega-signings as if *they* were personally responsible for them.
It's like the difference between a person who's rich because he/she works hard and is blessed with marketable talent and intelligence, versus some kid who's rich because of their mummy and daddy or a gold-digger who marries a wealthy old guy for money. Being rich isn't the issue here, and nor is spending (and wasting) a lot of money. I could not care less what people do with their own money...the issue is whether the money you spend to gain success is actually "your" money - that is, something you've earned yourself.
It's like the difference between a person who's rich because he/she works hard and is blessed with marketable talent and intelligence, versus some kid who's rich because of their mummy and daddy or a gold-digger who marries a wealthy old guy for money. Being rich isn't the issue here, and nor is spending (and wasting) a lot of money. I could not care less what people do with their own money...the issue is whether the money you spend to gain success is actually "your" money - that is, something you've earned yourself.
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
of course i do but you and jordy are acting like football started only in the last 10 years or something...we got to where we are due to similar power house tactics from way back when. once the club is a house hold franchise its easier to to use that kind of leverage to your favour. there is a reason why tottenham is a lucrative and always has been a lucrative prospect since hoe many decades ago.
what thats done has given us the opportunity to do what big teams do but in a smaller market.....brought us to a position where we can now deal in a more pragmatic fashion
when you come down to it 50 years down the line city could be dealing within their means and their fans would be mocking the next billionaire boys club on the scene
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
and why do you think the fans are willing to pay extortionate prices? why say would it be more likely a fan would pay 60 pounds to see a spurs game but say if you raised Barnet to 60 you might as well play in an empty stadium?
research time for me actually
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
http://www.transferleague.co.uk/premiership-transfers/tottenham-hotspur-transfers.html
how far back can we go with transfers? anyone got a link to some seeeeerious historic moves we did?
accounting for inflation some of the Net spending we did in the early part of this millennium and the last 20th century must surely be huge....
edit:- actually those figures mean nothing.........even if we spent that on transfers that doesnt account for gate receipts and merchandising and sponsorships etc etc
we could very well have been earning that money.
i still maintain that we do similar to what city do but on a significantly smaller scale , with higher risk but spread out / minimised as much as possible
how far back can we go with transfers? anyone got a link to some seeeeerious historic moves we did?
accounting for inflation some of the Net spending we did in the early part of this millennium and the last 20th century must surely be huge....
edit:- actually those figures mean nothing.........even if we spent that on transfers that doesnt account for gate receipts and merchandising and sponsorships etc etc
we could very well have been earning that money.
i still maintain that we do similar to what city do but on a significantly smaller scale , with higher risk but spread out / minimised as much as possible
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africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
actually those figures mean nothing.........even if we spent that on transfers that doesnt account for gate receipts and merchandising and sponsorships
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
you know what...i think the word deserve is the problem. expect would be more appropriate
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
That is the point is n't it? We don't go out and blow a ~£1 billion in less than 5 years. Generally we buy "rough diamonds " and polish them up rather the finished articles likes of Sergio Aguerro, Fernando Torres or Robin Van Persie. Our top spend on a player is less than Aston Villa spent on Darren Bent. Our wages to turnover ration is also less than Villa. It's what I love about Daniel Levy, we operate in a hyper inflated market ( Bristol Rovers, in league 2 have a wage bill of £18 million ), yet he keeps us competitive both on and off the field. If we were remotely like Emirates Marketing Project we would have bought a trophy years ago. I understand that you want to make a point about posters seeing bad in everything HR says or does but to say we are like City is plain wrong.
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
fair enough, we dont throw money at the situation to the extent that city do i agree. i think that was me going a few steps waaay to far to prove a point.......
hypotheticaly speaking though .... isnt us not doing a city because we cant afford it? we arent as rich so we dont do it......what we can do is speculate on a purchase and take a gamble....but thats the area we can afford.....whereas other teams cant afford to do the same.
even in recent years the way we operated was to take the best of the rest that were not wanted by the big clubs in hopes of bridging the gap between us and them.....we did this season after season......because we could afford to do it, other teams couldnt compete with us within thAT sub section of the market...and we just kept on buying and buying and buying till we cut out the ones that didnt make the grade and kept the rest
this thing is all relative, the question is if ENIC had sheik type disposable income....would they keep to this structure that they have or not?
i will say though that the wage bill control is definately a sign of a big differential between us and city...especially as it is linked to profits and revenue
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
We spend whatever we do and have done because that's what our standing allows us to do. If we say we are the 5th biggest side with the 5th best ability to spend our resources then it's absolutely fine to spend what we did, hoover up the best talent and cut away the ones that don't make it. It's our right, it's our money, we made it and we are reinvesting it wisely.
City's standing isn't to be the 2nd or 1st biggest club in the country. They should probably be around 8th-10th (but maybe top 6 depending on their stadium income and commercial revnue, I don't actually know where exactly where they should be) but the point is, their standing is not the biggest or the second biggest. They have jumped because they got a winning lottery ticket and that's the difference between us.
If we ever establish ourselves as a consistent top 4 club or a consistent title challenger season on season with Levy and ENIC in charge as they are now, then that achievement will be far greater than anything City will ever do under Mansour. We will have increased our standing through clever decision making within our means, City increased it by throwing their lottery winnings at the problem.
jts1882
Dean Richards
We have broken the transfer record a number of times in our history going back to before WWI (possibly Fanny Walden), but we have always lived within our means because of our large support. We built WHL on gate money and a share issue and I don't think we have ever had a sugar daddy owner or gone bankrupt. Our growth has been organic. The reason we could afford Greaves (almost a record) was because we had the biggest gate back then.
\o/
Former Spurs coach admits: Redknapp speculation ruined last season
By Ben Pearce, Tottenham correspondent Thursday, January 10, 2013
11:45 AM
The Lilywhites held a 10-point lead over Arsenal in February 2012 and looked set for a third-place finish, which would have represented their best ever Premier League campaign.
However, Fabio Capello quit his post with England that month, leaving Redknapp as the favourite for the national job – and Tottenham’s form dipped sharply as they collected just six points from a possible 27.
Spurs’ demise included a 1-0 defeat at QPR on April 21, which left the Lilywhites in fifth place – six points behind the Gunners – and they ultimately missed out on a place in the Champions League.
And, while Redknapp always insisted that the England speculation was not affecting his players, Allen has a different view.
“There was a lot going on which you obviously don’t want to affect the team, but I think at the end of the day when we look back on it that’s probably what happened,” said Allen.
“It was wall-to-wall coverage at that time and you can’t help noticing and wondering what’s going to happen. Perhaps the players did get distracted, and it cost us.
“We had some big games, notably the one at QPR, where we slipped up. It was a big blow because of the way we’d gone about the first half of the season. I think everyone enjoyed the football that we played, but we couldn’t carry that right through.”
Redknapp was sacked in June and Allen also departed during the managerial shake-up. But, seven months on, Tottenham are sitting in third place again and Allen, who scored 84 goals in 124 games for Spurs during his playing days, is watching with interest.
“Obviously it was a surprise, the changes that took place in the summer,” he said. “But AVB [Andre Villas-Boas] was left with a fantastic squad, he has added one or two players to that through the summer and I guess there will be some additions in this transfer window. It always takes a little while to get going under new management but going into the halfway period they’re in really good shape.
“I think their Champions League ambitions are very high. The top two will be [Manchester] City and United with Chelsea probably third, and then there’s fourth place.
“I’ve no doubt Arsenal will be there and Everton are going to be there this season. There’s a battle on but they [Spurs] are capable of doing it, as well as competing strongly for the cup.
“I watched them beat Coventry at the weekend and, looking at the way the FA Cup’s shaping up in the fourth round, I can see Tottenham going a long way and possibly winning it.
“I think what the manager has is such good depth in the squad now that he’s had the opportunity to change the team around in the Europa League games and cup games as well and there’s a lot of competition for places.
“Is the squad stronger than it was last season? When you take out someone of the quality of Luka Modric and Ledley at centre-half, it’s always going to be difficult to replace.
“It will be a test of time over the course of the season – obviously there are big games to come and you just hope that the players who have come in are up for that.”
Allen also played for QPR with distinction, hitting 83 goals in 147 games in two spells with the Rs, and he will be an interested observer as Tottenham take on Redknapp’s outfit at Loftus Road on Saturday.
“There were a lot of players brought in, it hasn’t really gelled and the results have been pretty disappointing and I am surprised to see them where they are,” said Allen.
“It was my first club, I’ve got a soft spot for them and I’d like to see them get out of trouble. If there’s anyone who’s going to get them out of it, it will be Harry.
“The players respond to him and he gets the best out of them. When teams are in that sort of situation the players are obviously not performing, so I think he will get them to perform and with the ability they have I’m sure they’ll get themselves out of trouble.
“I think it will be a very tight game this weekend. Obviously QPR are desperate for any sort of result and Tottenham are full of confidence at the moment.
“Both teams are potential winners for different reasons, but I think it will be a draw – although I don’t think that will suit either team.
“Tottenham will want to keep their run going and QPR need three points at all costs. I’m sure Harry would say he’d be happy with a point, but he’ll be looking for three.”
http://www.hamhigh.co.uk/premier-le...napp_speculation_ruined_last_season_1_1787464
Former Spurs coach admits: Redknapp speculation ruined last season
By Ben Pearce, Tottenham correspondent Thursday, January 10, 2013
11:45 AM
The Lilywhites held a 10-point lead over Arsenal in February 2012 and looked set for a third-place finish, which would have represented their best ever Premier League campaign.
However, Fabio Capello quit his post with England that month, leaving Redknapp as the favourite for the national job – and Tottenham’s form dipped sharply as they collected just six points from a possible 27.
Spurs’ demise included a 1-0 defeat at QPR on April 21, which left the Lilywhites in fifth place – six points behind the Gunners – and they ultimately missed out on a place in the Champions League.
And, while Redknapp always insisted that the England speculation was not affecting his players, Allen has a different view.
“There was a lot going on which you obviously don’t want to affect the team, but I think at the end of the day when we look back on it that’s probably what happened,” said Allen.
“It was wall-to-wall coverage at that time and you can’t help noticing and wondering what’s going to happen. Perhaps the players did get distracted, and it cost us.
“We had some big games, notably the one at QPR, where we slipped up. It was a big blow because of the way we’d gone about the first half of the season. I think everyone enjoyed the football that we played, but we couldn’t carry that right through.”
Redknapp was sacked in June and Allen also departed during the managerial shake-up. But, seven months on, Tottenham are sitting in third place again and Allen, who scored 84 goals in 124 games for Spurs during his playing days, is watching with interest.
“Obviously it was a surprise, the changes that took place in the summer,” he said. “But AVB [Andre Villas-Boas] was left with a fantastic squad, he has added one or two players to that through the summer and I guess there will be some additions in this transfer window. It always takes a little while to get going under new management but going into the halfway period they’re in really good shape.
“I think their Champions League ambitions are very high. The top two will be [Manchester] City and United with Chelsea probably third, and then there’s fourth place.
“I’ve no doubt Arsenal will be there and Everton are going to be there this season. There’s a battle on but they [Spurs] are capable of doing it, as well as competing strongly for the cup.
“I watched them beat Coventry at the weekend and, looking at the way the FA Cup’s shaping up in the fourth round, I can see Tottenham going a long way and possibly winning it.
“I think what the manager has is such good depth in the squad now that he’s had the opportunity to change the team around in the Europa League games and cup games as well and there’s a lot of competition for places.
“Is the squad stronger than it was last season? When you take out someone of the quality of Luka Modric and Ledley at centre-half, it’s always going to be difficult to replace.
“It will be a test of time over the course of the season – obviously there are big games to come and you just hope that the players who have come in are up for that.”
Allen also played for QPR with distinction, hitting 83 goals in 147 games in two spells with the Rs, and he will be an interested observer as Tottenham take on Redknapp’s outfit at Loftus Road on Saturday.
“There were a lot of players brought in, it hasn’t really gelled and the results have been pretty disappointing and I am surprised to see them where they are,” said Allen.
“It was my first club, I’ve got a soft spot for them and I’d like to see them get out of trouble. If there’s anyone who’s going to get them out of it, it will be Harry.
“The players respond to him and he gets the best out of them. When teams are in that sort of situation the players are obviously not performing, so I think he will get them to perform and with the ability they have I’m sure they’ll get themselves out of trouble.
“I think it will be a very tight game this weekend. Obviously QPR are desperate for any sort of result and Tottenham are full of confidence at the moment.
“Both teams are potential winners for different reasons, but I think it will be a draw – although I don’t think that will suit either team.
“Tottenham will want to keep their run going and QPR need three points at all costs. I’m sure Harry would say he’d be happy with a point, but he’ll be looking for three.”
http://www.hamhigh.co.uk/premier-le...napp_speculation_ruined_last_season_1_1787464
Kingdawson
Banned
QPR boss Harry Redknapp reckons his former club Tottenham have enough quality to field two sides capable of challenging at the top of the Premier League.
Redknapp welcomes the club that sacked him at the end of last season to Loftus Road on Saturday and has watched his successor, Andre Villas-Boas, guide them to third in the table.
Survival, by contrast, is the challenge at Loftus Road and Redknapp knows the league's bottom-placed side face a tough task to make his the game a memorable reunion for him.
"Spurs could field two teams who could compete in the Premier League," he told the Evening Standard.
Live on Sky Sports
vs
QPR v Tottenham
January 12, 2013 12:00pm
Remote Record
"They have a second team who would hold their own at the top level without any problem. For a start, they have five top-class centre-backs.
"They can afford to let Danny Rose go to Sunderland on loan because they have people like Benoit Assou-Ekotto, Kyle Naughton and Kyle Walker in the squad. They have loads of top-class midfielders.
"They're full of quality everywhere. It's a similar group to the one I left but then Mousa Dembele has gone in and done well. They have an outstanding group of players, no doubt about that."
"Not many people walk away from a club as popular as I was at that time. Normally when you leave a football club, you go out with the fans shouting for you to go but I never had that."
Harry Redknapp
Quotes of the week
Redknapp had guided Spurs to their second fourth-placed finish in three campaigns before he was dismissed, but denies any ill-feeling towards his former employers.
"It will be strange but time moves on and I have no bad feelings towards Tottenham," he added.
"I don't live my life like that. I had a great time there, I loved the fans and they were great to me.
"Not many people walk away from a club as popular as I was at that time. Normally when you leave a football club, you go out with the fans shouting for you to go but I never had that. The people treated me absolutely brilliantly."
Redknapp welcomes the club that sacked him at the end of last season to Loftus Road on Saturday and has watched his successor, Andre Villas-Boas, guide them to third in the table.
Survival, by contrast, is the challenge at Loftus Road and Redknapp knows the league's bottom-placed side face a tough task to make his the game a memorable reunion for him.
"Spurs could field two teams who could compete in the Premier League," he told the Evening Standard.
Live on Sky Sports
vs
QPR v Tottenham
January 12, 2013 12:00pm
Remote Record
"They have a second team who would hold their own at the top level without any problem. For a start, they have five top-class centre-backs.
"They can afford to let Danny Rose go to Sunderland on loan because they have people like Benoit Assou-Ekotto, Kyle Naughton and Kyle Walker in the squad. They have loads of top-class midfielders.
"They're full of quality everywhere. It's a similar group to the one I left but then Mousa Dembele has gone in and done well. They have an outstanding group of players, no doubt about that."
"Not many people walk away from a club as popular as I was at that time. Normally when you leave a football club, you go out with the fans shouting for you to go but I never had that."
Harry Redknapp
Quotes of the week
Redknapp had guided Spurs to their second fourth-placed finish in three campaigns before he was dismissed, but denies any ill-feeling towards his former employers.
"It will be strange but time moves on and I have no bad feelings towards Tottenham," he added.
"I don't live my life like that. I had a great time there, I loved the fans and they were great to me.
"Not many people walk away from a club as popular as I was at that time. Normally when you leave a football club, you go out with the fans shouting for you to go but I never had that. The people treated me absolutely brilliantly."
Spursalot
Jimmy McCormick
You notice the article mentions 'top of the premier league, but Redknapp says nothing of the sort. He just says that they could compete in the top division.
Shoddy journalism.
jts1882
Dean Richards
Yes, I noticed that.
It also twists the meaning. If it was two sides capable of competing at the top of the PL, it would be implying that anyone could have Spurs near the top regardless of who they picked to play. That makes it a dig at AVB, whereas saying that there are two sides that would comfortably exist in the top division is very different.
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
Hopefully Allen's testament there puts the boot into the argument that us collapsing so far last season was simply the club falling back to it's natural level after over-performing to a massive degree in the first half of it.
I say screw that, we had Bale, Lennon, Adebayor pre dip this season, Van der Vaart with Defoe to come in if he was injured, we had Modric, Sandro, Parker, King getting a good run of games but with Kaboul, Gallas and Dawson to cover for him. We had Walker impressing so much in his first full season that he got an England call up and BAE showing the composure and solidity that makes him the player he has grown into. To top it off we had Brad in goal making very few mistakes all year.
No way was that team just falling back to it's natural level. It was a fantastic team. It had the likes of Corluka, Kranjcar and Pienaar that could have been important members of the squad had they been used more effectively, and while there were other good teams around us there is no way we should have fallen as far as we did. Better management of the squad, better planning and preparation would have seen us there. As well as killing the England speculation straight away once it becomes clear it's affecting the team.
Grrrr, writing that out makes me angry about last season all over again! Could have been so easily prevented, and we would be laughing in Arsenal's face right now had we had the foresight.
I say screw that, we had Bale, Lennon, Adebayor pre dip this season, Van der Vaart with Defoe to come in if he was injured, we had Modric, Sandro, Parker, King getting a good run of games but with Kaboul, Gallas and Dawson to cover for him. We had Walker impressing so much in his first full season that he got an England call up and BAE showing the composure and solidity that makes him the player he has grown into. To top it off we had Brad in goal making very few mistakes all year.
No way was that team just falling back to it's natural level. It was a fantastic team. It had the likes of Corluka, Kranjcar and Pienaar that could have been important members of the squad had they been used more effectively, and while there were other good teams around us there is no way we should have fallen as far as we did. Better management of the squad, better planning and preparation would have seen us there. As well as killing the England speculation straight away once it becomes clear it's affecting the team.
Grrrr, writing that out makes me angry about last season all over again! Could have been so easily prevented, and we would be laughing in Arsenal's face right now had we had the foresight.