OMT *** Tottenham Hotspur v Qarabag *** 26/9/24 at 8pm.

[Bishop]

One thing I will say is that leaving our defensive woes aside, having seen a few games now, I'm convinced that if Solanke stays fit, he's going to score a tonne in this system.

Tbh I'm still a little unsure of this. We haven't really created many goal scoring chances for him. Despite that he has scored two, both rebounds which is of course a positive as it means he's hungry and alert but in terms of the team creating actual chances for him we've yet to see it.

 

[Rorschach]

Thought he was much more than decent on the ball. His ability to keep the ball and get past players in tight areas is way up there imo.

The amount of times he got skinned on the outside is a concern if it continues to be a trend and he keeps playing as a full back.

He did very well a few times but also lost it a few times rather dangerously. I suppose that is Ange ball but I'd prefer he wasn't the last line of defense while trying this. He needs to move up the pitch I think.

 

[braineclipse]

He did very well a few times but also lost it a few times rather dangerously. I suppose that is Ange ball but I'd prefer he wasn't the last line of defense while trying this. He needs to move up the pitch I think.

If he's good enough at it that's exactly what he should be doing. I think he will probably end up playing further forward eventually. But living dangerously is part of Ange ball for sure. All our starting defenders do that at times.

 

[DeanoAustin]

If he's good enough at it that's exactly what he should be doing. I think he will probably end up playing further forward eventually. But living dangerously is part of Ange ball for sure. All our starting defenders do that at times.

Thought he was really poor defensively to be honest. Positioning and body shape was awful at times. That said, you can see the lad is very good on the ball and will be a player further up the pitch for us. He's not a full back though.

 

[Rorschach]

If he's good enough at it that's exactly what he should be doing. I think he will probably end up playing further forward eventually. But living dangerously is part of Ange ball for sure. All our starting defenders do that at times.

Yep all our defnders do it and fail on occasion too. That is how we play, but Gray is not great defensively. To me he always looks like someone playing out of position back there and his dribbling skills won't compensate for his defensive deficiencies. He might get better but he's more suited to CM in my opinion. Anyway he is another good prospect which is the main thing.

 

[harr1984]

Yep all our defnders do it and fail on occasion too. That is how we play, but Gray is not great defensively. To me he always looks like someone playing out of position back there and his dribbling skills won't compensate for his defensive deficiencies. He might get better but he's more suited to CM in my opinion. Anyway he is another good prospect which is the main thing.

The consensus is he will end up as a CM which I would agree with. But as for him at RB, Porro had a lot of defensive issues whilst being more attacking minded which he has much improved on so I'm assuming Ange believes will be the same story with Gray.

But personally I don't understand why he would rather put Gray there who will likely end up in CM, when we have a perfectly talented RB thirsty for more game time in Spence. But obviously he has his reasons, and in Ange we trust.....

 

[Muttley]

I was out all eveing so wasn't even following this until i started my journey home around 10pm...checked phone, WTF is this??
Man sent off before 10 minutes, yet we were 3-0 up??? Plus phone app said match still had 15 minutes to go, at 10pm?? Is my app glitching??

Got home and saw that game had been delayed so it was all true!
Ten men? Win? Keep clean sheet??

What sorcery was this?????


COYFS

Sounds similar to my evening. I was playing in a house band at an open mic night. One telly in the far corner of the pub and I had a few chances to pop my head in.

Like the logistics, Ange had a mare. He picked 2 keepers on the bench and ignored some of the kids, then sacrificed fan fave Bergval to put teachers pet back in central defence after Dragusin got the red. It then sounds like we played terribly and were all over the place defensively, only for our 3 in 3 forward BJ and 2 in 2 striker Solanke to execute Ange's plan. We just went into full Ossie mode.

Makes me wonder what the score may have been if Ange had selected Forster.

Might watch the game later.

Onwards and upwards.

 

[treepits]

What was your wife’s verdict? Is she now a lillywhite?

Thanks for asking

Her and the two kids are Spurs by default so that's a given but I don't think she'll be pushing me for regular visits! Lets just say she was unimpressed with the late kick off (she had munched through her crisps and twirl bites before the match even started) and even less impressed with us not getting home till gone 1am due to the traffic issues and various train cancellations

Her verdict on the match was more complimentary. She thought Vicario did very well and that we should keep him and she liked the colour of Son's boots (although she kept getting him mixed up with Gray as he has the same ones)

For me, I was in awe of the new stadium, I can't get down there regularly enough to justify becoming a member but I'm hoping to go again at the next european game if they release them to the general peasants. It's a very different experience to when i was going every week in 80s/90s and early 2000s and there are pros and cons to the new 'sanitised' feel but overall I think I prefer it now to eating a burger made primarily of horse (probably) and wading through tinkle every time I needed the loo

Thought we did well after losing radu so early on but we could have easily been in a lot of trouble had they scored that open goal in the 1st half (unless he was offside?) or scored the pen at 2-0. Overall, take the 3 points and move on to Sunday

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

We could have drawn or lost. We were vulnerable at the back. We didn't play as well as we could have.

All of that is true and it's also true that we showed some good stuff, both with our play and with our mentality.

Might as well keep these two paragraphs in the draft file @braineclipse

 

[Raziel]

Sounds similar to my evening. I was playing in a house band at an open mic night. One telly in the far corner of the pub and I had a few chances to pop my head in.

Like the logistics, Ange had a mare. He picked 2 keepers on the bench and ignored some of the kids, then sacrificed fan fave Bergval to put teachers pet back in central defence after Dragusin got the red. It then sounds like we played terribly and were all over the place defensively, only for our 3 in 3 forward BJ and 2 in 2 striker Solanke to execute Ange's plan. We just went into full Ossie mode.

Makes me wonder what the score may have been if Ange had selected Forster.

Might watch the game later.

Onwards and upwards.

We didn't play terribly and this is classic Spurs narrative flimflam, we were lucky, we got away with it, we made bad team selections, yet somehow we won 3-0 against a team that gave a lot of big teams trouble last season in Europe.

Here's the facts
- Ange was able to completely rest Porro, Romero, Maddison, to give limited time (sub 45 mins) to Bentancur, Johnson, Deki (so 6 of our first 11, and it would have been 7 with Udogie only needed because of send off). So you could argue this was a B team
- We dominated the first half with 63% possession with 10 fudging men
- Ange changed tactics in 2nd half, the sub of Johnson for Deki showed we knew we would like need to fight/grind more
- The "big" chances they had was 1/A fudging soft penalty that they fudged up on, 2/One open shot at goal that they brick the bed on. We also had a 1:1 with Solanke and Johnson (where their keeper fudged up). So if we lived in a world where all chances were converted, the game would have been 5-2.
- We didn't play 10 high like against Chelsea, we simply didn't change our general model.
- Late in 2nd half, team tired, as expected.

Amazing no matter if Spurs wins (here) or loses (Leicester/Scum) somehow we are always brick ...

Truth
- We played a B team against a very experienced European opponent that made later stages of competition last year
- We were a man down 8 minutes into the game
- We scored 3 by pressing, by playing that aggressive game
- We kept a clean sheet with 10 men
- We did not withdraw and try to grind the game out, we continued to try to control/dominate the game

This is very much a job done game, keeps momentum, rested enough players to still be effective on week-end.

This should be a praised result, instead everyone seems bent on trying to prove we fluked it ..

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

We didn't play terribly and this is classic Spurs narrative flimflam, we were lucky, we got away with it, we made bad team selections, yet somehow we won 3-0 against a team that gave a lot of big teams trouble last season in Europe.

Here's the facts
- Ange was able to completely rest Porro, Romero, Maddison, to give limited time (sub 45 mins) to Bentancur, Johnson, Deki (so 6 of our first 11, and it would have been 7 with Udogie only needed because of send off). So you could argue this was a B team
- We dominated the first half with 63% possession with 10 fudging men
- Ange changed tactics in 2nd half, the sub of Johnson for Deki showed we knew we would like need to fight/grind more
- The "big" chances they had was 1/A fudging soft penalty that they fudged up on, 2/One open shot at goal that they brick the bed on. We also had a 1:1 with Solanke and Johnson (where their keeper fudged up). So if we lived in a world where all chances were converted, the game would have been 5-2.
- We didn't play 10 high like against Chelsea, we simply didn't change our general model.
- Late in 2nd half, team tired, as expected.

Amazing no matter if Spurs wins (here) or loses (Leicester/Scum) somehow we are always brick ...

Truth
- We played a B team against a very experienced European opponent that made later stages of competition last year
- We were a man down 8 minutes into the game
- We scored 3 by pressing, by playing that aggressive game
- We kept a clean sheet with 10 men
- We did not withdraw and try to grind the game out, we continued to try to control/dominate the game

This is very much a job done game, keeps momentum, rested enough players to still be effective on week-end.

This should be a praised result, instead everyone seems bent on trying to prove we fluked it ..

I think fans are still jittery about how 'open' the game is.

 

[Muttley]

We didn't play terribly and this is classic Spurs narrative flimflam, we were lucky, we got away with it, we made bad team selections, yet somehow we won 3-0 against a team that gave a lot of big teams trouble last season in Europe.

Here's the facts
- Ange was able to completely rest Porro, Romero, Maddison, to give limited time (sub 45 mins) to Bentancur, Johnson, Deki (so 6 of our first 11, and it would have been 7 with Udogie only needed because of send off). So you could argue this was a B team
- We dominated the first half with 63% possession with 10 fudging men
- Ange changed tactics in 2nd half, the sub of Johnson for Deki showed we knew we would like need to fight/grind more
- The "big" chances they had was 1/A fudging soft penalty that they fudged up on, 2/One open shot at goal that they brick the bed on. We also had a 1:1 with Solanke and Johnson (where their keeper fudged up). So if we lived in a world where all chances were converted, the game would have been 5-2.
- We didn't play 10 high like against Chelsea, we simply didn't change our general model.
- Late in 2nd half, team tired, as expected.

Amazing no matter if Spurs wins (here) or loses (Leicester/Scum) somehow we are always brick ...

Truth
- We played a B team against a very experienced European opponent that made later stages of competition last year
- We were a man down 8 minutes into the game
- We scored 3 by pressing, by playing that aggressive game
- We kept a clean sheet with 10 men
- We did not withdraw and try to grind the game out, we continued to try to control/dominate the game

This is very much a job done game, keeps momentum, rested enough players to still be effective on week-end.

This should be a praised result, instead everyone seems bent on trying to prove we fluked it ..

BTW, hope you realise my post above was sarcastic? When I read it back, it didn't look it !!!

As you say though, when these guys follow the tactical plan, they can get results. I did watch the extended highlights today. Some shocking defending from us and some equally poor finishing from them. All their chances, Davies was totally culpable with his positional sense and reading of the game. I'll keep banging this drum but that guy doesn't think or act like a centre half when it matters. Great to see the forwards convert 3 chances and for Spurs to go toe to toe with a man down. That was a herculean physical effort to play the Ange way in those circumstances.

Not sure why I'm reading that it wasn't a penalty though. Biss clearly kicked the man, before getting the ball on his second bite of the cherry.

 

[alekaras]

Not sure why I'm reading that it wasn't a penalty though. Biss clearly kicked the man, before getting the ball on his second bite of the cherry.

If you look at the replay, Bissouma puts his foot up and the Qarabag player raises his ever so slightly up and to his right and makes contact with Bissouma's. Bissouma then lowers his foot and cleanly gets the ball. So it's really the Qarabag player initiating the contact. I wouldn't even call this a soft pen; it was no pen at all.

 

[Raziel]

BTW, hope you realise my post above was sarcastic? When I read it back, it didn't look it !!!

As you say though, when these guys follow the tactical plan, they can get results. I did watch the extended highlights today. Some shocking defending from us and some equally poor finishing from them. All their chances, Davies was totally culpable with his positional sense and reading of the game. I'll keep banging this drum but that guy doesn't think or act like a centre half when it matters. Great to see the forwards convert 3 chances and for Spurs to go toe to toe with a man down. That was a herculean physical effort to play the Ange way in those circumstances.

Not sure why I'm reading that it wasn't a penalty though. Biss clearly kicked the man, before getting the ball on his second bite of the cherry.

I did realize, but my point was the narrative in general following this game is was way over the top.

fudging City/Arsenal can play dogbrick and scrape a 1-0 against some no name fudging side and get praised for getting the job done, being professional. We win a European game 3-0 with 10 men and the level of criticism, commentary is crazy.

Fact is, in the full game, they got a few extra chances because they had an extra man, entirely normal, but generally if you watch the whole match for large parts you wouldn't even realize we are a man down

 

[glasgowspur]

Off topic, @Gutter Boy ,stopped at tebay and had a steak pie, wife had chicken pie, very, very good so thanks for the tip .
Not so good was the 70 min detour because the m74 was shut both ways for 3 junctions because of an accident!

 

[Gutter Boy]

Off topic, @Gutter Boy ,stopped at tebay and had a steak pie, wife had chicken pie, very, very good so thanks for the tip .
Not so good was the 70 min detour because the m74 was shut both ways for 3 junctions because of an accident!

Good to hear the first part, not so much the second.

I often do a 300+ mile round trip to go to games, but an 800 miler, especially with the state of our roads, is really impressive. Im glad it was a particularly exciting game with a good result for you

 

[glasgowspur]

Good to hear the first part, not so much the second.

I often do a 300+ mile round trip to go to games, but an 800 miler, especially with the state of our roads, is really impressive. Im glad it was a particularly exciting game with a good result for you

I enjoy driving and that's how we travel for our hols, but doing it twice in a week and one return the day after the other was tough, especially with the traffic.
London to Manchester is just constant roadworks and the volume of traffic is nuts.
But it was worth it, we had a ball.

 

[Bullet]

In the history of football, when has a team gone down to 10 men after 7 minutes and held on for the win? Rarely. And to win 3-0? Never.




((Ignores that time City were 3 down and beat us 4-3 with 10 men, since that is totally different!))

 

[Roland Beurre]

My MoM is VdV, then Gray because he's only a tiddler

Vicario for me.

Gray had some nice interludes.

Biss made some very good interceptions but he's got the first touch of Mohamed Al Fayed. My dad always used to say I ran with the ball too far in front of me and after seeing Bissouma and on some occasions Udogie, I understand what he meant.

 

[Roland Beurre]

Very good on the ball, looks very comfortable. I wonder where he'll end up playing.

Madrid?