• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

OMT Spurs vs Antwerp

Man of the match

  • Total voters
    21
  • Poll closed .
awesome dawson said:
I refuse to vote for a MOTM based on that performance. Dreadful. It's a worry that we have the 'ability' to put in a performance like that on a regular basis. There's been a lot of talk about us winning this trophy. Embarrassing. We look so short of ideas up front sometimes. The lack of movement from Bale, Bergwjin, Vinicius, Alli was shocking. No doubt against Brighton we'll be a different entity but this really was a terrible performance. Barely created a decent chance against the 140th ranked team in Europe, we're 14th.
Click to expand...

It's funny because I thought Vinicius offered quite a lot in terms of movement. At least, he did try to make things happen, which is more than can be said of Bergwijn and Bale. All things considered, I kind of agree with Jenas' comments: in the first half, we tried to force that final pass but due to a solid defensive performance from the opposition and a general lack of understanding between our players, it just didn't happen.

We conceded a soft goal and after that, all the substitutions made us lose whatever shape the team was supposed to have. We created a few more chances that way, but we also conceded a lot more.

Basically, we're going through a rough patch probably partly because after the United game, other teams put more focus on negating our offensive threat and possibly because a couple of important players need a rest.
 
StephenH said:
Yes, I agree in theory, sadly ‘our’ Cup Squad look to be ill prepared and bereft of any form and confidence. Being the ‘second string‘ looks to have totally removed all spirit from those players.
Click to expand...

Come on, most of these guys aren't 'second string': Aurier has been used in important games, Bale is Bale, Lo Celso is a first team player... Sanchez, Davies, Reguilon and Winks have all been used regularly. The only second string players in the starting XI were Vinicius, Bergwijn and Dele and at least one of them doesn't see himself as a back-up player.
 
for all the talk of the scratch side that started, we ended the game with a very familiar 11, and they were still brick

if Jose leaves out everyone who was crap last night we've only got 5 players for Sunday, and two of those are keepers, well, one and a half
 
Mr Gogolak said:
Come on, most of these guys aren't 'second string': Aurier has been used in important games, Bale is Bale, Lo Celso is a first team player... Sanchez, Davies, Reguilon and Winks have all been used regularly. The only second string players in the starting XI were Vinicius, Bergwijn and Dele and at least one of them doesn't see himself as a back-up player.
Click to expand...
You may not consider them second string but they were a mish mash that looked a lot more like last season's team than this one and we all saw how that struggled without Kane and Son.

This season we've looked much stronger because we've added quality to the previous starting 11 as opposed to yesterday that was actually weaker than last year.
 
Mr Gogolak said:
Come on, most of these guys aren't 'second string': Aurier has been used in important games, Bale is Bale, Lo Celso is a first team player... Sanchez, Davies, Reguilon and Winks have all been used regularly. The only second string players in the starting XI were Vinicius, Bergwijn and Dele and at least one of them doesn't see himself as a back-up player.
Click to expand...

I bet many feel like they have been pushed out.
 
Bishop said:
You may not consider them second string but they were a mish mash that looked a lot more like last season's team than this one and we all saw how that struggled without Kane and Son.

This season we've looked much stronger because we've added quality to the previous starting 11 as opposed to yesterday that was actually weaker than last year.
Click to expand...

We'll see at the end of the season but I'm not sure Lamela is closer from the first team than Lo Celso. Bale is also arguably ahead of Moura, for instance.

However, I do agree with you that the main difference between now and last month is that Mourinho has made a lot more changes for midweek games. Changing so many players and so often has a price and I think we saw that yesterday, particularly in terms of attacking play. I'm not sure having five substitutions during the game really helped our cause, from that point of view.

In my opinion, you have to rely on individual quality when you want to rotate your squad that much (or have a formation and system all players are very familiar with). Unfortunately, nobody managed to make a difference on his own yesterday and we conceded a poor goal. Actually, I'm more worried about that goal, as it comes from a situation that happened twice in as many games, rather than the lack of attacking threat.
 
StephenH said:
I bet many feel like they have been pushed out.
Click to expand...

It goes without saying that you're entitled to your opinion but I really don't see where you're coming from here. It was a fairly important game and they did themselves no favours with that performance. Apart from Kane, Son, Lloris and Hojberg, I don't think anyone else has proven to be irreplaceable so far this season. Why would they feel pushed out?
 
Mr Gogolak said:
It goes without saying that you're entitled to your opinion but I really don't see where you're coming from here. It was a fairly important game and they did themselves no favours with that performance. Apart from Kane, Son, Lloris and Hojberg, I don't think anyone else has proven to be irreplaceable so far this season. Why would they feel pushed out?
Click to expand...
I don't agree with your comment that "no one did themselves any favours" The situation was not set up to do themselves any favours. I doubt that Mourinho will read too much into yesterday despite his comments, he knew the limitations of throwing together players who have barely played let alone together.
 
DeanoAustin said:
That’s the worry isn’t it. Jose said in the documentary, to Alli I think, that some players have great moments but big dips and the best players don’t have those sorts of dips (I paraphrase but I think that was the jist). That doesn’t just apply to Alli, it applies to Tottenham.

6-1 v United, 0-1 v Antwerp. fudge, we even do it within games, just look at West Ham.

Maybe it says more about me than Spurs but I was counting three points v Brighton. Now I’m riddled with doubt. The joy of Spurs where nothing is certain. It was ever thus...
Click to expand...

Always been the case with Spurs. You alluded to it with the Coventry final. We also ballsed up the league cup semi final against arsenal that same season by losing at home after winning the first leg at their place. We then preceded to lose the replay (also at home). We were in the hunt for the treble that year and went home pot less. Sound familiar?
 
Firstly i have to say Antwerp were a lot better then i thought they were, they were organised and you could see they had a structure which worked for them. However ( and i am sure some will disagree with this) i think our performance was probably our worst this season, not one of our players stood out and they looked way below their best. Its not very often that a whole team of players look poor but IMO all ours did last night. No MOM from me either.
 
braineclipse said:
Only real positive from this game is that it came in a tournament and at a time where the result can be repaired quite comfortably. If it can serve as a wake up call to some of our players, something to learn from, it might have been worth it.
Click to expand...

You may have a point there, we were so casual and seemed to be going through the motions and ALL the players deserve a kick up the arse.
 
StephenH said:
He’s right, what else could say!
He is close to ostracising quite a few players if he continues to manage via the media.
Click to expand...

What makes you think he's managing via the media?
A few press conferences with twenty minutes worth of quotes?
Offset that against the literal weeks that the players work with him as their manager behind closed doors with all sorts of instruction and conversation to which we are simply not privy...

It's like the blind men and the elephant
 
Yesterday's performance was slow, turgid and insipid and you got the distinct feeling that the game meant a lot more to an inferior opponent than it did to our players.

It's the sort of performance you'd look at with real fear that this is about to become the norm and that it will undo the recent positive signs. However, what I saw was just another typical away Europa League performance and it has encouraged me to look back at our our previous EL outcomes specifically in away games.

Prior to yesterday and since 2012-13 we have played 25 Europa League away games (of which four were qualifiers). Our record is:
PLD 25;
W9 (D Tblisi, Anzhi, Sheriff Tiraspol, Tromso, AEL Limassol, Asteras Tripoli, Qarabag, L Plovdiv, Shkendija)
D9 (Panathinaikos, Maribor, Lazio, Lyon, Basle, Benfica, Partizan Belgrade, Monaco, Fiorentina)
L7 (Inter, Dnipro, Besiktas, Fiorentina, Anderlecht, B Dortmund, Gent)

If you remove the Qualifiers then the record is P21 W5 D9, L7 - convert that into a PL season and we're narrowly avoiding relegation.

Remember how good we were as a team in 15/16 and 16/17 - we still didn't win or play well then in Europa.

Our results in the Champions League (away) games are quite similar - P17 W6 D6 L5 but of course the major variable is the quality of opponent faced.

I guess I had hoped that having come up against some of the best teams in the world in the Champions League since our last Europa adventure that we might be better equipped to deal with with even such modest opponent but the reality seems to be that our players just can't get up for Europa League games and if we come against with a competent, determined team who get a little luck along the way we're susceptible to a defeat.

The reality is however, that you can afford a couple of bad results and still comfortably get through the group. I've looked back at the last 5 seasons in The Europa League and analysed how well the 4 semi-finalists did in the group stages. Of the 20, 13 have competed in the Group Stage (the other 7 dropped out of the CL instead).

Only one of those 13 won all 6 group games (Eintracht Frankfurt) and on average teams record 13 pts. For reference our best ever group stage saw us record maximum 18 pts in the ill-fated AVB 2013-14 season.

I'm not in anyway justifying last nights performance just pointing out that it merely follows a long-standing pattern. I don't think there is any link between EL performances and Premier League performances. In hindsight, and perhaps this is more of an issue when playing away, there were too many changes and so the attack lacked any cohesion and synergy - by the time the cavalry was on Antwerp were able to manage the game tactically (which they did very well).

I have no doubt that we will progress from the group probably by winning all home games and drawing one or both away games. What we need to see though is a Champions League focus to the knock out stages.
 
Last edited:
GPRD81 said:
Yesterday's performance was slow, turgid and insipid and you got the distinct feeling that the game meant a lot more to an inferior opponent than it did to our players.

It's the sort of performance you'd look at with real fear that this is about to become the norm and that it will undo the recent positive signs. However, what I saw was just another typical away Europa League performance and it has encouraged me to look back at our our previous EL outcomes specifically in away games.

Prior to yesterday and since 2012-13 we have played 25 Europa League away games (of which four were qualifiers). Our record is:
PLD 25;
W9 (D Tblisi, Anzhi, Sheriff Tiraspol, Tromso, AEL Limassol, Asteras Tripoli, Qarabag, L Plovdiv, Shkendija)
D9 (Panathinaikos, Maribor, Lazio, Lyon, Basle, Benfica, Partizan Belgrade, Monaco, Fiorentina)
L7 (Inter, Dnipro, Besiktas, Fiorentina, Anderlecht, B Dortmund, Gent)

If you remove the Qualifiers then the record is P21 W5 D9, L7 - convert that into a PL season and we're narrowly avoiding relegation.

Remember how good we were as a team in 15/16 and 16/17 - we still didn't win or play well then in Europa.

Our results in the Champions League (away) games are quite similar - P17 W6 D6 L5 but of course the major variable is the quality of opponent faced.

I guess I had hoped that having come up against some of the best teams in the world in the Champions League since our last Europa adventure that we might be better equipped to deal with with even such modest opponent but the reality seems to be that our players just can't get up for Europa League games and if we come against with a competent, determined team who get a little luck along the way we're susceptible to a defeat.

The reality is however, that you can afford a couple of bad results and still comfortably get through the group. I've looked back at the last 5 seasons in The Europa League and analysed how well the 4 semi-finalists did in the group stages. Of the 20, 13 have competed in the Group Stage (the other 7 dropped out of the CL instead).

Only one of those 13 won all 6 group games (Eintracht Frankfurt) and on average teams record 13 pts. For reference our best ever group stage saw us record maximum 18 pts in the ill-fated AVB 2013-14 season.

I'm not in anyway justifying last nights performance just pointing out that it merely follows a long-standing pattern. I don't think there is any link between EL performances and Premier League performances. In hindsight, and perhaps this is more of an issue when playing away, there were too many changes and so the attack lacked any cohesion and synergy - by the time the cavalry was on Antwerp were able to manage the game tactically (which they did very well).

I have no doubt that we will progress from the group probably by winning all home games and drawing one or both away games. What we need to see though is a Champions League focus to the knock out stages.
Click to expand...
As I said to mates last night, we’re always brick in the Europa.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back