Nuno Espírito Santo - Sacked

[DubSpur]

I *think* (and I could be wrong here) our defensive system for set pieces is a mixture of man to man and zonal. It looks like we are leaving 2 or 3 defenders covering a zone and then other players to mark the players considered the opposition's best at attacking a set piece. I'd have to watch a few replays to see if this is correct but from my seat at the games that is how it has looked to me.

Yeah, I think it's 3 marking zonal across the 6 yard box and the others man to man. I'd prefer our best headers marking man to man and
others used for zonal.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Yeah, I think it's 3 marking zonal across the 6 yard box and the others man to man. I'd prefer our best headers marking man to man and
others used for zonal.

Yes - that's how it has looked to me from my seat at the games.... and it looks as though we are indeed doing the reverse of what you suggest in putting our 'best' headers of the ball as the zonal players. Typically though if playing this system then what Nuno is doing is the 'normal' thing. The zonal players should be the ones winning the ball in their zone. The markers job really is to just try to ensure that their opponent cannot get a clean header in. I suspect (as with anything) the system will take a while to bed in and become more successful as the players get more practice.

 

[Legohamster]

I *think* (and I could be wrong here) our defensive system for set pieces is a mixture of man to man and zonal. It looks like we are leaving 2 or 3 defenders covering a zone and then other players to mark the players considered the opposition's best at attacking a set piece. I'd have to watch a few replays to see if this is correct but from my seat at the games that is how it has looked to me.

Yeah, I think it's 3 marking zonal across the 6 yard box and the others man to man. I'd prefer our best headers marking man to man and
others used for zonal.

That’s how I see it as well, I do think there is a danger of overly complicating it - we have been bad at defending them and wide free kicks for a while, to me it makes sense to make it simpler ?

We seem to end up with one or two stupid match ups at a corner each game.

I don’t think the personal we have help either, we are not really a team of giants

 

[braineclipse]

I've asked for progress in the past repeatedly and recently, only fair to bring it up again when I'm seeing it.

Wolves game, accepting that they were poor from the start and made it easier for us than many teams will.

-5 (or more) real attacking channels most of the time. Front three + Alli getting way up there very consistently, that's four. One of the full backs or Ndombele joining in most of the time, sometimes 5, sometimes more, very rarely less. Good. 4 players can't be expected to create chances.

-Real creativity in midfield with Ndombele. Keeping creativity in midfield throughout (I realise that part of why that has been missing in the past was outside Nuno's control. Progress none the less.

-A willingness and intensity to our press when we did press. Still a way to go, but we spent less time standing off and allowing them to get easily down the flanks. Some of that is fine, but I like the ability to do other things too.

-Some tactical flexibility. When Traore came on Gil made a massive effort defensively down that side to help shut it down. Instead of sticking with the narrow and high front three we adapted, even adapted proactively instead of waiting for Davies to get ripped apart.

-More bravery and purpose on the ball. Not just Ndombele. Skipp came really close to losing the ball once or twice. Son did the same coming deeper once iirc. Romero seems at least willing to play with some risk. Tanganga did really well a couple of times (again, iirc). Still a way to go in our buildup play, but progress.

This is perhaps controversial. I applaud the error by Ndombele. I applaud the pass from Skipp to Ndombele. Both were "wrong", particularly in hindsight. But there's a chance there to break through a line of pressure, they tried instead of playing the backwards easy pass. It's a mistake, but I applaud us being willing to risk those mistakes instead of the alternative which is stale, boring, and just as risky in the end because the risk from not creating enough chances is real. Learn from it, hopefully make better decisions, but keep taking that risk.

Overall building on the positive first half against Chelsea. We won't face many teams harder to break down than that Chelsea team and we won't find many easier than that Wolves team. But against both we did well, much better. And we didn't let the Chelsea disappointment or result prevent us from trying more of that.

Trying this there will be mistakes, disappointments, poor results. But it's the way forward to me.

 

[braineclipse]

Yeah, I think it's 3 marking zonal across the 6 yard box and the others man to man. I'd prefer our best headers marking man to man and
others used for zonal.

Assuming this is new, some time to get used to it for the players should be expected?

It's a system that can work really well imo, but it requires a lot from players usually not that often in those difficult man marking situations. Happy enough to see us stick with it, but probably requires more work to be done.

 

[Bishop]

-More bravery and purpose on the ball. Not just Ndombele. Skipp came really close to losing the ball once or twice. Son did the same coming deeper once iirc. Romero seems at least willing to play with some risk. Tanganga did really well a couple of times (again, iirc). Still a way to go in our buildup play, but progress.

This is perhaps controversial. I applaud the error by Ndombele. I applaud the pass from Skipp to Ndombele. Both were "wrong", particularly in hindsight. But there's a chance there to break through a line of pressure, they tried instead of playing the backwards easy pass. It's a mistake, but I applaud us being willing to risk those mistakes instead of the alternative which is stale, boring, and just as risky in the end because the risk from not creating enough chances is real. Learn from it, hopefully make better decisions, but keep taking that risk.

That's exactly the approach has had wherever he's gone. Total encouragement for the passing game and accepts that sometimes errors will happen.

Do we want to be a progressive passing side or not? If we want to play exciting daring football then sometimes mistakes will be made and they might be costly ones.

Or we can revert to the cautious risk averse Mourinho mould. I know which approach I prefer.

 

[DubSpur]

Assuming this is new, some time to get used to it for the players should be expected?

It's a system that can work really well imo, but it requires a lot from players usually not that often in those difficult man marking situations. Happy enough to see us stick with it, but probably requires more work to be done.

I've no prob with the system, zonal marking leads to less goals. The prob is using players that can't win headers to man mark.
Nuno is probably still learning what players can do what, so will give him time to make changes. We've also a number of small
players so it doesn't help with corners.

 

[braineclipse]

I've no prob with the system, zonal marking leads to less goals. The prob is using players that can't win headers to man mark.
Nuno is probably still learning what players can do what, so will give him time to make changes. We've also a number of small
players so it doesn't help with corners.

When using this system, more zonal for your bigger and stronger players, others do the man marking. That's bound to leave you with mismatches when one of the bigger players doesn't get to the duel/ball, no? Alli or Ndombele will end up in that duel with Silva or Dendoncker sometimes, that's the system.

Those players have to do more, not necessarily to win the header, but to get tough enough into the duel to avoid a clear header at goal. Or to prevent the opposition from getting a good run up. It's a rather specific skill, one that may take time to get better at. But certainly possible to get better at.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I've no prob with the system, zonal marking leads to less goals. The prob is using players that can't win headers to man mark.
Nuno is probably still learning what players can do what, so will give him time to make changes. We've also a number of small
players so it doesn't help with corners.

The idea is that the players man marking shouldn't need to win headers. The zonal players should come and win any ball in their zone. Balls that are outside of their zones shouldn't be balls that are considered to be in a dangerous area.

 

[parklane1]

Whatever system we are using i would hope we never put Tanguy in the posistion to defend a corner. His actions for their first goal was kids stuff. I would rather he stayed up the pitch.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Whatever system we are using i would hope we never put Tanguy in the posistion to defend a corner. His actions for their first goal was kids stuff. I would rather he stayed up the pitch.

I think you put him and son up form a corner
That way the oppo have to keep 3 guys back as a minimum
That actually makes the box easier to defend as it’s less crowded

 

[Bullet]

The idea is that the players man marking shouldn't need to win headers.

They need to push and gouge and trip and bite and elbow and if all else fails and they cannot head the ball, head the attacker in the nose.

Dele and Ndombele were like grass in the wind. They need to pull down the shorts of the attacker, grab his winkle and sprint to the half way line, giving him a 40 yard weener. Or fall over and accidentally trip the runner. They don't need to win the header.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

I don't like watching us play, I have no idea what nuno stands for but I know I don't like it.

We will go out of the conference league when the Europe league teams drop down into it. GHod hope we get a proper coach next year. Before anyone calls me knee jerk, this style of football is so 2005. It does not win you anything.

 

[GGyid]

Nuno hasn't a clue, Ali & Ndombele in midfield??

He won't last long....

 

[Gazza]

None of this is knee jerk... we have been lucky this season in every game that we have won and dreadfully exposed by average to good teams.

This side reminds me of spurs in the 90's

 

[spurs' magna carter]

He looks like he's about to cry.

I actually feel sorry for him. A team that looks promising on paper but is dog sh!t on the pitch.

Welcome to wonderful World of Levy's frugal spending Nuno

 

[billyiddo]

We look like the side of the last 2 years without a motivated Kane to bail us out

 

[glasgowspur]

No spirit or sanity.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

I think the guys in trouble.

 

[Crab.C.Nesbitt]

I think the guys in trouble.

Big time! Thing is our problems run much deeper than just the manager