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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

Gazza Dazzla said:
It wasn’t an anonymous leak, but Rose broke ranks in 2 consecutive summers.
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I almost prefer that, because it was mind-numbingly stupid. And as such, no one looked bad but him, and it can be dealt with very easily. It's almost better than a sinister attempt at undermining and influencing through journo leaks without having the guts to front up with your opinion in public.
 
The other thing I don't really understand with that whole tiredness thing is that the conditioning plan Poch and Perez put in place is the same this year as it would be every other year, and all of the players will know the advantages it has given them. I can't really understand why a player or three suddenly wants to use it as an excuse for poor performances. (and to argue for days off during a losing run!!)

Unless they are making the point that the World Cup means it needs to be different this year, which is perhaps fair. But Poch is rotating with this in mind. The only person he hasn't rotated is Kane, who wouldn't be the one complaining. After Euro 2016, everyone was saying the same thing. Kane was knackered, he started the season poorly, he needed a rest. Then he turned into the absolute machine we all know.

It just doesn't make sense. It feels like an agent stirring something. That way The Times can still say they have a source, and maybe an agent has told them a few players are getting tired and need rest. If it is a player, it is just very surprising and very...stupid.
 
“If we put the ball in the air, and we are going to fight for the ball, we are going to lose. Every time the team played well, kept possession and play in the way that we want to play, we were close to winning. We are not a team that can play fighting like Atletico Madrid, who are so comfortable playing deeper, going on counterattack and when it is 1-0, and in the last five minutes they’re impossible to penetrate.”


It has taken Atletico years to play like they play. A possession team like Tottenham cannot change that way overnight. To even try that would be to betray years of hard work to get to this point, and even worse, it would betray the convictions of Spurs players and staff.

“[Atletico] have experience playing like this. We are a team who are comfortable in possession, in the opposition half. That is the team we have, the players we have, and how the squad is. It is impossible to change. To change that is to change your identity, and it will be so tough to win games in a different way. The teams plays how we feel. I don’t feel to play like Atletico do. We feel different, and cannot translate a different idea. Sometimes you lose but in general, after four years, we have more positives trying to play and develop our ideas.”

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...nham-hotspur-playing-philosophy-a8548476.html
 
NaijaSpurs said:
“If we put the ball in the air, and we are going to fight for the ball, we are going to lose. Every time the team played well, kept possession and play in the way that we want to play, we were close to winning. We are not a team that can play fighting like Atletico Madrid, who are so comfortable playing deeper, going on counterattack and when it is 1-0, and in the last five minutes they’re impossible to penetrate.”


It has taken Atletico years to play like they play. A possession team like Tottenham cannot change that way overnight. To even try that would be to betray years of hard work to get to this point, and even worse, it would betray the convictions of Spurs players and staff.

“[Atletico] have experience playing like this. We are a team who are comfortable in possession, in the opposition half. That is the team we have, the players we have, and how the squad is. It is impossible to change. To change that is to change your identity, and it will be so tough to win games in a different way. The teams plays how we feel. I don’t feel to play like Atletico do. We feel different, and cannot translate a different idea. Sometimes you lose but in general, after four years, we have more positives trying to play and develop our ideas.”

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...nham-hotspur-playing-philosophy-a8548476.html
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Obviously Poch is amazing, but I do wish he wasn’t quite so ideologically obsessed about playing out from the back in every single moment of every single game... I think a little more flexibility and pragmatism could go a long way, in terms of occasionally being prepared (in all senses of the word) to defend deep and counter.

I also don’t like that playing out from the back seems to have superseded pressing as our core identity, especially as the former often seems to make the latter impossible (how can we press in the opponents’ half when we constantly have the ball in our own half, with them pressing us?!)

Especially as I think we don’t necessarily have players who are all perfectly suited to playing out from the back, but do seem to have players who are perfectly suited to pressing.
 
elltrev said:
Obviously Poch is amazing, but I do wish he wasn’t quite so ideologically obsessed about playing out from the back in every single moment of every single game... I think a little more flexibility and pragmatism could go a long way, in terms of occasionally being prepared (in all senses of the word) to defend deep and counter.

I also don’t like that playing out from the back seems to have superseded pressing as our core identity, especially as the former often seems to make the latter impossible (how can we press in the opponents’ half when we constantly have the ball in our own half, with them pressing us?!)

Especially as I think we don’t necessarily have players who are all perfectly suited to playing out from the back, but do seem to have players who are perfectly suited to pressing.
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That lack of pragmatism at this stage could be the undoing of Poch; Guardiola with his endless financial/player resources might be able to afford to be very stubborn but Poch cannot imo.

He has actually shown himself to be pragmatic/adjust, e.g. games away at the Emirates most years, games vs vs Dortmund and even more recently (not THAT recently) vs Liverpool so i wonder if he's just given this response to deflect a little bit and not let the players lose focus and the main way he wants them to play when possible. I think he WILL change things when he has to but just will do it on HIS own timetable lol
 
It was a complaint from Southampton fans I know that he never had a plan b. Though I think a lot of managers who are a success with mid to top level sides might be accused of that. As someone said above, Guardiola can probably get away with it.
 
BrainOfLevy said:
If anyone has access to The Times article, it would be good to get that posted here.

It’s incredibly disappointing, as I’m sure it’s been sourced from one of our players - unless they have just taken massive liberty with the fact that the squad stayed in the new lodge after the Inter game. But to confidently say that some of our players have complained, that’s the kind of article we’ve never actually seen written under Poch because there are usually no leaks.

I’d also wonder which player it is - it’s not gonna be Kane. It’s not gonna be Son, who’s just talked about wanting to get back playing and doesn’t worry about fatigue. Trippier and Toby just got rested so it can’t be them. Rose, Davies and Aurier have all been rotated. Wanyama isn’t playing. Winks is just coming back. Dembele and Dier have been rested and rotated in games this season. Dele and Sissoko have been injured. Moura has been rotated and must be delighted to be finally playing. Ditto Lamela.

That leaves Eriksen. And to be honest, having just gone through the the squad, it makes no sense that it could be any one of them. So I’m going to choose to believe their source is an agent causing trouble :) the knives always come out for the club in crisis and this week it is our turn.
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Lucky we haven't got a player who can't keep his fudging mouth shut in front of the press, isn't it?


Oh.
 
NaijaSpurs said:
“If we put the ball in the air, and we are going to fight for the ball, we are going to lose. Every time the team played well, kept possession and play in the way that we want to play, we were close to winning. We are not a team that can play fighting like Atletico Madrid, who are so comfortable playing deeper, going on counterattack and when it is 1-0, and in the last five minutes they’re impossible to penetrate.”


It has taken Atletico years to play like they play. A possession team like Tottenham cannot change that way overnight. To even try that would be to betray years of hard work to get to this point, and even worse, it would betray the convictions of Spurs players and staff.

“[Atletico] have experience playing like this. We are a team who are comfortable in possession, in the opposition half. That is the team we have, the players we have, and how the squad is. It is impossible to change. To change that is to change your identity, and it will be so tough to win games in a different way. The teams plays how we feel. I don’t feel to play like Atletico do. We feel different, and cannot translate a different idea. Sometimes you lose but in general, after four years, we have more positives trying to play and develop our ideas.”

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...nham-hotspur-playing-philosophy-a8548476.html
Click to expand...

The full quotes from this presser, where he talks about the players not playing in the correct tempo out from the back against Liverpool, and not the correct tempo at the front against Inter, are concerning to me. You'd think that the advantage of keeping a settled squad would be that they all know the best way to play and get the best out of themselves and the system, and to hear that a backline of Toby, Jan, Rose and Trippier felt too nervous / lacked the confidence to play out from the back against Liverpool just does not feel right. If they don't know when to ramp it up and ramp it down after 4 years, what are they doing?
 
elltrev said:
Obviously Poch is amazing, but I do wish he wasn’t quite so ideologically obsessed about playing out from the back in every single moment of every single game... I think a little more flexibility and pragmatism could go a long way, in terms of occasionally being prepared (in all senses of the word) to defend deep and counter.

I also don’t like that playing out from the back seems to have superseded pressing as our core identity, especially as the former often seems to make the latter impossible (how can we press in the opponents’ half when we constantly have the ball in our own half, with them pressing us?!)

Especially as I think we don’t necessarily have players who are all perfectly suited to playing out from the back, but do seem to have players who are perfectly suited to pressing.
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Top post. I want us to get back to the high press. It used to be our strongest card. Playing out from the back is too AVB - like for my liking. Possession for the sake of it is mind numbingly boring.
 
glorygloryeze said:
That lack of pragmatism at this stage could be the undoing of Poch; Guardiola with his endless financial/player resources might be able to afford to be very stubborn but Poch cannot imo.

He has actually shown himself to be pragmatic/adjust, e.g. games away at the Emirates most years, games vs vs Dortmund and even more recently (not THAT recently) vs Liverpool so i wonder if he's just given this response to deflect a little bit and not let the players lose focus and the main way he wants them to play when possible. I think he WILL change things when he has to but just will do it on HIS own timetable lol
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Could equally be the other way around. We have phrases like To Dare is to Do, The Game is about Glory and Not Waiting for the Other Lot to Die of Boredom emblazened all over the place so maybe Poch's reluctance to adopt a more tactically cautious approach is because he's wary that Daniel would not suffer anything that smacks of negative tactics for too long.

To lose whilst playing adventurous attacking football is one thing, to suffer defeat despite what might be seen as boring anti-football would be quite another.
 
BrainOfLevy said:
The full quotes from this presser, where he talks about the players not playing in the correct tempo out from the back against Liverpool, and not the correct tempo at the front against Inter, are concerning to me. You'd think that the advantage of keeping a settled squad would be that they all know the best way to play and get the best out of themselves and the system, and to hear that a backline of Toby, Jan, Rose and Trippier felt too nervous / lacked the confidence to play out from the back against Liverpool just does not feel right. If they don't know when to ramp it up and ramp it down after 4 years, what are they doing?
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I've yet to see a defence that plays relaxed in front of a keeper they're not used to. That becomes significantly worse when trying to play out from the back with a keeper glued to his line as you lose the only line of defence from behind you.

Vorm is a decent backup keeper, he's just a terrible backup Lloris because their styles are so different. I'd say that lack of confidence makes up much of the issue.
 
scaramanga said:
I've yet to see a defence that plays relaxed in front of a keeper they're not used to. That becomes significantly worse when trying to play out from the back with a keeper glued to his line as you lose the only line of defence from behind you.

Vorm is a decent backup keeper, he's just a terrible backup Lloris because their styles are so different. I'd say that lack of confidence makes up much of the issue.
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I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I always assumed Vorm was a good back up for us because he played under Brendan at Swansea, very much a play it from the back team.

Maybe Vorm just needs games to get up to speed, but I’d expect the experience of Toby and Jan especially to be confident to play the system they’ve been in for 4 years.
 
Pirate55 said:
Top post. I want us to get back to the high press. It used to be our strongest card. Playing out from the back is too AVB - like for my liking. Possession for the sake of it is mind numbingly boring.
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I think Poch is aligned there. Other quotes today show he knows the players have been slacking slightly, and that Dyche at Burnley is suffering a similar problem. Our players and Burnley’s are still running a lot, compared to the opposition, but it isn’t enough. Our success is built on running a lot more. And I think Poch was wary of it, and that’s the difficulty with experienced players vs younger ones. Maybe they think they are good enough to not have to do it, and that actually makes me calmer...because Poch has identified they were slacking slightly and is thankful for the wake up call because it backs up his point.

I think either our current first teamers will step up because they’ve had the wake up call, or we’ll see something similar to when Bentaleb and Mason got the call. Purging the older players and giving guys like Amos a chance. We were much improved against Inter, so hopefully we are on the right track. The good thing about Poch is that he always sees the issues, and so far over his tenure he’s corrected it every single time. We’ve never gotten so far into the pit of despair that he loses his influence.
 
BrainOfLevy said:
I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I always assumed Vorm was a good back up for us because he played under Brendan at Swansea, very much a play it from the back team.

Maybe Vorm just needs games to get up to speed, but I’d expect the experience of Toby and Jan especially to be confident to play the system they’ve been in for 4 years.
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I am surprised people still aren’t seeing the problems with Toby these days mate...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
 
metalgear said:
so the players are tired. but it was to be expected wasn't it? like months ago, and not something to realise just now!
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Always thought this would be a tough season, thought we might have got away with it if we moved into the new stadium, the adrenalin from that seeing us through.
but fate has conspired against us this year.
 
thfcsteff said:
I am surprised people still aren’t seeing the problems with Toby these days mate...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
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Interesting that we defend shambolically whether Toby is in or out of the defence. It suggests a systemic problem. I really am deluded enough to believe we can win a trophy this season but we need to to tighten up at the back to grind out results. Liverpool fans have become insufferable. Would love them to crash and burn.
 
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