ITK Thread

[JerusalemMan]

Talk of Wharton wanting Liverpool and Liverpool wanting Wharton but both somehow happy to wait a year for it to happen which is an amazing coincidence because presumably Wharton and Liverpool haven’t had any direct communication yet,

I think we can all trust that Palace would have been notified of and happily approved any such communications.

 

[HarryBreadbap]

Two perspectives:

Paulina is a 35m saving on MGW. Cash we put towards another signing. And probably addresses an area of the pitch we need more (in fact I think we’d play MGW in CM anyway). We already have Maddison, Kulu (and Kudus) for AM and all are more technically gifted though not as hard working. So save the 35m and address an area we need more strength in.

Vs


Paulina isn’t what he was in his lambasting days at Fulham. Injury prone, a bit burnt out and not much different Hojberg. His passing isn’t up to scratch but he is a great destroyer if fit. Why use almost half of the MGW money on him, when longer term we’d be far better off signing the 24/5 year old MGW who has a higher ceiling and could be an awesome CM? MGW is combative and can tackle. When he gets the ball he uses it quickly. He can pass and dribble, and chips in with goals arriving into the box. So would probably be a better long term option in CM.


Which would you go for?

"Paulina is a 35m saving on MGW"

They are completely different players.

Paulina has played an average of forty games a season over the past five seasons, he was out injured for just eleven days last season, so "injury prone" isn't true.

He returned from a seventy day major injury in November 2024, after sustaining a muscle injury after a poor tackle on him, so two injuries in three seasons (one not on his fault). For a player in his position not a terrible injury record.

Frank isn't buying MGW who's primary role will be to defend, we have Bentancur, Bissouma, Gray, and Bergvall cover for that.

 

[SpurMeUp]

"Paulina is a 35m saving on MGW"

They are completely different players.

They are. But can’t see us signing both and MGW isn’t a classic AM, he is a bit more in the mould of a CM. Combative, good longer balls out etc.

Paulina has played an average of forty games a season over the past five seasons, he was out injured for just eleven days last season, so "injury prone" isn't true.

Fair enough. But at 30 with what he’s put his body through he is going to breakdown more frequently now. His game is about being combative and going into challenges. Plus you know our luck with injuries!

He returned from a seventy day major injury in November 2024, after sustaining a muscle injury after a poor tackle on him, so two injuries in three seasons (one not on his fault). For a player in his position not a terrible injury record.

Are any your fault?

Frank isn't buying MGW whose primary role will be to defend, we have Bentancur, Bissouma, Gray, and Bergvall cover for that.

I think the days of just defending or just attacking in midfield are outdated now. A DM should chip in with assists and goals. And an AM needs to be able to tackle and harry as well.

 

[Lilbaz]

They are. But can’t see us signing both and MGW isn’t a classic AM, he is a bit more in the mould of a CM. Combative, good longer balls out etc.

Fair enough. But at 30 with what he’s put his body through he is going to breakdown more frequently now. His game is about being combative and going into challenges. Plus you know our luck with injuries!

Are any your fault?

I think the days of just defending or just attacking in midfield are outdated now. A DM should chip in with assists and goals. And an AM needs to be able to tackle and harry as well.

Bentancur and bissouma are both in the last year of their contracts.
Would you swap?

 

[HarryBreadbap]

They are. But can’t see us signing both and MGW isn’t a classic AM, he is a bit more in the mould of a CM. Combative, good longer balls out etc.

Fair enough. But at 30 with what he’s put his body through he is going to breakdown more frequently now. His game is about being combative and going into challenges. Plus you know our luck with injuries!

Are any your fault?

I think the days of just defending or just attacking in midfield are outdated now. A DM should chip in with assists and goals. And an AM needs to be able to tackle and harry as well.

"Plus you know our luck with injuries!"

Mainly due to the previous manager who's history is renowned for driving players into the ground, see the Scottish Record where even he admitted that when he was at Celtic.

His long term injury was not through training, some injuries happen in training, it wasn't a tackle he made. I thought that would be pretty clear.

Every team has a DM, that usually play with a couple of AM's. It is a specified position in a game of football.

Gallagher played 33 games last season for Madrid, 3 goals 3 assists as a DM

Baena an AM scored 7, 9 assists in 32 games.

One player a DM and the other an AM two completely different players.

"Just defending or attacking in midfield is outdated"

I think you are way off the mark on that assumption.

 

[Bishop]

"Plus you know our luck with injuries!"

Mainly due to the previous manager who's history is renowned for driving players into the ground, see the Scottish Record where even he admitted that when he was at Celtic.

His long term injury was not through training, some injuries happen in training, it wasn't a tackle he made. I thought that would be pretty clear.

Every team has a DM, that usually play with a couple of AM's. It is a specified position in a game of football.

Gallagher played 33 games last season for Madrid, 3 goals 3 assists as a DM

Baena an AM scored 7, 9 assists in 32 games.

One player a DM and the other an AM two completely different players.

"Just defending or attacking in midfield is outdated"

I think you are way off the mark on that assumption.

Gallagher did NOT play DM for Athletico. He was a dual 8. De Paul played DM a lot more often than Gallagher did.

 

[Gazza]

The point is, that there is more to look at in a transfer than the transfer fee.

My point is that the calculations are way off

 

[Lilbaz]

My point is that the calculations are way off

Hark at gauss here.

Do you think he's worth £100m?

Transfermarkt has him at €45m.

Adam Wharton - Player profile 25/26

Adam Wharton, 21, from England ➤ Crystal Palace, since 2023 ➤ Defensive Midfield ➤ Market value: €45.00m ➤ * Feb 6, 2004 in Blackburn, England

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

Palace can ask for whatever price they want. Then it's if someone is willing to pay it.

 

[SpurMeUp]

"Plus you know our luck with injuries!"

Mainly due to the previous manager who's history is renowned for driving players into the ground, see the Scottish Record where even he admitted that when he was at Celtic.

His long term injury was not through training, some injuries happen in training, it wasn't a tackle he made. I thought that would be pretty clear.

Every team has a DM, that usually play with a couple of AM's. It is a specified position in a game of football.

Gallagher played 33 games last season for Madrid, 3 goals 3 assists as a DM

Baena an AM scored 7, 9 assists in 32 games.

One player a DM and the other an AM two completely different players.

"Just defending or attacking in midfield is outdated"

I think you are way off the mark on that assumption.

Your own figures back up the assumption. Gallagher created 3 goals and scored 3 himself, he does more than just defend.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Bentancur and bissouma are both in the last year of their contracts.
Would you swap?

Bissouma yes. And that is possible: we offload Biss and bring in Paulinha.

There is that back of your mind question tho: what could Bissouma be with a clear structure and good coaching? The attributes are mostly there with Bissouma. But the consistency isn’t. His passing is possibly slightly better than Paulina’s. He’s able to run and harry like him too when focused. And Bissouma can be better on the ball and has ability to carry the ball which isn’t used to much effect atm.

Bissouma signing a new contract and us landing GW would be my preferred setup - if Frank feels there is a talent he can mould in Bissouma. If he doesn’t then Paulina or more likely a younger player in their mid20s would be good.

 

[DubSpur]

Your own figures back up the assumption. Gallagher created 3 goals and scored 3 himself, he does more than just defend.

The fact that he's a CM and not a DM you'd expect him to do more than just defend.

 

[SpurMeUp]

The fact that he's a CM and not a DM you'd expect him to do more than just defend.

Do you think Frank uses the Football Manger template to position his players? Or a blank piece of paper and plots players where he wants them on the pitch in different phases?

The idea of a DM who just sits in front of the back 4 is not as dynamic as actual games where in different situations you may swap positions with another CM, or be used to arrive late into the box etc ideally you have players who can support attack and defence as needed. It makes for a more robust side, for instance if chasing a lead. You don’t have to have to sub the “DM” or more defensive midfielder. You need them to be able to help attack at times. Likewise an AM should be able to help defend a lead.

 

[DubSpur]

Do you think Frank uses the Football Manger template to position his players? Or a blank piece of paper and plots players where he wants them on the pitch in different phases?

The idea of a DM who just sits in front of the back 4 is not as dynamic as actual games where in different situations you may swap positions with another CM, or be used to arrive late into the box etc ideally you have players who can support attack and defence as needed. It makes for a more robust side, for instance if chasing a lead. You don’t have to have to sub the “DM” or more defensive midfielder. You need them to be able to help attack at times. Likewise an AM should be able to help defend a lead.

Of course he does and players will sit in exactly that position for the whole game

There will be a midfielder who is more defensive than the others. In possession they will push further up the field as will the defence but they will still be the deepest of the midfielders. Likewise if we are defending the CMs and forwards will be back defending, but won't be the deepest players, unless they are tracking a runner.

 

[parklane1]

Of course he does and players will sit in exactly that position for the whole game

There will be a midfielder who is more defensive than the others. In possession they will push further up the field as will the defence but they will still be the deepest of the midfielders. Likewise if we are defending the CMs and forwards will be back defending, but won't be the deepest players, unless they are tracking a runner.

Indeed, its the one posistion we really need to fill this window. We do have a few talented midfield players but not one of them has the mentality of a GOOD dm player.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Your own figures back up the assumption. Gallagher created 3 goals and scored 3 himself, he does more than just defend.

Palhinha got 4 goals and 1 assist in the PL in his previous season at Fulham

 

[SpurMeUp]

Palhinha got 4 goals and 1 assist in the PL in his previous season at Fulham

Bissouma should score a few more. He has the talent. But just doesn’t seem to put it together. Paulinha would be a good signing but not one Levy will relish with no sell-on.

Also begs the question: what’s the future for Sarr, Bergvail and Grey?

Some Easter Eggs for Bullet in there

 

[Bishop]

Do you think Frank uses the Football Manger template to position his players? Or a blank piece of paper and plots players where he wants them on the pitch in different phases?

The idea of a DM who just sits in front of the back 4 is not as dynamic as actual games where in different situations you may swap positions with another CM, or be used to arrive late into the box etc ideally you have players who can support attack and defence as needed. It makes for a more robust side, for instance if chasing a lead. You don’t have to have to sub the “DM” or more defensive midfielder. You need them to be able to help attack at times. Likewise an AM should be able to help defend a lead.

Sure but Gallagher was never their deepest midfielder or the man tasked with a primarily defensive role, so whilst I agree with you in principle he's really more of the same as what we already have. Players competent across a number of areas but none who actually excel defensively. Variety is good but at some point you actually want someone who is great at doing a specific task.

 

[Bishop]

Hark at gauss here.

Do you think he's worth £100m?

Transfermarkt has him at €45m.

Adam Wharton - Player profile 25/26

Adam Wharton, 21, from England ➤ Crystal Palace, since 2023 ➤ Defensive Midfield ➤ Market value: €45.00m ➤ * Feb 6, 2004 in Blackburn, England

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

Palace can ask for whatever price they want. Then it's if someone is willing to pay it.

He's too expensive for us. Our money would be better spent getting a cheaper DM (Ederson, Rios, Palhina, Hackney, Hujmund, Baleba etc) and also getting a striker imo.

I don't really think any DM is worth 100m and whilst Wharton is very talented I don't see 100m in either tbh.

 

[Lilbaz]

He's too expensive for us. Our money would be better spent getting a cheaper DM (Ederson, Rios, Palhina, Hackney, Hujmund, Baleba etc) and also getting a striker imo.

I don't really think any DM is worth 100m and whilst Wharton is very talented I don't see 100m in either tbh.

I've never said we should pay £100m for wharton. I've not said we should go for him.
I was pointing out that the transfer fee is not everything. You have to take into account wages and how old they are.

 

[Gutter Boy]

He's too expensive for us. Our money would be better spent getting a cheaper DM (Ederson, Rios, Palhina, Hackney, Hujmund, Baleba etc) and also getting a striker imo.

I don't really think any DM is worth 100m and whilst Wharton is very talented I don't see 100m in either tbh.

Rios has signed for Benfica