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Harry Winks

the goat said:
thought today he did turn and run with the ball (unlike the normal backward/sideward passing) but once he run with the ball he then stopped and looked around instant of passing forward and making defenders turn towards their own goal
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Who was he meant to pass too

no fudger moved today

we kept on playing the same tune.... pass wise, cross, pass wide, cross... pass backwards, pass wide and cross

I saw about 3 time’s chances for him to pass clever but tricky passes and he took the safe option as he isn’t riding high on confidence

but the whole team was poor

Toby was atrocious
Jan was treading water
Dele was really poor
Where is the criticism of them??
 
To sort the Winks and Sissoko type issues we need to replace some of these players with some real quality! Not the normal ‘useful lads from the academy’.
They are both doing their best and I won’t knock them for that!
Basically Levy needs to spend on quality reinforcements! Along with a quality right back and a fit replacement for Dire!
 
StephenH said:
To sort the Winks and Sissoko type issues we need to replace some of these players with some real quality! Not the normal ‘useful lads from academy’.
They are both doing their best and I won’t knock them for that!
Basically Levy needs to spend on quality reinforcements! Along with a quality right back and a fit replacement for Dire!
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Bedfordspurs said:
Who was he meant to pass too

no fudger moved today

we kept on playing the same tune.... pass wise, cross, pass wide, cross... pass backwards, pass wide and cross

I saw about 3 time’s chances for him to pass clever but tricky passes and he took the safe option as he isn’t riding high on confidence

but the whole team was poor

Toby was atrocious
Jan was treading water
Dele was really poor
Where is the criticism of them??
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Dele did OK today scored and kept plugging away
 
Bedfordspurs said:
he was awful and should have been off after 50 minutes

guy made so many basic errors

reality is Poch bottled it and is tying to force him into some form it seems
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The old favouritism that means you score a hatrick in a CL semi-final and still get benched for other underperforming players who have played brick for a couple of months in the final...
 
glorygloryeze said:
The old favouritism that means you score a hatrick in a CL semi-final and still get benched for other underperforming players who have played brick for a couple of months in the final...
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maybe that’s the issue
He will always play kane And Hugo but their the constants
Everyone else maybe less so
 
StephenH said:
Sorry disagree totally - he is exactly what is missing from the team “fight”!
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when he is playing well I’d agree
Today he was woeful
I’m not anti Alli but he offered nothing and wouldn’t have had a goal if the Var had done their job or Foster had before hand
 
I'm normally a stalwart Winks fan and tbh the 352 didn't work for us but I do think that he is not the answer in his current role. He got skinned a couple of times getting too tight and on another time got dribbled past with ease, I think he would've been more exposed today had Watford chosen to attack us after the 6th minute.

One other thing that I hadn't noticed until I watched him live is the difference between him and N'Dombele. When Winks uses the wide players he passes to feet, which is so fudging slow and easy to defend against. I used to think it was because the fullbacks were starting too deep, but the first time N'Dombele got the ball and played in Aurier he passed into space and made Aurier go after the ball, take it in his stride and cross. He did this 2-3 times and it really bought some urgency to our play.
 
Cochise said:
I'm normally a stalwart Winks fan and tbh the 352 didn't work for us but I do think that he is not the answer in his current role. He got skinned a couple of times getting too tight and on another time got dribbled past with ease, I think he would've been more exposed today had Watford chosen to attack us after the 6th minute.

One other thing that I hadn't noticed until I watched him live is the difference between him and N'Dombele. When Winks uses the wide players he passes to feet, which is so fudging slow and easy to defend against. I used to think it was because the fullbacks were starting too deep, but the first time N'Dombele got the ball and played in Aurier he passed into space and made Aurier go after the ball, take it in his stride and cross. He did this 2-3 times and it really bought some urgency to our play.
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We've not had a manager since Harry that played into space, it's all to feet. Wtf is that
 
Cochise said:
I'm normally a stalwart Winks fan and tbh the 352 didn't work for us but I do think that he is not the answer in his current role. He got skinned a couple of times getting too tight and on another time got dribbled past with ease, I think he would've been more exposed today had Watford chosen to attack us after the 6th minute.

One other thing that I hadn't noticed until I watched him live is the difference between him and N'Dombele. When Winks uses the wide players he passes to feet, which is so fudging slow and easy to defend against. I used to think it was because the fullbacks were starting too deep, but the first time N'Dombele got the ball and played in Aurier he passed into space and made Aurier go after the ball, take it in his stride and cross. He did this 2-3 times and it really bought some urgency to our play.
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This is the point I was making previously. Centre mid is more than pass completion. You can literally make other players do what you want by the nature of the pass you play. Too many of his are to feet or worse put the receiver under immediate pressure.
 
I like Winks and i believe he is a important player for us going forward, unfortunately in his posistion a lot of the work he does goes unnoticed. I remember when SP first broke into our team the same criticisms were thrown at him but as he progressed we began to understand how important he was to the team.
 
glasgowspur said:
We've not had a manager since Harry that played into space, it's all to feet. Wtf is that
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It's indirectly about the manager it's much more about the players. Under Harry we had Modric in CM and VDV slightly ahead both had fabolous vision and the technique to pull off the eye of the needle pass. Since Modric and VDV we haven't really had that.

Yes Eriksen is a good playmaker maybe even great but he's no a through ball playing dynamo and you can't expect that from any of the players who have played CM for us since. None of them and I mean none them have any vision or creativity.

Now the question is why has Poch not added this quality before when it was so obviously lacking, I feel it's because he hadnt been able to sign a high quality player for player for the role and so instead went for defensive solidity in the likes of Dembele, Dier and Wanyama. He does now seem to have seen this needed addressing and we have signed Ndombele who just naturally plays those passes.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Fapatalk
 
Bishop said:
It's indirectly about the manager it's much more about the players. Under Harry we had Modric in CM and VDV slightly ahead both had fabolous vision and the technique to pull off the eye of the needle pass. Since Modric and VDV we haven't really had that.

Yes Eriksen is a good playmaker maybe even great but he's no a through ball playing dynamo and you can't expect that from any of the players who have played CM for us since. None of them and I mean none them have any vision or creativity.

Now the question is why has Poch not added this quality before when it was so obviously lacking, I feel it's because he hadnt been able to sign a high quality player for player for the role and so instead went for defensive solidity in the likes of Dembele, Dier and Wanyama. He does now seem to have seen this needed addressing and we have signed Ndombele who just naturally plays those passes.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Fapatalk
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can you name any players currently who play like you describe other than Ndombele who certainly wasn’t that kind of player in France
 
Bedfordspurs said:
can you name any players currently who play like you describe other than Ndombele who certainly wasn’t that kind of player in France
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I'm not sure if I understand the question, but players like Tielemans, Paredes, Partey and Moutinho are a recent few who spring to mind, to start off quick interplay. Passes into space help that momemtum more so than passes to feet, its so much easier to pull your opporents out of position when you play around them. I'm very positive with the Ndombele move. Its something I've felt we've needed throughout Poch's reign, the missing ingrediant if you will, but he certainly played the ball into space in France, thats why we went for him. A change of plan due to the end of an era.
 
Bishop said:
I'm not sure if I understand the question, but players like Tielemans, Paredes, Partey and Moutinho are a recent few who spring to mind, to start off quick interplay. Passes into space help that momemtum more so than passes to feet, its so much easier to pull your opporents out of position when you play around them. I'm very positive with the Ndombele move. Its something I've felt we've needed throughout Poch's reign, the missing ingrediant if you will, but he certainly played the ball into space in France, thats why we went for him. A change of plan due to the end of an era.
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Tielemans was invisible vs us. He is decent but IMO not the kind of player your talking about. More a box to box type
Can’t comment on the others TBH as I’ve never seen them play at a decent level I think
 
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