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Glasgow Rangers

Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Conference clubs will next week discuss plans to invite Rangers into the fifth tier of English football.

Clubs from the Blue Square Bet Premier will join lower level counterparts from the Conference North and South on Monday for a mid-season review.

And chairman Brian Lees has admitted that last week’s vow by Charles Green to flit south will be on the agenda after 18 of his member clubs expressed tentative support for the idea.

Unhappy with the proposals for a restructuring of the Scottish leagues to a 12-12-18, Green said last week: ‘I could join the Conference and I would be in a higher league than I’m in. It doesn’t matter to me. If the only option is to go into England and start at the lowest level I believe Rangers fans would support that.’

Admitting the idea also has some support amongst his own clubs if the resistance of the footballing authorities can be navigated, Lees responded: ‘On Monday we have a mid-season meeting of clubs and that could be a topic for conversation.

‘Obviously it is up to clubs to make rule changes. But there are one or two problems.

‘First of all it’s a FIFA issue in terms of moving from one country to another.

‘The second thing - and probably the most important - is the problem it would create with promotion and relegation. There would be an uneven number.

Rangers are 19 points clear at the top of the Scottish Third Division - but the proposed restructure means they wouldn't be promoted

‘It would be wrong, also, if the Football League would not take Rangers if they came into the Conference as part of our promotion and relegation system.

‘They would therefore be in the Conference and I’m sure they would like the opportunity eventually to go higher in the pyramid.

‘These are not insurmountable problems. But you would have to have the co-operation of a lot of different people and organisations to make it possible.’

UEFA have recently sanctioned a cross border female league in Belgium and Holland, prompting Green to threaten a sex discrimination case against the governing body if they block his desire to quit Scotland.

Welsh club Wrexham are currently top of the Blue Square Bet Premier, prompting Lees to adopt an open mind to the concept of Scottish clubs bolstering his competition’s financial clout.

‘Any application would be judged on its merit,’ he said. ‘What happens in Europe is one thing and different to what happens here.

‘The Football League is involved in football in England and Wales.

‘So there is a precedent there. And Berwick Rangers play football in Scotland, so there is another precedent.

‘(Rangers) fans are also an attraction in a way, because of the higher level of football and facilities and so on.

‘Last weekend, for example, Rangers had 44,000 and there were a few hundred at the other games.

‘But at our grounds, of course, you have an average of around 6000.’

The cost of travel for non-league clubs could be a potential drawback, while police authorities would also have a say.

Suggesting Rangers themselves could help to ease the path to agreement should they wish to apply, however, Lees added: ‘Guernsey play in England and they cover the costs of the travel for their opponents.

‘So it’s not insurmountable, but it’s a case of where there is a will there is a way.

‘It is exciting, but we have promotion and relegation and the opportunities which might be denied could be a problem.’


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2262755/Rangers-eye-place-English-Conference-Charles-Green-protest-SFL-restructure.html

Rangers are 19 points clear at the top of the Scottish Third Division - but the proposed restructure means they wouldn't be promoted

Yes they would! They'd be in the third tier, as opposed to the fourth tier they're currently in.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Can the Conference do this? They have arrangements with the Football League and their feeder leagues on promotion and relegation. Can they just bring them in unilaterally. If they can, why not petition the Football League or Premier League for a quicker route?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Interesting that most pro leagues in North America are able to cope with clubs from two different nations. The NBA, NHL, MLB, MLS and pro lacrosse all feature cross-border play between the US and Canada. Teams make buckets of money and each nation has it's own sporting identity in football or Olympic games. Even with Canadians celebrating the 200th anniversary of their victory in the War of 1812 over the Americans - and the burning of the White House in Washington - fans still seem to get along fine for the most part.

Perhaps it would be a good thing for Rangers to leave Scotland. Take them out of that festering sectarian sports situation for a while and see how their fans behave with the focus on football, not religion. Make their participation in conference play conditional on fans conduct. There's always a swagger to fans of big clubs, but give them a few years wandering in the wilderness, well clear of any achievement worth bragging about, and you might see the Big Billy Boys attitude diffuse.

If the Premier League is the be-all-and-end-all attraction that draws fans, one can hardly say it's because of the thrills created by Wigan or Reading or Norwich or, bless 'em, even West Ham (unless it's a derby with Millwall).They're all decent, respectable clubs who create the odd flutter now and then. It's the big clubs that create the sustained buzz. Yet even amongst the top clubs, the polarization of the league is growing between so-called 'real clubs' and those living off the avails of a benevelont billionaire. Adding a real club, or two, who can help redress the imbalance currently being created by Chelsea or City isn't a bad thing and the possible presence of two Scottish clubs should give the league no more of a problem than the presence of Swansea or Cardiff.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Except there is more prospect of them competing for European places. As someone pointed out earlier, the Welsh clubs in the league are in competition for the "English" places. if it was just the PL, then it shouldn't be a problem, like the American franchises, but Europe complicates things.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Interesting that most pro leagues in North America are able to cope with clubs from two different nations. The NBA, NHL, MLB, MLS and pro lacrosse all feature cross-border play between the US and Canada. Teams make buckets of money and each nation has it's own sporting identity in football or Olympic games. Even with Canadians celebrating the 200th anniversary of their victory in the War of 1812 over the Americans - and the burning of the White House in Washington - fans still seem to get along fine for the most part.

Perhaps it would be a good thing for Rangers to leave Scotland. Take them out of that festering sectarian sports situation for a while and see how their fans behave with the focus on football, not religion. Make their participation in conference play conditional on fans conduct. There's always a swagger to fans of big clubs, but give them a few years wandering in the wilderness, well clear of any achievement worth bragging about, and you might see the Big Billy Boys attitude diffuse.

If the Premier League is the be-all-and-end-all attraction that draws fans, one can hardly say it's because of the thrills created by Wigan or Reading or Norwich or, bless 'em, even West Ham (unless it's a derby with Millwall).They're all decent, respectable clubs who create the odd flutter now and then. It's the big clubs that create the sustained buzz. Yet even amongst the top clubs, the polarization of the league is growing between so-called 'real clubs' and those living off the avails of a benevelont billionaire. Adding a real club, or two, who can help redress the imbalance currently being created by Chelsea or City isn't a bad thing and the possible presence of two Scottish clubs should give the league no more of a problem than the presence of Swansea or Cardiff.

would they allow Mexican teams?

i can'tr speak for any other sport, but the MLS is developing and both Canada and the US are trying (and doing a very good job) to develop the sport of "soccer" in these two countries.

i makes sense for them to join together.

England is not - England has a rich footballing heritage, built by the clubs in the pyramid, from the bottom to the top.
This is an agenda being pushed by Rangers for Rangers benefit, nothing else.
And for that reason alone we should tell them no - the English leagues are not their get out clause and it would be an insult to the team lower down the pyramid if Rangers were let in anywhere above the bottom league.

I also don't think we should be actively encouraging clubs that have a clear disregard for the equality of the sporting contest to be accepted into our league. If Ranger had not cheated in Scotland this issue would not currently be being discussed, Rangers would still be in the same two horse race they have been in since Fergie left Aberdeen
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Can the Conference do this? They have arrangements with the Football League and their feeder leagues on promotion and relegation. Can they just bring them in unilaterally. If they can, why not petition the Football League or Premier League for a quicker route?

I see no reason why not, if the relevant football authorities give their approval.

But the Football League don't have to play ball. They could presumably deny Rangers the chance of promotion to League Two.

And even if the FL did play ball, then the Premier League could still deny Rangers the ultimate promotion.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

if anything, Merthyr should be the case Rangers cite
Merthyr Tydfill FC were dissolved in 2010 and relaunched as Merthyr Town. As a totally new club they were still admitted into an English lge, even though they are welsh based.

hhhmmmmm, that does rather change the argument as they is so recent.
would the FL or PL let them in?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Interesting that most pro leagues in North America are able to cope with clubs from two different nations. The NBA, NHL, MLB, MLS and pro lacrosse all feature cross-border play between the US and Canada. Teams make buckets of money and each nation has it's own sporting identity in football or Olympic games. Even with Canadians celebrating the 200th anniversary of their victory in the War of 1812 over the Americans - and the burning of the White House in Washington - fans still seem to get along fine for the most part.

Perhaps it would be a good thing for Rangers to leave Scotland. Take them out of that festering sectarian sports situation for a while and see how their fans behave with the focus on football, not religion. Make their participation in conference play conditional on fans conduct. There's always a swagger to fans of big clubs, but give them a few years wandering in the wilderness, well clear of any achievement worth bragging about, and you might see the Big Billy Boys attitude diffuse.

If the Premier League is the be-all-and-end-all attraction that draws fans, one can hardly say it's because of the thrills created by Wigan or Reading or Norwich or, bless 'em, even West Ham (unless it's a derby with Millwall).They're all decent, respectable clubs who create the odd flutter now and then. It's the big clubs that create the sustained buzz. Yet even amongst the top clubs, the polarization of the league is growing between so-called 'real clubs' and those living off the avails of a benevelont billionaire. Adding a real club, or two, who can help redress the imbalance currently being created by Chelsea or City isn't a bad thing and the possible presence of two Scottish clubs should give the league no more of a problem than the presence of Swansea or Cardiff.

Oh, yes it is!

It would be a very bad thing. Bad for the English clubs that compete for trophies and European places. Bad for the English clubs that are just about hanging on to Premier League survival. Bad for the lower league, English clubs that aspire to make it to the Premier League.

Because, let's face it, if Rangers joined, so would Celtic.

Hell, why not also invite Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Juventus, AC and Inter Milan, Ajax, Porto, Benfica and Paris St Germain to join the Premier League as well? Then, as well as a minority of English players, we might have a minority of English clubs in the PL too.

Seriously, I cannot fathom how anyone who has a love for Spurs (or any other Premier League club, for that matter) would want to make it so much more difficult for the club to win trophies or to compete for Champions League places. We're straining every sinew just to get a sniff of success as it is.

Thankfully, it's not going to happen any time soon, if ever. Premier League chairmen made that abundantly clear when they recently unanimously rejected any notion of Celtic and Rangers eventually joining the Premier League.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Not sure jimmy. There's only a problem because Rangers are a big club? I would suggest they would be an exciting addition to the PL, and would replace a mid level team as opposed to any of the upper half, from 5th downwards. If it was a small side, the conditions already exist and teams cross the borders.

I wouldn't automatically assume Celtic would join either. Surely any case to be made is down to the rather special circumstances rangers are in, which dosnt apply to Celtic. Ok, pressure would be applied to Celtics case but if they win the argument, why hold them back?

Adebayor isn't straining every sinew, and a fair chunk of our support isn't either! Kick up the arse is what's needed
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Not sure jimmy. There's only a problem because Rangers are a big club? I would suggest they would be an exciting addition to the PL, and would replace a mid level team as opposed to any of the upper half, from 5th downwards. If it was a small side, the conditions already exist and teams cross the borders.

I wouldn't automatically assume Celtic would join either. Surely any case to be made is down to the rather special circumstances rangers are in, which dosnt apply to Celtic. Ok, pressure would be applied to Celtics case but if they win the argument, why hold them back?

Adebayor isn't straining every sinew, and a fair chunk of our support isn't either! Kick up the arse is what's needed

Rangers' "special circumstances" are only special because they cheated every other Scottish club for years, defaulted on payments to myriad creditors and were consequently and correctly demoted (or, rather, Newco were). They should now be compensated - nay, rewarded? I don't think so.

And yes, mate, I happily concede that self interest lies at the heart of my objection - even if it isn't the only compelling reason. Rangers and Celtic might only be mid table clubs were they to join the Premier League now. But give them Premier League money, Premier League exposure, Premier League commercial clout and, no mistake, they would soon become massive threats not only to us but to every other club in the Premier League. Turkeys voting for Christmas if the Old Firm were ever allowed in.

I don't get this fascination with "big games". If that's what it's all about, then let's forget about parochial national leagues altogether. Let's waste no time and set up a European Super League immediately. Me? I like games against the smaller clubs. Sometimes, they're easier to enjoy. They certainly present different challenges. And, far more important than all of that, those clubs deserve to be where they are. They earned it. They don't deserve to have it taken away from them by two undeserving clubs that don't belong in English football. I'm from a generation that grew up believing in the romance of football. There's less and less of it about these days. Let's not dispense with yet more of it.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

I want Spurs to play in the most competitive and high profile league in the world. That mantle has slipped to La Liga and slowly to Bundesliga as well.

Going by Jimmy's argument, we should only aim to make Europa each year and not worry about Champions League, seeing as its easier. I'm assuming Jimmy would be in favor of Man U, Arsenal, City, Chelsea being expelled from the league, seeing as it means we'd be favorites to win the league then?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

I want Spurs to play in the most competitive and high profile league in the world. That mantle has slipped to La Liga and slowly to Bundesliga as well.

Going by Jimmy's argument, we should only aim to make Europa each year and not worry about Champions League, seeing as its easier. I'm assuming Jimmy would be in favor of Man U, Arsenal, City, Chelsea being expelled from the league, seeing as it means we'd be favorites to win the league then?

Facetiousness aside, fella, you couldn't be more wrong. It's precisely because I do want Spurs to compete in the Champions League that I don't want clubs like Rangers and Celtic making that task all the more difficult.

Don't confuse not wanting to make life unnecessarily difficult with wanting to make it meaninglessly easier. Two very different things.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Sorry I just can't see the difference. Surely if you don't want something to be harder, then you'd take whatever opportunity to make it easier.

Better to fail aiming high and all that. I'd back us to beat Rangers and Celtic more often than not.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Sorry I just can't see the difference. Surely if you don't want something to be harder, then you'd take whatever opportunity to make it easier.

Better to fail aiming high and all that. I'd back us to beat Rangers and Celtic more often than not.

Celtic and Rangers funded by Scottish tv money, yes.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

C'mon jimmyb, there's some lower-level clubs that really don't belong in the top flight, or at least to stay long once they get there. Wigan was cute at first, but now it's kind of sad looking at their half-full house most weeks. It always looked shabby seeing lots of empty seats in Bolton or Blackburn. So much for history, with their fans.

There's a charm to visiting quaint, smaller grounds and that can continue in cup play, but the business of sport is demanding that clubs direct themselves into bigger and more modern stadia to stay competitive in the league. Similarly, the PL wants to see this happen because they wish to keep pushing the value of their TV contract higher, to say nothing of fielding the strongest possible sides in order to maintain four teams in Champions League play.

This is a cycle that can't be reversed. There aren't that many new free stadia to offer as upgrades, such as Emirates Marketing Project has received or West Ham will. The simplest way is to add an already established club with a top notch, high-capacity ground and a large market to support them. Rangers-Saudi Sportswashing Machine would be far more compelling viewing for neutral viewers, anywhere in the world, than say, Reading-Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

Let Rangers give it a go from the bottom tier. Make their presence contingent on strict codes of conduct by their fans. It will bring a lot of fizz to the lower ranks for a while. By the time they're ready for admittance to the Premier League, we'll all have had a chance to see how they've behaved and how the logistics work. If it's clear they've got something to add, then upward and onward. If not, then the deal's undone.

How Celtic's situation would be handled is anyone's guess. Same run up the same ladder would be fair. Maybe a year or two after Rangers just to keep the two sides apart for a while.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

C'mon jimmyb, there's some lower-level clubs that really don't belong in the top flight, or at least to stay long once they get there. Wigan was cute at first, but now it's kind of sad looking at their half-full house most weeks. It always looked shabby seeing lots of empty seats in Bolton or Blackburn. So much for history, with their fans.

There's a charm to visiting quaint, smaller grounds and that can continue in cup play, but the business of sport is demanding that clubs direct themselves into bigger and more modern stadia to stay competitive in the league. Similarly, the PL wants to see this happen because they wish to keep pushing the value of their TV contract higher, to say nothing of fielding the strongest possible sides in order to maintain four teams in Champions League play.

This is a cycle that can't be reversed. There aren't that many new free stadia to offer as upgrades, such as Emirates Marketing Project has received or West Ham will. The simplest way is to add an already established club with a top notch, high-capacity ground and a large market to support them. Rangers-Saudi Sportswashing Machine would be far more compelling viewing for neutral viewers, anywhere in the world, than say, Reading-Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

Let Rangers give it a go from the bottom tier. Make their presence contingent on strict codes of conduct by their fans. It will bring a lot of fizz to the lower ranks for a while. By the time they're ready for admittance to the Premier League, we'll all have had a chance to see how they've behaved and how the logistics work. If it's clear they've got something to add, then upward and onward. If not, then the deal's undone.

How Celtic's situation would be handled is anyone's guess. Same run up the same ladder would be fair. Maybe a year or two after Rangers just to keep the two sides apart for a while.


I'd rather watch Reading.

At least then i'll know it's a club who haven't abandoned their own league to come where the money is.
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

The reason we have to put up with some "lesser" clubs in the PL is the mismanagement of the bigger ones. How do you think the likes of Forest, Wednesday, Leeds etc. feel about yet another club to compete with in their quest for promotions?
 
Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

Or where the sport and competition is? I'm sure Rangers and Celtic are bored playing in their small pond.
 
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Re: O/T - Glasgow Rangers go into adminstration

The reason we have to put up with some "lesser" clubs in the PL is the mismanagement of the bigger ones. How do you think the likes of Forest, Wednesday, Leeds etc. feel about yet another club to compete with in their quest for promotions?

I agree to certain extent, but didn't Leeds do a Rangers to land themselves in their particular predicament?
 
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