Giovani Lo Celso

[Lilbaz]

Rules were set before
Not new
So I’d be of the view you knew what could happen before you made the decision. Punishment should stand

This isn't just about this international break though. We have breaks in oct, nov, jan, feb and march. No way are european clubs just accept losing their players for 10-15 games. This will go to court unless fifa comes up with an alternative. Play the games in a non redlist country.

As for the rules fifa changed the rules, it was that players didn't have to go to red list countries. That changed in august.

Uefa today threatened to boycott the world cup if it is held 2 years. This is a massive power struggle for the future of football.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/s...-boycott-World-Cup-takes-place-two-years.html

 

[Bedfordspurs]

This isn't just about this international break though. We have breaks in oct, nov, jan, feb and march. No way are european clubs just accept losing their players for 10-15 games. This will go to court unless fifa comes up with an alternative. Play the games in a non redlist country.

As for the rules fifa changed the rules, it was that players didn't have to go to red list countries. That changed in august.

Uefa today threatened to boycott the world cup if it is held 2 years. This is a massive power struggle for the future of football.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/s...-boycott-World-Cup-takes-place-two-years.html

Every country has dog fee net red list rules
We have countries on red for example that others don’t
What they should do is not have the competition

 

[Lilbaz]

Every country has dog fee net red list rules
We have countries on red for example that others don’t
What they should do is not have the competition

That's the thing. Brazil and some other countries wanted to cancel the copa america to avoid this but were told no. Now we have to play the world cup qualifiers in the football season when they should have already been played.

There is no way that fifa will not have the world cup. It is their main source of income.

If fifa enforce the ban then the clubs will probably appeal to cas. Then everything could be on the table.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

That's the thing. Brazil and some other countries wanted to cancel the copa america to avoid this but were told no. Now we have to play the world cup qualifiers in the football season when they should have already been played.

There is no way that fifa will not have the world cup. It is their main source of income.

If fifa enforce the ban then the clubs will probably appeal to cas. Then everything could be on the table.

Yep
FIFA want their $$
The players want the medals
And clubs need their players
Something has to give
And it won’t be governments IMO

 

[Lilbaz]

Yep
FIFA want their $$
The players want the medals
And clubs need their players
Something has to give
And it won’t be governments IMO

If not in a neutral country play the games next summer. Postpone the world cup a year.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

If not in a neutral country play the games next summer. Postpone the world cup a year.

Can’t argue with that
You won’t get a country both sides are happy with

 

[Lilbaz]

Can’t argue with that
You won’t get a country both sides are happy with

Everyone loves iceland.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Everyone loves iceland.

Just mums

 

[Jurgen the German]

Jurgen, it is all down to African countries have been shat upon by FIFA which was dominated by European countries.

Up until 1978 the continent of Africa still had only 1 representative to the WC. African countries then had to fill the void by playing the Nations Cup every two years. Playing it every 2 years is a tradition, and we do not intend to drop it just because it irritates Europeans after they shafted us for years with regards to WC places.

Jurgen, if clubs do not like it they should not buy African players. It is not like clubs are not aware that the tournament exists.

I still fail to see why it has to be held in the middle of the season, every 2 years. Like I said, I can’t think of any other tournament that is held so frequently. South America don’t get as many places in the World Cup as European nations but they don’t host the Copa America every 2 years, note it has been played more frequently in the last 10 years but my understanding is they have done so to align it to fall on the same year as the euros, which makes sense and is practical. Europe gets more places at world cups because we are have most of the best teams in the world. They could always give less spots to European nations but that would mean a more watered down competition IMO.

EDIT: CAF actually gets more places at the World Cup than South America, Africa gets 5 teams, SA gets 4.5

 

[Lilbaz]

I still fail to see why it has to be held in the middle of the season, every 2 years. Like I said, I can’t think of any other tournament that is held so frequently. South America don’t get as many places in the World Cup as European nations but they don’t host the Copa America every 2 years, note it has been played more frequently in the last 10 years but my understanding is they have done so to align it to fall on the same year as the euros, which makes sense and is practical. Europe gets more places at world cups because we are have most of the best teams in the world. They could always give less spots to European nations but that would mean a more watered down competition IMO.

It's held in the middle of the season (winter) because summer in africa gets a bit warm. As for why every 2 years, money.

Think the whole international calendar will be relooked at, especially if this goes to cas.

 

[Jurgen the German]

It's held in the middle of the season (winter) because summer in africa gets a bit warm. As for why every 2 years, money.

Think the whole international calendar will be relooked at, especially if this goes to cas.

But our summer time is their winter.

 

[Lilbaz]

But our summer time is their winter.

Only for southern africa. North africa it will be summer (with heat from the Sahara), which is the majority of the continent.

 

[RunTMC]

I still fail to see why it has to be held in the middle of the season, every 2 years. Like I said, I can’t think of any other tournament that is held so frequently. South America don’t get as many places in the World Cup as European nations but they don’t host the Copa America every 2 years, note it has been played more frequently in the last 10 years but my understanding is they have done so to align it to fall on the same year as the euros, which makes sense and is practical. Europe gets more places at world cups because we are have most of the best teams in the world. They could always give less spots to European nations but that would mean a more watered down competition IMO.

EDIT: CAF actually gets more places at the World Cup than South America, Africa gets 5 teams, SA gets 4.5

I agree that it probably should be held every 4 years but the reality on the ground is that it would be a hard sell for CAF for a couple of reasons:

1. It's been held every 2 years for a really long time now and there are genuine fears and concerns that moving it to a 4 year now would considerably impede the development of African football. A development that's already behind the curve and slow enough a it is. But it is making progress, the quality of the football in the tournament now is 10X better than it was 20 years ago. It was a bit of a joke really. But it's come on leaps and bounds recently but there's still a long way to go and there's a reluctance to slow that down. To your point about 5 teams in the WC, i don't think Africa has earned the right to have that many. And i'm saying that as an African. But i'm happy about it. Fifa did that to promote football in the continent and it's working.

2. The second reason for a 2 year cycle is just pure economics. Club football in Africa needs the revenues generated from the tournament to survive. Gate receipts are simply not enough. Whilst we love our football, we prefer to eat and stay alive. Lots of poverty an economic struggles and football is a luxury we can't afford to spend money on. But when it come to ACON time everyone goes crazy and come out to support their national team. A nice boost that takes people away from their struggles.

Perhaps FIFA could do more around looking at the distribution of funds to remove the financial need for it to be every 2 years. But with these things it's never an easy decision. Giving more here means giving less somewhere else. So for now we'll have to live with it being every 2 years i'm affraid

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I agree that it probably should be held every 4 years but the reality on the ground is that it would be a hard sell for CAF for a couple of reasons:

1. It's been held every 2 years for a really long time now and there are genuine fears and concerns that moving it to a 4 year now would considerably impede the development of African football. A development that's already behind the curve and slow enough a it is. But it is making progress, the quality of the football in the tournament now is 10X better than it was 20 years ago. It was a bit of a joke really. But it's come on leaps and bounds recently but there's still a long way to go and there's a reluctance to slow that down. To your point about 5 teams in the WC, i don't think Africa has earned the right to have that many. And i'm saying that as an African. But i'm happy about it. Fifa did that to promote football in the continent and it's working.

2. The second reason for a 2 year cycle is just pure economics. Club football in Africa needs the revenues generated from the tournament to survive. Gate receipts are simply not enough. Whilst we love our football, we prefer to eat and stay alive. Lots of poverty an economic struggles and football is a luxury we can't afford to spend money on. But when it come to ACON time everyone goes crazy and come out to support their national team. A nice boost that takes people away from their struggles.

Perhaps FIFA could do more around looking at the distribution of funds to remove the financial need for it to be every 2 years. But with these things it's never an easy decision. Giving more here means giving less somewhere else. So for now we'll have to live with it being every 2 years i'm affraid

Would it be better than having a bigger event every 4 years may give comparable or better returns money wise? I doubt it as the cash flow is probably needed more frequently

 

[RunTMC]

Would it be better than having a bigger event every 4 years may give comparable or better returns money wise? I doubt it as the cash flow is probably needed more frequently

That's exactly right. They need the frequent cashflow or clubs will quickly start to struggle badly. They wouldn't be able to stay afloat for long

 

[Legohamster]

Everyone loves iceland.

Baku it is.

 

[Finney Is Back]

how shortsighted, if I was a player in that position, being treated like that, I'd be retiring from international football immediately

you can't fudge with peoples day job

That might make getting a new work-permit difficult for the players when they have their next transfer (and that's before you consider the fact that playing international football is lucrative for Brazilian players from a sponsorship perspective).

 

[braineclipse]

how shortsighted, if I was a player in that position, being treated like that, I'd be retiring from international football immediately

you can't fudge with peoples day job

In short, yes you can.

Every international break causes more problems for most clubs compared to players staying back. Would be better to stay, train with the team, recover from minor injuries, get some rest from games, avoid new injuries, long travels, jetlag etc.

There are exceptions, players benefitting from getting match fitness, change of scenery if in a difficult situation with the club. But every international break fudges with people's day jobs. That's how football works if you're at this level.

This fudges with it even more, that's true. But this too seems rather obviously within FIFA regulations. That's what decides what players, clubs and leagues can and can't do. Regardless of if we want the regulations to be different.

 

[Finney Is Back]

The players didn't report back to the club after the international break (at least they won't till they've finished quarantine). Breaching their contracts so can be fined.

Sounds as though the club agreed to Lo Celso and Romaro going for the first two games and knew they would have to quarantine upon return. There should be no fines levied and I'm sure will be no fines levied.

 

[braineclipse]

The players didn't report back to the club after the international break (at least they won't till they've finished quarantine). Breaching their contracts so can be fined.

I'm not a lawyer and obviously don't have access to their contracts, but I imagine it's quite a bit more complicated than that.

The club and players obviously agreed that they would report to training in Croatia rather than full in room isolation in the UK.

If they're fined I think it will be over the manner in which they left. Lack of confirmation from the club that they could go is what's being reported. But does the club have the right to not allow them to go? I imagine that too is more complicated. FIFA have said that the clubs couldn't refuse them from going.

Just hope a better solution is found for the next set of fixtures.