Yeah don’t think Sissoko or Ndombele cover themselves in glory either. Though to be fair Sissoko was more focused on Sterling, who’d found a bit of space to potentially shoot, and Ndombele was no.10 at that point, so arguably not really his job to track opposing no. 10s into his own box.
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Eric Dier
- Thread starter Jordinho
- Start date
Yeah don’t think Sissoko or Ndombele cover themselves in glory either. Though to be fair Sissoko was more focused on Sterling, who’d found a bit of space to potentially shoot, and Ndombele was no.10 at that point, so arguably not really his job to track opposing no. 10s into his own box.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Sadly, Sissoko is also woefully out of position in relation to the move and completely fails to track the runner jogging into that giant hole.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
I don’t think that is Sissoko’s fault at all, he is looking at the danger which is Sterling. Lamela is not tracking his man, but Dier is the main culprit allowing that huge hole between him and his fellow defenders into which Gundogan runs into.
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
So 3 men trying to stop 1 man passing and none of them Are successful... and the main culprit is the man furthest away in that image (no idea how it all panned out from that)
Could be argued why did the other CB go out that far when there were men there already
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
I went back and looked at the goal again
Sterling runs across our area and is tracked by dier then Sanchez is both force him wide. He passes to Fidel who gives it back as Tanganga is with him. Sanchez carries on trying to get near sterling but doesn’t get close and Gungidan literally walks through the midfield with Tanguy watching, sissoko leaving him behind (sissoko had tracked his run twice before that) and Hojdjerg being too far back.
Hojdjerg and Dier both go to him too late
And lamela is staring at it all too waiting for the ball I guess
it Took them 3 seconds and two passes to take so many players out of the game because they were static and not switched on
this is stealing to goodness before the return, and we have 7 men in the area with Davies and Dier talking to Hojdjerg to leave Jesus I assume (based on where Hojdjerg ends up next)
Gungodan well on his well now to receive the ball and look at who is still in the same spot from a Spurs perspective (tanguy, Dier and Davies). If sissoko hadn’t gone to the ball he would have been able to block the pass or the passing line but then Gungodan may have gone in front of him
and finally just before burying it past Hugo. Again look who hasn’t moved to see who was switched on ...
Hojdjerg made up a lot of ground to get across there and would have been in a great place if he hadn’t been tracking Jesus earlier. Dier moved across to try and block
Tanguy, same place, sissoko, same place, Japhet and Sanchez same place but turned now
I’m assuming in all of this the gap that people talk about between Dier and Sanchez is there because when Sanchez tracks Sterling there were 4 Spurs players going to our right and 2 city players. I’d say that’s decent odds to defend as long as your switched on.
Sterling runs across our area and is tracked by dier then Sanchez is both force him wide. He passes to Fidel who gives it back as Tanganga is with him. Sanchez carries on trying to get near sterling but doesn’t get close and Gungidan literally walks through the midfield with Tanguy watching, sissoko leaving him behind (sissoko had tracked his run twice before that) and Hojdjerg being too far back.
Hojdjerg and Dier both go to him too late
And lamela is staring at it all too waiting for the ball I guess
it Took them 3 seconds and two passes to take so many players out of the game because they were static and not switched on
this is stealing to goodness before the return, and we have 7 men in the area with Davies and Dier talking to Hojdjerg to leave Jesus I assume (based on where Hojdjerg ends up next)
Gungodan well on his well now to receive the ball and look at who is still in the same spot from a Spurs perspective (tanguy, Dier and Davies). If sissoko hadn’t gone to the ball he would have been able to block the pass or the passing line but then Gungodan may have gone in front of him
and finally just before burying it past Hugo. Again look who hasn’t moved to see who was switched on ...
Hojdjerg made up a lot of ground to get across there and would have been in a great place if he hadn’t been tracking Jesus earlier. Dier moved across to try and block
Tanguy, same place, sissoko, same place, Japhet and Sanchez same place but turned now
I’m assuming in all of this the gap that people talk about between Dier and Sanchez is there because when Sanchez tracks Sterling there were 4 Spurs players going to our right and 2 city players. I’d say that’s decent odds to defend as long as your switched on.
Attachments
awesome dawson
Mitchell Thomas
He’s not a centre back. Simple as that. Why the fudge Jose thought him and Sanchez were a good idea against the best team in the country i have no idea.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Fair enough, I think it is collective and he is part of the problem for the goal.
You could copy and paste that comment for whatever CB pair plays, they are all rubbish
I do like Rodons potential though....Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
Sissoko does the right thing. He is covering Sterling beating Sanchez on the inside. I know you want to apportion some of the blame his way but you should take him out of the equation here. Ndombele I think could've covered the run. He can clearly see the whole situation developing, he can see Sterling on the ball, Gundogan and the space that Gundogan can run into. The chief culprit though is Eric Dier. If he doesn't realise now that he needs to get in that space as it opens up then he never will. We need to stop persisting with a player back there who will never be a decent centre back and get somebody in who might have a chance of making it.
If that move happens at the other end of the pitch or against a team with proper centre backs (like Burnley for instance). The left sided CB would've shuffled across and closed that space at it appeared and then been in the right position to be goal side of Gundogan as he receives the ball. What makes it even worse is that Dier looks over his shoulder earlier on and see's that he isn't needed in the area he is occupying and yet stays there anyway. He is either hiding or has no idea what positions to take up as a centre back. Both are unacceptable.
It was lovely movement and passing by Emirates Marketing Project, I'll have to give them that. But the positioning and awareness of Dier is shocking. He either needs to shape up or be shifted out.
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
Nah don’t agree
Too many players not moving throughout the whole attack
Static defending and unable to react
Can’t fault city but calming Dier is just odd IMO
We have 3 players in your description covering one man and he still passes through them...
That’s poor
And I do agree Dier shouldn’t be starting CB
I said it after his last mess but way too many other players at fault for that goal
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
It's difficult for me to reply without sounding like a clam.....
You seem a nice bloke Bedford and I think you may even love Spurs more than I do.
Actually I'll just leave it at that so I don't sound like a clam.
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
It’s a huge issue
No leader anywhere in that team
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Our lack of left-sided CB has been killing us whenever Jan didn't play/now consistently given he is not here.
That being said, you have pretty much singled out Dier as solely culpable when this is clearly because you don't like him mate. Is he part of the collective failure? Yes. Is he directly at fault? No, he is part of it though. Sissoko might well be looking to cover Sterling curing inside as Sanchez shadows him, but in the end he does nothing; he doesn't check the runner behind him (and yes, Tanguy doesn't even begin to which is poor given he sees it all unfolding) and he doesn't manage to cut off Sterling's pass inside him. Poor switch off. As for Tanganga (who I thought had a very good game overall in fairness) he is caught semi-ball watching and as such ends up redundant in the whole passage. He could also have stepped across into that space as the moment unfolded. Dier's first position is not great (if he is a few yards further inside, yes, you're right, that pass from Sterling gets nowhere) but even given that, Dier does get there enough to force the player into shooting in one place - Hugo's near post; useless keeping there.
I think it was a collective failure, a systemic lack of concentration.
p.s. I admit to perhaps being more supportive of Dier than many because I like his fight and spirit. In any case, I think here he was part of a problem and not the only problem.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
I am singling him out as his part in that goal is the worst as he isn't the doing the basics of ordinary centre back play. If he shifts across 3 or 4 yards as any half reasonable centre back would do then Gundogan would've been unable to get a shot away. Ndombele is then the second most culpable for that goal for not bothering to try to track Gundogan's run even though he can clearly see the player and the space and he isn't actually covering any other player.
As I said before most people don't actually notice this and would blame Sissoko (stupidly), Lamela (also pretty stupidly), Ndombele (less stupidly as he absolutely should've tracked that run seeing as he is looking directly at the whole situation unfolding) or even Tanganga (again stupidly as he has to stay wider to cover Foden). That all ignores the person who's job it is to ensure there isn't a chasm of space directly in front of our goal. Hojbjerg notices this and tries to cover it, Dier though either doesn't notice it or doesn't think it is his job to cover it, or is hiding from it (I have seen footballers hide in this way before and also played with a few that did this when the going got tough). Whichever of those things it is demonstrate that he should not be playing centre back for a Premier League team.
I know that you like him mate, though I do often wonder why. I don't see him having any qualities that make him a PL level centre back, let alone a top 6 one. He's not particularly good in the air, loses his player too often, makes bad decisions, isn't good on the ball, is slow on the turn and doesn't have much in the way of good positioning. There isn't much to work with.
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thfcsteff
George Hunt
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Again, for me he was part of the problem not all of it. I am not having it that he hid mate, I don't think he hides. BTW Tanganga might well have needed to stay wide because of Foden, but he didn't. He ended up essentially nowhere useful, again like several. Our whole side looks afraid :-(
Again, for me he was part of the problem not all of it. I am not having it that he hid mate, I don't think he hides. BTW Tanganga might well have needed to stay wide because of Foden, but he didn't. He ended up essentially nowhere useful, again like several. Our whole side looks afraid :-(
afsoc4life
Vedran Corluka
Agree for the most part except isn't good on the ball. He is fairly ok.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
I think he generally needs two touches to get the ball under control, needs a lot of time to get passes away and still misses his target too often. I don't think Dier starts in defence for any other team in the top ten in this league and I'm not even sure that he would for many of them in the bottom 10 either to be honest.
braineclipse
Steve Sedgley
I think that's a bit harsh, but depends who he's being compared to. Compared to Sanches and current Alderweireld he's at least in the same bracket imo.
I think there's some chance of him improving over time. His actual experience playing as a CB at this level is still somewhat limited. Mostly the last year and a bit playing there regularly.
He's also being played mostly as a left sided CB despite being right footed, I think that's more about the limitations of Sanches and Alderweireld rather than being about Dier being better there.
What him and Sanches, possibly also Alderweireld have going for them is that they haven't so far had the chance to play next to a top level CB since Verts declined/got a head injury. I could see one of them, perhaps Dier step it up if the right signing happens in the summer. If the plan is to make an effective partnership out of one of those three I'm a lot more pessimistic.
Of course that can be true for Rodon or Tanganga too so...
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Point taken that he has only been playing CB for just under a year. The thing for me is he doesn’t look like he is getting better each week/each game. I don’t see much progression there albeit in a relative short space of time. He’s still making big mistakes even when he has good games and CB is a position where you just can’t afford to make mistakes as they usually get punished. I don’t know whether you will truly eradicate that from his game. When you factor in that he doesn’t have particularly outstanding raw, natural ability then I’m not sure I see us progressing long term with Dier at CB. Unless we get a truly world class CB alongside him who elevates his games like King did to players like Dawson. I’d take a peak Michael Dawson over our CB’s right now.
Got to be Dier or Sanchez. Under no circumstances should they play together as both are too error prone.