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Coronavirus

Danishfurniturelover said:
Think the issue is that the civil service think they should run the country how they want and most are anti the tories. I know this for a fact from my sister who works in government.

If like in America we could allow our elected representatives bring in their own people we might get the sort of country people voted for.

I say this as someone who liked Corbyn and wanted the railways nationalised. Which sure as brick the civil service would have put a stop to.

It is the civil service that is the problem.
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cant disagree TBF
But unless you make civil servants pay better you will always end up with work in it for the “job” and “their egos”

I had a middle management lady flag up I spent £3.90 on a beer (it was a Pepsi over priced in a hotel)

yet the same day she signed off a £2.6M claim off that I had knocked back as it was the right thing to do.... I had to step in and agree the claim figure which was nearer £100k!!!!
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Cummings is really rocking the trees with the civil service
He has caused panic with his new approval process for constancy's - anything over £200k needs his approval basically
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Any improvement on the civil service is a welcome one.

The amount of money I've earned from them as a consultant just telling them what they already know is insane. They didn't want to learn from a consultant, they just wanted someone else to blame if it fudged up.
 
scaramanga said:
Any improvement on the civil service is a welcome one.

The amount of money I've earned from them as a consultant just telling them what they already know is insane. They didn't want to learn from a consultant, they just wanted someone else to blame if it fudged up.
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Yep
That’s about right
 
Bedfordspurs said:
cant disagree TBF
But unless you make civil servants pay better you will always end up with work in it for the “job” and “their egos”

I had a middle management lady flag up I spent £3.90 on a beer (it was a Pepsi over priced in a hotel)

yet the same day she signed off a £2.6M claim off that I had knocked back as it was the right thing to do.... I had to step in and agree the claim figure which was nearer £100k!!!!
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The Civil Service is like the Italian Job - Job preservation society. I work next to the home office in Croydon and they all drink in my local. They are all a bunch of self entitled only do so much work, I’ve always done the job this way bunch of eejits, in my experience.

lifers
 
scaramanga said:
Any improvement on the civil service is a welcome one.

The amount of money I've earned from them as a consultant just telling them what they already know is insane. They didn't want to learn from a consultant, they just wanted someone else to blame if it fudged up.
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Irony of not being able to furlough the Civil Service is you wouldn’t notice the change in productivity if you did
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
Yeah......and the scientists are just going along with it as the have no professional integrity.:rolleyes:
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I was more interested in the idea that an independent body should have a government adviser (particularly one known for adversarial and outspoken behaviour) as a member; and that the government had tried to keep this under wraps when challenged about it over the last month. Suggests there was something to hide - especially given Cummings comments on ‘only a few thousand pensioners’ dying when coupled with the UK’s unusual approach to handling the pandemic.

On the scientists, they seem to be belatedly waking up to the fact that they are being used as a smokescreen for the government to hide behind. Might help to explain Whitty’s rogue comments at the last couple of press conferences.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-following-the-science?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
 
Mikey10 said:
I was more interested in the idea that an independent body should have a government adviser (particularly one known for adversarial and outspoken behaviour) as a member; and that the government had tried to keep this under wraps when challenged about it over the last month. Suggests there was something to hide - especially given Cummings comments on ‘only a few thousand pensioners’ dying when coupled with the UK’s unusual approach to handling the pandemic.

On the scientists, they seem to be belatedly waking up to the fact that they are being used as a smokescreen for the government to hide behind. Might help to explain Whitty’s rogue comments at the last couple of press conferences.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-following-the-science?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
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I'd be more concerned if meetings of this importance were taking place with no govt representation at all. Someone needs to be able to represent what is and isn't possible when the theorists theorise.

I don't think there's any cover up here - the attendees of such meetings have always been kept away from the public haven't they?
 
Mikey10 said:
I was more interested in the idea that an independent body should have a government adviser (particularly one known for adversarial and outspoken behaviour) as a member; and that the government had tried to keep this under wraps when challenged about it over the last month. Suggests there was something to hide - especially given Cummings comments on ‘only a few thousand pensioners’ dying when coupled with the UK’s unusual approach to handling the pandemic.

On the scientists, they seem to be belatedly waking up to the fact that they are being used as a smokescreen for the government to hide behind. Might help to explain Whitty’s rogue comments at the last couple of press conferences.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-following-the-science?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
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Well say that then....and stop practising headline writing :D

You said .....'not guided by the science' then after all.

So guided by Cummings?

So if Cummings is running things and as a soundbite the government keep reiterating we're 'guided by the science' are none of those experts thinking 'hold up wtf are they on about, you're not putting everything on us when it's NOT us steering this ship. I don't think they need waking up.

And I don't think our approach has been 'unusual' , it's similar to a lot of other countries and different to others.
 
So now some scientist has come out and said the infection rate was slowing before the lockdown when washing hands and social distancing was enough to have a similar outcome to Sweden.

WTF so the government might have been on the right track all along?

Friend sent me the link earlier will try and find it later.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
So now some scientist has come out and said the infection rate was slowing before the lockdown when washing hands and social distancing was enough to have a similar outcome to Sweden.

WTF so the government might have been on the right track all along?

Friend sent me the link earlier will try and find it later.
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I think there's a good chance the govt were on the right track but once Ferguson's typically alarmist report was made public, the press were going to murder any govt trying to do the right thing.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
So now some scientist has come out and said the infection rate was slowing before the lockdown when washing hands and social distancing was enough to have a similar outcome to Sweden.

WTF so the government might have been on the right track all along?

Friend sent me the link earlier will try and find it later.
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Yep and there lies the issue and scientists and experts have confirmed exactly what we have experienced in this forum, they all have difference of opinion and theory.

The link earlier that someone posted earlier had a scientist saying the exact thing.

And the BBC has reported that Sweden are seeing a curve reduction just like everyone else in the same timeline as everyone else without the lock down.

Why? Well because as Scara said, the disease kills the weak and the old and that’s seen with and without lockdown.

I said at the start I would prefer a Sweden style situation shame really
 
I'm surprised more advisors werent at SAGE and even more surprised people saying advisors weren't present when they were on the committee, surely the scientific advice then needs to be formulated into policy/guidance as well as deciding the priority or opinions to take (when there's conflict) so how can that be done if senior people who help to formulate policy and make decisions aren't there.
 
Had a top day today, done my 10k steps and some, had fun with the kids
It’s been lovely and sunny, had a few beers sat outside
Just had a chinese which has just opened again, got virtual bingo with my pals soon
And best of all the Mrs is in a strop so not talking to any of us, perfect haah
 
P.D. said:
I'm surprised more advisors werent at SAGE and even more surprised people saying advisors weren't present when they were on the committee, surely the scientific advice then needs to be formulated into policy/guidance as well as deciding the priority or opinions to take (when there's conflict) so how can that be done if senior people who help to formulate policy and make decisions aren't there.
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It’s supposed to be an independent scientific forum for discussion - as in independent from the government. The reports coming out say that Cummings didn’t just attend but that he actively contributed to discussions. Worrying in any circumstances in a democracy, but particularly worrying given what is known about his way of working.
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
Well say that then....and stop practising headline writing :D

You said .....'not guided by the science' then after all.

So guided by Cummings?

So if Cummings is running things and as a soundbite the government keep reiterating we're 'guided by the science' are none of those experts thinking 'hold up wtf are they on about, you're not putting everything on us when it's NOT us steering this ship. I don't think they need waking up.

And I don't think our approach has been 'unusual' , it's similar to a lot of other countries and different to others.
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I don’t think we’re going to agree on this one, buddy, and I have cider to drink.
 
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