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cars

Rorschach said:
I'm all for not changing your car or getting shot of them all together, but that is a seperate discussion. EVs are just less bad for the climate by about say 60-70% over it's life. I have a 2nd hand EV which is about 8 years old, and we use it more or less all the time and is charged free from the sun.

When you talk about EVs saving 20-30%, to what are you referring?
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If you run your car for a couple of years, think 36 months is the average, but many keep their cars for less time, especially those leasing them, then the benefits are offset by the more harmful production costs. Which was my point about being thrifty. EVs are not good for the environment, less bad is still bad! And if you consume a new car each year the net benefits are slim.
 
SpurMeUp said:
If you run your car for a couple of years, think 36 months is the average, but many keep their cars for less time, especially those leasing them, then the benefits are offset by the more harmful production costs. Which was my point about being thrifty. EVs are not good for the environment, less bad is still bad! And if you consume a new car each year the net benefits are slim.
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If you look at the full life of the car rather than your example leasing peroid the CO2 debt for EVs batteries is 'paid off' in two years, and emissions are 60-70% less. So while there is a higher up front carbon cost this is offset down the road, literally. So it still makes sense to purchase EV over ICE even if you change your car frequently as these offsets will still happen, just for the next owner. If you keep your existing ICE car the carbon offset takes about twice as long. About 4 years is the average though this will go up or down depending on usage. And these numbers will improve as the grid decarbonises.
But ultimately I agree that having far fewer cars entirely is the way to go. And thankfully the real explosion in the ev world is electic bikes and scooters. That is a welcome trend.
 
Rorschach said:
I'm all for not changing your car or getting shot of them all together, but that is a seperate discussion. EVs are just less bad for the climate by about say 60-70% over it's life. I have a 2nd hand EV which is about 8 years old, and we use it more or less all the time and is charged free from the sun.

When you talk about EVs saving 20-30%, to what are you referring?
Click to expand...

There are many variables to calculate what the carbon savings are. If you're using coal-powered electricity, if you change your EV car every year....that 60-70% saving is going to be a lot lower, because EV production currently uses more energy and resources. Coal powered EVs are obviously less green etc. Because building EVs is worse for the environment than building an ICE car the rate that you change the car makes a difference.As collectively we just burn through more stuff.

But the bigger point is: we shouldn't think that an EV in itself is going to address climate change. It is still highly polluting especially if changed every year. A bike, better public transport....
 
SpurMeUp said:
There are many variables to calculate what the carbon savings are. If you're using coal-powered electricity, if you change your EV car every year....that 60-70% saving is going to be a lot lower, because EV production currently uses more energy and resources. Coal powered EVs are obviously less green etc. Because building EVs is worse for the environment than building an ICE car the rate that you change the car makes a difference.As collectively we just burn through more stuff.

But the bigger point is: we shouldn't think that an EV in itself is going to address climate change. It is still highly polluting especially if changed every year. A bike, better public transport....
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There are variations for pesonal behavioir but 60-70% figure is widely accepted as an average comparison between ICE and EV embodied emissions over a cars life, and it may even by higher as the ICE calcs use the published efficiencies of new ICE cars which as we know are not always accurate. It factors in the grid mix.

I agree on your bigger point about our car centric societies. This needs to change, everywhere.
 
Rorschach said:
I agree on your bigger point about our car centric societies. This needs to change, everywhere.
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Public transport has a long way to go before it's viable.

Until it leaves from my driveway at the moment of my choosing, at the speed I want, and stops outside my office door without stopping or carrying any other passengers, it's not going to work.
 
Ok I’m considering the Lexus LC500 (probably next year if I’m being realistic) I think it’s one of the most beautiful cars on the market today both inside and out.

I want the V8 rather than then the hybrid, but I’m a bit worried about where the legislation is going in terms of cars in London. If I do get it will I be super taxed when they bring in pay per mile?
 
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Rorschach said:
Just on the EV points above. The extra emissions because of the battery production are cancelled out in about 1-2 years (or 15k miles driving approx). So despite what Mr Bean says in his stupid article EVs are far better for the climate than ICE. Not perfect but better.

Also watch out for solid state batteries, which might utterly change the game again, and may not be far off if Toyota are to be beleived. Toyota need a big win as they have backed the wrong horse a few times already, but hopefully this is their 'we are not Nokia' moment.
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1682634837406908426
 
@scaramanga at what price would it be worth buying a Tycan?

EVs depreciating quickly, as more advanced tech comes out or people go back to ICE cars. So many ads for Tycans on Autotrader. At what price do they become good value?
 
SpurMeUp said:
@scaramanga at what price would it be worth buying a Tycan?

EVs depreciating quickly, as more advanced tech comes out or people go back to ICE cars. So many ads for Tycans on Autotrader. At what price do they become good value?
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That depends on why you're buying it.

If it's a personal purchase, then don't. It's the best EV out there (yet to drive the Lotus), but not a patch on a good V10 or 12.

If it's (like me) to avoid BIK taxation then now is probably a good time. There'll be an update in 2 years and if you're anything like me, you'll be bored and looking for something else by that point. Not sure what the monthly cost will be now though, I'm on a lease from when money was cheap and resale was high - that's changed since.
 
scaramanga said:
That depends on why you're buying it.

If it's a personal purchase, then don't. It's the best EV out there (yet to drive the Lotus), but not a patch on a good V10 or 12.

If it's (like me) to avoid BIK taxation then now is probably a good time. There'll be an update in 2 years and if you're anything like me, you'll be bored and looking for something else by that point. Not sure what the monthly cost will be now though, I'm on a lease from when money was cheap and resale was high - that's changed since.
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The tech is changing quickly too. Similar to the first decade of mobile phones, there will be step changes each year. Better range, and more lightness. I dislike heavy cars. Adaptive damping makes these 2-tonne+ cars go around corners very quickly, but it's no fun, and you jiggle about on bumpy surfaces; rather than fly over them. A totally different driving experience in lightweight cars. Once EVs solve the weight issue it will herald their arrival.

This shows what is possible now. Today! Which should arrive with consumers eventually. Also think it looks good - when most EVs don't currently. I've not watched this vid yet:

I have a new office and installed solar and a car charger. So an EV makes a little more sense. Atm my daily is a hybrid estate, which charges up just fine, accomodates lots of people, luggage and locally it runs on electricity. If secondhand Tycans hit 40k or less it would be tempting, but suspect the estate versions will stay stronger. Seems to make more sense, and they look more interesting.

Maybe I'll spend the money on putting a battery in a classic instead.

I am also hankering after another manual car. Was staying in the hills in Turkey and loved the switch-backs in the manual hire car up the mountain roads.

Edited as it lost the Youtube link in the move: https://youtu.be/hFrKzH2UZ1c?si=WadK6x8oA-Wxbdj6
 
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SpurMeUp said:
The tech is changing quickly too. Similar to the first decade of mobile phones, there will be step changes each year. Better range, and more lightness. I dislike heavy cars. Adaptive damping makes these 2-tonne+ cars go around corners very quickly, but it's no fun, and you jiggle about on bumpy surfaces; rather than fly over them. A totally different driving experience in lightweight cars. Once EVs solve the weight issue it will herald their arrival.

This shows what is possible now. Today! Which should arrive with consumers eventually. Also think it looks good - when most EVs don't currently. I've not watched this vid yet:

I have a new office and installed solar and a car charger. So an EV makes a little more sense. Atm my daily is a hybrid estate, which charges up just fine, accomodates lots of people, luggage and locally it runs on electricity. If secondhand Tycans hit 40k or less it would be tempting, but suspect the estate versions will stay stronger. Seems to make more sense, and they look more interesting.

Maybe I'll spend the money on putting a battery in a classic instead.

I am also hankering after another manual car. Was staying in the hills in Turkey and loved the switch-backs in the manual hire car up the mountain roads.
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Next time I'm thinking I might get a sensible EV for my tax avoidance and put the savings into something fun.

I have to have something with 4 doors and boot space for work/school run/daily crap so my reasoning before was that it might as well be something fun. Hence the Taycan. But it's a massive step down from the Rapide - to the point where I can't even bring myself to sell it (still driving the Aston at weekends).

So I think a better philosophy is to have something boring and tax free as the daily and put the extra into something I can chuck around a track at the weekends.
 
scaramanga said:
New car review - Audi A4 tdi35 Estate.

It would have been quicker to walk.
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What happened to the 4-door, 4-seat prancing horse! Was excited about this.

A diesel - tut tut. 8.5 seconds to 60, Idk how you cope? :eek: Is the economy better than using killowats?
 
SpurMeUp said:
What happened to the 4-door, 4-seat prancing horse! Was excited about this.

A diesel - tut tut. 8.5 seconds to 60, Idk how you cope? :eek: Is the economy better than using killowats?
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The porker had a flat and it was easier to get them to deal with it for me. Might have to have some words with them about what an "equivalent" car is though. Got this heap for another day or so.

I actually had to turn a round thing on the side of my seat to change the angle. I haven't done that since the 80s.

Sat in both the FF and the GTC4 at recent car shows, they are not real rear seats - you're as well off in a 911 in terms of space.
 
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scaramanga said:
The porker had a flat and it was easier to get them to deal with it for me. Might have to have some words with them about what an "equivalent" car is though. Got this heap for another day or so.

I actually had to turn a round thing on the side of my seat to change the angle. I haven't done that since the 80s.

Sat in both the FF and the GTC4 at recent car shows, they are not real rear seats - you're as well off in a 911 in terms of space.
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That is the issue. The good thing about a true estate is you have room for 3 in the back plus lots of luggage space. FF and Lusso are 4 seaters with smallish boots. Plus you can’t really park on the street etc or maybe you can and just deal with the scuffs.

But stunning interiors? Were you smitten?
 
SpurMeUp said:
That is the issue. The good thing about a true estate is you have room for 3 in the back plus lots of luggage space. FF and Lusso are 4 seaters with smallish boots. Plus you can’t really park on the street etc or maybe you can and just deal with the scuffs.

But stunning interiors? Were you smitten?
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They're beautiful but they're not even 4 seaters - they're 2+2s
 
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