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Another shooting in Murica

thfcsteff said:
If you send groups of "right-wing protestors" to repeatedly "confront" protestors, you are going to ignite all creatures great and small. If you think the use of "agitators" is about sending "actor" in to play thieves, then you're missing the mark. Agitators will certainly create chaos and know how to enrage factions of those they're "pitched against"...the truth IS uncomfortable. The TRUTH is that when you continually isolate, profile and subjugate sections of the population, you are creating the conditions for violence and civil war. If he gets back in, mark my words, his only way out from sustained civil violence and chaos will be to create/engage in a war. Nixon...

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/10/28/nixon-protest-law-and-order-221920
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The thing is this is not new, I remember the Rodney King Riots where 60 odd people were killed.

Is this a case that America is saying enough is enough?
 
Grays_1890 said:
The thing is this is not new, I remember the Rodney King Riots where 60 odd people were killed.

Is this a case that America is saying enough is enough?
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What's not new? The playbook run by Nixon and now this turd? Yes. That was my point!
And the King riots were a different situation. Look up the Watts riots for further ref. There is no doubt terrible things happened and terrible acts, but again, if you want to try and understand why you'd need to get into US civil rights history.

What some on this forum don't quite get is that until 1964, actual physical segregation was legal. Sadly -due in part to the sheer size of the place- segregation still exists in the US.
 
thfcsteff said:
What's not new? The playbook run by Nixon and now this turd? Yes. That was my point!
And the King riots were a different situation. Look up the Watts riots for further ref. There is no doubt terrible things happened and terrible acts, but again, if you want to try and understand why you'd need to get into US civil rights history.

What some on this forum don't quite get is that until 1964, actual physical segregation was legal. Sadly -due in part to the sheer size of the place- segregation still exists in the US.
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Oh I think people get it, I was more trying to emphasis that the fight back seems more emphasized now for that reason feels like a new problem, but these unlawful killings and then subsequent riots have been a huge problem for many a year
 
Grays_1890 said:
Oh I think people get it, I was more trying to emphasis that the fight back seems more emphasized now for that reason feels like a new problem, but these unlawful killings and then subsequent riots have been a huge problem for many a year
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...because you have POTUS playing it for all he can to sew seeds of fear and anger, trying to convince everyone that the US is being overcome with looters, sneaker thieves, pinkos and leftist scum that only HE can save them from. Do you know about Nixon in that era? This is a cruder version.
 
thfcsteff said:
...because you have POTUS playing it for all he can to sew seeds of fear and anger, trying to convince everyone that the US is being overcome with looters, sneaker thieves, pinkos and leftist scum that only HE can save them from. Do you know about Nixon in that era? This is a cruder version.
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Not to mention bad actors, undercover police looting and starting fires to fan the literal flames. It's fudged up.
 
Grays_1890 said:
IS that true?
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I personally don't believe in the "actors" theories, no, and I am not sure I believe in police contributing in that way. What I personally believe is that Trump knows he can use groups like Proud Boys and the Patriot groups to go and sew chaos with such subversive action. Roll a few right wing Trumpers through certain places at certain times and it is like kerosene on dry wood with a match box in your hand.
 
thfcsteff said:
...because you have POTUS playing it for all he can to sew seeds of fear and anger, trying to convince everyone that the US is being overcome with looters, sneaker thieves, pinkos and leftist scum that only HE can save them from. Do you know about Nixon in that era? This is a cruder version.
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My guess is Iran. Not sure they can beat China so he will go Iran.

I hope we would stay out of it, but dont think we have a strong enough leader to do that.
 
thfcsteff said:
If you send groups of "right-wing protestors" to repeatedly "confront" protestors, you are going to ignite all creatures great and small. If you think the use of "agitators" is about sending "actor" in to play thieves, then you're missing the mark. Agitators will certainly create chaos and know how to enrage factions of those they're "pitched against"...the truth IS uncomfortable. The TRUTH is that when you continually isolate, profile and subjugate sections of the population, you are creating the conditions for violence and civil war. If he gets back in, mark my words, his only way out from sustained civil violence and chaos will be to create/engage in a war. Nixon...

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/10/28/nixon-protest-law-and-order-221920
Click to expand...
I've yet to see anyone trying to defend property against nobody.

If the protesters aren't there, the nutjobs with guns aren't either.
 
scaramanga said:
I've yet to see anyone trying to defend property against nobody.

If the protesters aren't there, the nutjobs with guns aren't either.
Click to expand...

Read the boldface sentence again. You believe in democracy, right? You have either not clearly articulated yourself, or you are adhering to the cheapest rule of any self-respecting autocrat which is to basically say that protests are trouble and should therefore not be allowed.
 
thfcsteff said:
Read the boldface sentence again. You believe in democracy, right? You have either not clearly articulated yourself, or you are adhering to the cheapest rule of any self-respecting autocrat which is to basically say that protests are trouble and should therefore not be allowed.
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Protests are allowed - I don't believe protests should inconvenience normal people.

Freedom to protest is not the same as freedom from consequences.
 
scaramanga said:
Protests are allowed - I don't believe protests should inconvenience normal people.

Freedom to protest is not the same as freedom from consequences.
Click to expand...

I agree.
The vast majority of protestors are peaceful, regardless of what Breitbart might be telling you...
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Always thought racism was wrong but this is the key bit for me.

Also the video evidence backs up the claims black people have made.

Dont think it is overstating things to say the American police force has an institutional racism problem. Im sure the are decent white officers, but they clearly have a hell of a lot of racists.

Not sure if you have seen the excellent tv show now they see us. But it is clear the blacks have put up with far to much brick for far to long, im not surprised they snapped.
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I've seen it mate. There was a great Q&A with the men available as well, not sure if it is still on Netflix.
 
scaramanga said:
Of course, but I hold them responsible for those who are not.
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I will remember that the next time one macaron spouts racist abuse or smashes a shop window abroad while following us. It will -by your definition- be as much your fault as anyone's.
 
scaramanga said:
Anyone organising an event is responsible for what happens there.

In any other walk of life that's the case.
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Are we responsible for the tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths in Iraq as a result One man's flunking of "facts" to justify a regime change and war there? Should we blame you? Can't get a more "organized event" than a military invasion.
 
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thfcsteff said:
I will remember that the next time one macaron spouts racist abuse or smashes a shop window abroad while following us. It will -by your definition- be as much your fault as anyone's.
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The club's fault - they are the ones setting up the event.

And yes, any supporter groups involved in it too.
 
thfcsteff said:
Are we responsible for the tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths in Iraq as a result One man's flunking of "facts" to justify a regime change and war there? Should we blame you? Can't get a more "organized event" than a military invasion.
Click to expand...
I'm fairly sure we reduced a fudgetonne (official measure) of deaths too. Wouldn't have been much left of Kuwait by now of we hadn't.

The reasoning was flimflam, the action was sound.
 
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