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The "Why" thread

LutonSpurs said:
What do we create for no reason?
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I was actually having a joke, but this is my kind of thread.

So, that's a response to "why are we here?". But is say production isn't a necessary part of the why. It's a factor humans, but it's not intrinsic to our being.
There is a strange human fear and/or arrogance that leads us to think we have some kind of higher purpose. Why does anything have a higher purpose? Maybe it just exists and develops at a microbiological level.
Maybe there isn't a "why", but there is just an "is" (as in the human "is in existence"). I don't see anything to suggest our evolution into Homosapiens has any specific meaning.
Yiu could argue that all parts of the world exists to allow all parts of the world to exist - however that seems to fall short when you see species adapt when another species goes extinct.

(I'll exchange more when I not knackered. Spent 4 hours playing netball against top level people twenty years younger than me this morning, in the blazing heat - I'm a wreck!)
 
LutonSpurs said:
Yes Science says agnosticism is the only answer.

My view is there is some design. And it makes me wonder about a creator. I don't know anything of course. Or think anyone else should agree with me.
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Why would there be a creator?
I can understand the creation of a character called creator thousands of years ago because h-s's need to tell stories and because as the brain was developing there needed to be answers to explain events.
But it's an oddly arrogant thing to think there is a creator that made h-s's in "his" image.
If there is - why don't dolphins believe in GHod?
 
monkeybarry said:
Why would there be a creator?
I can understand the creation of a character called creator thousands of years ago because h-s's need to tell stories and because as the brain was developing there needed to be answers to explain events.
But it's an oddly arrogant thing to think there is a creator that made h-s's in "his" image.
If there is - why don't dolphins believe in GHod?
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because they are too smart and understand logic, reason and critical thought
 
monkeybarry said:
Why would there be a creator?
I can understand the creation of a character called creator thousands of years ago because h-s's need to tell stories and because as the brain was developing there needed to be answers to explain events.
But it's an oddly arrogant thing to think there is a creator that made h-s's in "his" image.
If there is - why don't dolphins believe in GHod?
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It isn't that. I think the design and genius of our sentience is too incredible to be by chance. So I think there's something divine about it. Now the concept of divinity is man made and intangible too. But that's the whole GHod is good and loves you stuff.

I'm just saying I can't deny there is a maker. However I've never seen any evidence that there is a caring creator.
 
LutonSpurs said:
It isn't that. I think the design and genius of our sentience is too incredible to be by chance. So I think there's something divine about it. Now the concept of divinity is man made and intangible too. But that's the whole GHod is good and loves you stuff.

I'm just saying I can't deny there is a maker. However I've never seen any evidence that there is a caring creator.
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Everything we think we know is man made or rather interpreted through our very limited human lenses. And say we live in an infinite universe with infinite multiverses - how can our tiny little idiot species that can’t even figure out how to live together in peace have any sort of remote understanding of what the universe really is? We’re tiny little microbes trying to understand quantum physics. It’s not gonna happen. None of us will ever understand this mystery we’re experiencing. Our species will likely never know. We’re too dumb, small and (likely) insignificant. To even say «there’s no creator» or «there is definitely a creator» from our position of near complete ignorance (and arrogance) is laughable. We don’t know. We’re trying to view the city of Rome through watching a piece of gravel at the bottom of the Coloseum with one of those red plastic devices you chuck paper discs in and watch images of Mickey Mouse.

Says the microbe about a thing he will never understand. We don’t know brick about the big picture, and that’s fine with me. The mystery is awesome.
 
Daisuk said:
Everything we think we know is man made or rather interpreted through our very limited human lenses. And say we live in an infinite universe with infinite multiverses - how can our tiny little idiot species that can’t even figure out how to live together in peace have any sort of remote understanding of what the universe really is? We’re tiny little microbes trying to understand quantum physics. It’s not gonna happen. None of us will ever understand this mystery we’re experiencing. Our species will likely never know. We’re too dumb, small and (likely) insignificant. To even say «there’s no creator» or «there is definitely a creator» from our position of near complete ignorance (and arrogance) is laughable. We don’t know. We’re trying to view the city of Rome through watching a piece of gravel at the bottom of the Coloseum with one of those red plastic devices you chuck paper discs in and watch images of Mickey Mouse.

Says the microbe about a thing he will never understand. We don’t know brick about the big picture, and that’s fine with me. The mystery is awesome.
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At the end of the day, despite what we try telling ourselves, we are just animals the same as ever species.
Yes we may be more "devoloped" in some ways, but ultimately we are still just bunch of apes who got lucky, and if we aren't careful that luck could run out very soon.
 
glasgowspur said:
At the end of the day, despite what we try telling ourselves, we are just animals the same as ever species.
Yes we may be more "devoloped" in some ways, but ultimately we are still just bunch of apes who got lucky, and if we aren't careful that luck could run out very soon.
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I mean the dystopia is here and now isn't it
 
LutonSpurs said:
I mean the dystopia is here and now isn't it
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I don't think it is.
Life now around the world is better than it was a few hundred years ago for almost everyone.
It's perverse, but those suffering today would probably already be dead, or enslaved, not too long ago.

Could "we" do better - yes.
Should we - no; should is determined by being human, and a large number of humans are inherently selfish.
The less selfish ones are the more developed ones.
 
monkeybarry said:
I don't think it is.
Life now around the world is better than it was a few hundred years ago for almost everyone.
It's perverse, but those suffering today would probably already be dead, or enslaved, not too long ago.

Could "we" do better - yes.
Should we - no; should is determined by being human, and a large number of humans are inherently selfish.
The less selfish ones are the more developed ones.
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I am not sure I agree. I think in terms of a dystopia it's very real in the sense of how different our lives are from any age before. The scale of suffering might have changed but the amount of us on the planet has increased so much thst measuring current quality of life vs pervious eras is hard to do. Dunno. Good discussion
 
monkeybarry said:
I don't think it is.
Life now around the world is better than it was a few hundred years ago for almost everyone.
It's perverse, but those suffering today would probably already be dead, or enslaved, not too long ago.

Could "we" do better - yes.
Should we - no; should is determined by being human, and a large number of humans are inherently selfish.
The less selfish ones are the more developed ones.
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glasgowspur said:
For some poor souls yes I think it definitely is.
You would hope that every year more are lifted out of it, and that it would speed up as we "progress", but IMHO it's stalled and we are as likely to regress as we are to progress, at least in the short to medium term.
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There is a chance we will be virtually extinct within a hundred years if we continue on our current trajectory. When I say that to people, the most common answer is "nah, I don't believe it" and they slowly move away from me :). There is a high probability that these same people believe this place was created in six days by a bearded man, and I'm not talking about Scara and the forum. So many do not take the warnings from scientists on runaway climate change seriously, even when looking at irrefutable evidence daily with their own eyes. To me this is proper cult behaviour. Yep, we are firmly on the 'regress' path.
 
Rorschach said:
There is a chance we will be virtually extinct within a hundred years if we continue on our current trajectory. When I say that to people, the most common answer is "nah, I don't believe it" and they slowly move away from me :). There is a high probability that these same people believe this place was created in six days by a bearded man, and I'm not talking about Scara and the forum. So many do not take the warnings from scientists on runaway climate change seriously, even when looking at irrefutable evidence daily with their own eyes. To me this is proper cult behaviour. Yep, we are firmly on the 'regress' path.
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I experience a lot of that.
There's a lot of yes I want it to be fixed but not if it impacts me.
We are a very selfish species.

This all struck me as true,

Beware the beast Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone among GHod's primates, he kills for sport or lust or greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land. Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him; drive him back into his jungle lair, for he is the harbinger of death.
 
monkeybarry said:
I don't think it is.
Life now around the world is better than it was a few hundred years ago for almost everyone.
It's perverse, but those suffering today would probably already be dead, or enslaved, not too long ago.

Could "we" do better - yes.
Should we - no; should is determined by being human, and a large number of humans are inherently selfish.
The less selfish ones are the more developed ones.
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Agree with all of that except your last sentence.

I believe sociopathy is the next stage in human evolution.
 
Rorschach said:
There is a chance we will be virtually extinct within a hundred years if we continue on our current trajectory. When I say that to people, the most common answer is "nah, I don't believe it" and they slowly move away from me :). There is a high probability that these same people believe this place was created in six days by a bearded man, and I'm not talking about Scara and the forum. So many do not take the warnings from scientists on runaway climate change seriously, even when looking at irrefutable evidence daily with their own eyes. To me this is proper cult behaviour. Yep, we are firmly on the 'regress' path.
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How dare you gender me.
 
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