Son Heung-Min

[metalgear]

He looks better for S Korea because the standard of team he is playing against is much lower than in the PL.

true - but two things can be right at the same time

 

[Bedfordspurs]

true - but two things can be right at the same time

They can
He looks better playing against awful teams
That’s it

 

[Bishop]

He's past it, he's been past it. A wiser coach might get more out him by selectively playing him through the middle but his time on the wings is done and honestly has been done since last year. His performances this season on the wing are not at all surprising if you've been paying attention to him.

 

[Jurgen the German]

He's past it, he's been past it. A wiser coach might get more out him by selectively playing him through the middle but his time on the wings is done and honestly has been done since last year. His performances this season on the wing are not at all surprising if you've been paying attention to him.

We’ve been on the same page on this for nearly 2 years. The entire forward unit needs upgrading. Maybe Solanke aside because he’s been here less than a year, but the others are all painfully average.

 

[GGyid]

Solanke is bang average, too.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I'd still play him every match now till he gets those two goals he needs. Him passing Chivers' record is the only joy we're going to get out of this season.

 

[SteveAWOL]

Sonny in his prime would’ve slotted this home out of their goalie’s reach, hopefully keeping his powder dry for next week.

 

[Welshspur60]

We’ve been on the same page on this for nearly 2 years. The entire forward unit needs upgrading. Maybe Solanke aside because he’s been here less than a year, but the others are all painfully average.

I hope you are not settling on Solanke as our great hope. Hes shown us what he is, and thats a bang average player who works hard.

 

[Surfless]

We’ve been on the same page on this for nearly 2 years. The entire forward unit needs upgrading. Maybe Solanke aside because he’s been here less than a year, but the others are all painfully average.

There have been 910 goals scored in the premier league this season. Approx 500 players have played, of which approx 40 are goalkeepers. With that in mind 910 goals across 460 player is almost exactly 2 goals per player.

On that basis the following players are *above average* in the league :

Brennan Johnson: 11 goals

James Maddison: 9 goals

Son Heung-Min: 7 goals

Dejan Kulusevski: 7 goals

Dominic Solanke: 7 goals

Pape Matar Sarr: 3 goals

I feel like people are just saying stuff to suit an agenda now.

Only Liverpool have scored more than us this season and if you looks their scorers and check to see how much time they have spent out injured it's not even close to ours.

 

[Bishop]

There have been 910 goals scored in the premier league this season. Approx 500 players have played, of which approx 40 are goalkeepers. With that in mind 910 goals across 460 player is almost exactly 2 goals per player.

On that basis the following players are *above average* in the league :

Brennan Johnson: 11 goals

James Maddison: 9 goals

Son Heung-Min: 7 goals

Dejan Kulusevski: 7 goals

Dominic Solanke: 7 goals

Pape Matar Sarr: 3 goals

I feel like people are just saying stuff to suit an agenda now.

Only Liverpool have scored more than us this season and if you looks their scorers and check to see how much time they have spent out injured it's not even close to ours.

We are overly aggressive and overly attacking to our defensive detriment. The number of goals we score isn't particularly impressive given that context.

 

[Surfless]

We are overly aggressive and overly attacking to our defensive detriment. The number of goals we score isn't particularly impressive given that context.

Yet if our forwards were "average" then we wouldn't score we'd just create chances based on what you are saying...

 

[Bishop]

Yet if our forwards were "average" then we wouldn't score we'd just create chances based on what you are saying...

I disagree. If you look at the type of goals we score they are rarely individualistic goals, the vast majority are very system created. Our goals are more about bodies being in the right place at the right time, that is to Ange's credit because his system does make an average group of forwards high scoring but it's not due to their individual qualities.

 

[Surfless]

I disagree. If you look at the type of goals we score they are rarely individualistic goals, the vast majority are very system created. Our goals are more about bodies being in the right place at the right time, that is to Ange's credit because his system does make an average group of forwards high scoring but it's not due to their individual qualities.

Good debate !

I disagree with you though. For one there's been plenty of individual goals this season which have been evolutions of the ange system, and when was the last time our wide forward/winger got 16 goals in all competitions? Bale during his return I think, so 2021.

You would have to go back over a decade and more to find the last time we had five players in double figures on goals, with team after team over reliant on Kane and Son.

That we are the highest scorers bar Liverpool with a setting Son and no Kane is impressive, but that we are finally not dependent on one player to get all the goals, is a major positive.

hopefully you get my point to save me having to go back and dig up all the individual skill that has lead to goals this year....?

 

[Lemonade Money]

There have been 910 goals scored in the premier league this season. Approx 500 players have played, of which approx 40 are goalkeepers. With that in mind 910 goals across 460 player is almost exactly 2 goals per player.

On that basis the following players are *above average* in the league :

Brennan Johnson: 11 goals

James Maddison: 9 goals

Son Heung-Min: 7 goals

Dejan Kulusevski: 7 goals

Dominic Solanke: 7 goals

Pape Matar Sarr: 3 goals

I feel like people are just saying stuff to suit an agenda now.

Only Liverpool have scored more than us this season and if you looks their scorers and check to see how much time they have spent out injured it's not even close to ours.

Now do the same for conceding possession.

 

[Bishop]

Good debate !

I disagree with you though. For one there's been plenty of individual goals this season which have been evolutions of the ange system, and when was the last time our wide forward/winger got 16 goals in all competitions? Bale during his return I think, so 2021.

You would have to go back over a decade and more to find the last time we had five players in double figures on goals, with team after team over reliant on Kane and Son.

That we are the highest scorers bar Liverpool with a setting Son and no Kane is impressive, but that we are finally not dependent on one player to get all the goals, is a major positive.

hopefully you get my point to save me having to go back and dig up all the individual skill that has lead to goals this year....?

A few thoughts, the initial argument was that our attack is average. I think that means more than just the pure goal scoring numbers, it relates to their overall contribution in matches. How they support the team, keep the ball, create opportunities etc beyond just goal scoring but on the topic of goals, some context would be that Son scored 16 and more playing WF, we never really had a decent RWF other that one year of Bale and even then Son scored 20+ from wide that season. The double figures thing is a positive as I said but it speaks more for the overly attacking setup we have, whereby we play quite suicidally and are incredibly open defensively. We score because we have a setup designed primarily to score and at the expense of everything else. It works, but again i'll contend it works due to the system and not the players.

Just watch them play, can you seriously say that Son in 2025 is a top player? Your eyes can tell you he isn't. Likewise with Johnson are you seriously going to claim he is a top player? He is so lacking every category other than finishing the system setup goal, it's painful watching him. Solanke i'm awaiting judgement because i've felt and even said from very early on this season we provide him with no supply, so sure I won't call him average yet but as an overall attack i'm sorry but I think only Spurs tinted glasses can make you think of what we see as anything but average. I'd actually argue its below average, honestly. And again that is to Ange's credit, he has made them a high scoring bunch but if his system were a little more balanced they wouldn't get near the same number of goals.

 

[harr1984]

A few thoughts, the initial argument was that our attack is average. I think that means more than just the pure goal scoring numbers, it relates to their overall contribution in matches. How they support the team, keep the ball, create opportunities etc beyond just goal scoring but on the topic of goals, some context would be that Son scored 16 and more playing WF, we never really had a decent RWF other that one year of Bale and even then Son scored 20+ from wide that season. The double figures thing is a positive as I said but it speaks more for the overly attacking setup we have, whereby we play quite suicidally and are incredibly open defensively. We score because we have a setup designed primarily to score and at the expense of everything else. It works, but again i'll contend it works due to the system and not the players.

Just watch them play, can you seriously say that Son in 2025 is a top player? Your eyes can tell you he isn't. Likewise with Johnson are you seriously going to claim he is a top player? He is so lacking every category other than finishing the system setup goal, it's painful watching him. Solanke i'm awaiting judgement because i've felt and even said from very early on this season we provide him with no supply, so sure I won't call him average yet but as an overall attack i'm sorry but I think only Spurs tinted glasses can make you think of what we see as anything but average. I'd actually argue its below average, honestly. And again that is to Ange's credit, he has made them a high scoring bunch but if his system were a little more balanced they wouldn't get near the same number of goals.

Agree with this totally - I know we disagree about Johnson who I still think has a role to play, but we need be to improve our wingers. We have our Firmino in Solanke, we are just not quite there yet with our Salah and Mane ....

 

[Spoonman]

Agree with this totally - I know we disagree about Johnson who I still think has a role to play, but we need be to improve our wingers. We have our Firmino in Solanke, we are just not quite there yet with our Salah and Mane ....

Yep. Watching the CL games this week, the wide forwards were key. Barcelona and PSG's wide men are devastating. Capable of causing carnage everytime they have the ball. I know we aren't at those teams levels but just one player with that sort of ability in the wide areas would take our attacking play up a few levels. Moore? Maybe in a couple of years.

 

[Bishop]

Yep. Watching the CL games this week, the wide forwards were key. Barcelona and PSG's wide men are devastating. Capable of causing carnage everytime they have the ball. I know we aren't at those teams levels but just one player with that sort of ability in the wide areas would take our attacking play up a few levels. Moore? Maybe in a couple of years.

There are literally light years of difference between the wide men of the teams you mentioned and our own, yet we essentially try to play a budget version of that football and people question why it's not working.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Yep. Watching the CL games this week, the wide forwards were key. Barcelona and PSG's wide men are devastating. Capable of causing carnage everytime they have the ball. I know we aren't at those teams levels but just one player with that sort of ability in the wide areas would take our attacking play up a few levels. Moore? Maybe in a couple of years.

The way those teams play and their wide players are actually better than any side in our league
It’s why they are likely to be the CL finalists

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Agree with this totally - I know we disagree about Johnson who I still think has a role to play, but we need be to improve our wingers. We have our Firmino in Solanke, we are just not quite there yet with our Salah and Mane ....

I don’t get why Moore hasn’t been used more
Even in cameos
I see Odebert being favoured but his first rich is really bad (saw him for France under 21s and all the balls we’re in front of him and he was brilliant)
Moore can pass really well too
Just odd for me