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Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

glasgowspur said:
After the crowd turned on him and started chanting against him after was it three months?
Since before we moved into the new stadium all I've heard from fans is that we need a rebuild, we need to start fresh with new ideas and new personnel, it will take time but it will be worth it.
The fans talk the talk but do not want to walk the walk.
We can clear out ange, levy might sell, we can move on Richie, son, Johnson and any other players you want to mention, but at some point we the fans need to start looking at the role we play in this.
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He gets that (Finney) but he also has his scepticism of the clubs actual commitment to it which is fair
I agree about the fans buying into it being key
We saw the fans at the poll game being bloody damn good considering. I wasn’t there for once and the worst it got the better the fans were it seems
Maybe the club need to be even more clearer that it’s a plan and a process somehow
 
Finney Is Back said:
I don't think we'd plod along around 5th place. There are too many teams really trying to raise the bar and spend up to (and even beyond) their financial fair play limits to do all they can to improve their football performance. Liverpool, Emirates Marketing Project, Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd, Aston Villa and Saudi Sportswashing Machine are all more ambitious clubs than we are in terms of what resources they will put into the football team. There are then the clever clubs who run much much better recruitment departments than us as well. Any manager that can get us consistent 5th place finishes is doing really, really well.
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Saudi Sportswashing Machine, villa and to a greater extent the likes of forest, Brighton, Bournemouth are not sustainable and will drop away.
They don't have the money or infrastructure to maintain what they are doing just now, we do.
If we can build on the solid base we have and not panic every time there is a mistep then it will happen for us.


Apologies for the bold, I stopped to make a cuppa and now everything is in bold !
 
Bedfordspurs said:
He gets that (Finney) but he also has his scepticism of the clubs actual commitment to it which is fair
I agree about the fans buying into it being key
We saw the fans at the poll game being bloody damn good considering. I wasn’t there for once and the worst it got the better the fans were it seems
Maybe the club need to be even more clearer that it’s a plan and a process somehow
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I was supplementing his post, not arguing with it.
The club really could handle this better by saying this is a process, it's not going as well as we would like but we are determined to see it through.
 
glasgowspur said:
After the crowd turned on him and started chanting against him after was it three months?
Since before we moved into the new stadium all I've heard from fans is that we need a rebuild, we need to start fresh with new ideas and new personnel, it will take time but it will be worth it.
The fans talk the talk but do not want to walk the walk.
We can clear out ange, levy might sell, we can move on Richie, son, Johnson and any other players you want to mention, but at some point we the fans need to start looking at the role we play in this.
Click to expand...
The crowd actually turned on Levy/ENIC. The bloke who does the cartoons in the Guardian portrayed it beautifully.
 
I'm not sure I'm enjoying some of the narratives about the youngsters actually.

The reason we are where we are is because of manager tactics and injuries, not because of the young guns. They done more than just pull their weight in recent times. They've been some of our better players.

It's like the Neto vs Odobert argument. First of all, we did go for Neto and didn't get him. By the time we went in for Odobert, the Neto deal was done and dusted. We went for a youngster who had a year's worth of PL experience and had played fantastically. Let's be honest, the injury could have just been Neto, as Odobert, in our colours.

What we should be doing now is seriously questioning these tactics. I've said this before, but if I gave Ange the choice of his best 22 players in the world could he win the PL? I'm now seriously doubting that. Ange would have the best number 6 in the world and tell him to spend half the game as an 8 or 10 and the other half as an inverted full-back. He would have the best 2 wingers in the world and tell them that some of the time his number 10 would go on the wing and he would need to come inside and play centre mid. He would have the best 2 full backs in the world and tell them that he is going to get them fitter than ever because they won't be spending much time at full-backs. They'll be expected to become modern day Messi's and pick pockets from the number 10 position.

Also, Ange couldn't even have some of the best players in the world because they wouldn't work in his system. Example, no point being the classiest and most intelligent centre half in the world unless you can run like Usain Bolt.

We really need to take stock here. Let's start looking at what is really happening in this setup. Ange and his tactics have everything to prove in the PL. I don't actually care if they've worked in the other places he's worked.
 
glasgowspur said:
Saudi Sportswashing Machine, villa and to a greater extent the likes of forest, Brighton, Bournemouth are not sustainable and will drop away.
They don't have the money or infrastructure to maintain what they are doing just now, we do.
If we can build on the solid base we have and not panic every time there is a mistep then it will happen for us.


Apologies for the bold, I stopped to make a cuppa and now everything is in bold !
Click to expand...
I didn't include Forest in the post I made (though they are an example of a club where the owner's main focus is trying to make the football team, as good as possible as opposed to the asset valuation being the primary concern.

Brighton and Bournemouth know they need to be cleverer than the other clubs and therefore operate really, really well. We haven't bothered to put in recruitment structures like they have (the buck stops at the CEO for that at Spurs IMO).

Why do you think that Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Villa are not operating in a sustainable way? Not every PL football club is owned by people who care solely about their asset valuation. Some are happy to operate right at the maximum FFP level as opposed to operating many, many tens of millions below that.
 
Baleforce said:
You don’t, because if they are willing to listen to other offers they have mentally checked out already.

You get rid of them, and replace them with someone dedicated.
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LOL.... Great people always attract counter bids. That happens because they are great people that add value. A person being offered more money elsewhere hasn't checked out at all, they are merely trying to maximise their earning potential.

If THFC run a model where they feel that everyone at the club has to want to work for the club at the expense of earning more elsewhere then we've got to the root cause of our problems. You'll never keep great people that way.
 
Finney Is Back said:
LOL.... Great people always attract counter bids. That happens because they are great people that add value. A person being offered more money elsewhere hasn't checked out at all, they are merely trying to maximise their earning potential.

If THFC run a model where they feel that everyone at the club has to want to work for the club at the expense of earning more elsewhere then we've got to the root cause of our problems. You'll never keep great people that way.
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I disagree, I’ve managed large IT teams for years, whenever someone has come to me saying they have had an offer, they are thinking about it because it’s more money/better title/less hours and they want to know if I can match it. I always say the same, congrats, I’m pleased for you, I’ll just need the normal letter of notice/resignation.

I’ve never regretted it. Nobody is irreplaceable.
 
Finney Is Back said:
I didn't include Forest in the post I made (though they are an example of a club where the owner's main focus is trying to make the football team, as good as possible as opposed to the asset valuation being the primary concern.

Brighton and Bournemouth know they need to be cleverer than the other clubs and therefore operate really, really well. We haven't bothered to put in recruitment structures like they have (the buck stops at the CEO for that at Spurs IMO).

Why do you think that Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Villa are not operating in a sustainable way? Not every PL football club is owned by people who care solely about their asset valuation. Some are happy to operate right at the maximum FFP level as opposed to operating many, many tens of millions below that.
Click to expand...

Just to be clear I'm not saying it is not sustainable and they will go broke.
But it's not sustainable for them to have the level of "success" that they are having just now.
They've pumped money in, well that's the easy bit.
They reaped or are reaping the rewards.

Villa were taken over over four, five years ago?
Made CL and not really done much else, they're very hit and miss.
Saudi Sportswashing Machine, got loads of money, supposedly, again can't sustain any kind of form. As likely to go on a good run as a bad one.
Forest are riding a wave, good luck to them. Will be midtable again soon enough. Fans will lap up that kind of football when it's going well, not so much when it isn't. And now they've tasted "glory" the fall out when their level drops while be all the more painful.
Working to the ffp limit is great if it brings you success, soon losses it's shine when it doesn't.
How long will villa and Saudi Sportswashing Machine keep pumping in money to fight it out for the dregs?
 
Baleforce said:
I disagree, I’ve managed large IT teams for years, whenever someone has come to me saying they have had an offer, they are thinking about it because it’s more money/better title/less hours and they want to know if I can match it. I always say the same, congrats, I’m pleased for you, I’ll just need the normal letter of notice/resignation.

I’ve never regretted it. Nobody is irreplaceable.
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Exactly what we should have done with kane and Eriksen.
 
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