Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

[Bedfordspurs]

Liverpool could and probably would have won also if their goal wasn't incorrectly ruled offside whilst they had 10 men.

They could have
But we were talking about playing with 9 men so kinda irrelevant to that part do the convo
I thought we were the better side at that point anyway
We have won games with 10 men recently by being brave

 

[Bishop]

They could have
But we were talking about playing with 9 men so kinda irrelevant to that part do the convo
I thought we were the better side at that point anyway
We have won games with 10 men recently by being brave

In the Liverpool game? I felt the momentum had swung their tbh.

The Chelsea game I agree we were the better side despite only having 9 men and almost got the lead back despite that. I think we can have been a bit more balanced and possibly would have won it. Playing such a high line with Diet and Royal was a recipe for disaster.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

In the Liverpool game? I felt the momentum had swung their tbh.

The Chelsea game I agree we were the better side despite only having 9 men and almost got the lead back despite that. I think we can have been a bit more balanced and possibly would have won it. Playing such a high line with Diet and Royal was a recipe for disaster.

No the Liverpool game
I thought we were on top
Same when they had 11 men
Again Chelsea with 9 men we created some great chances too because of the way we played
The high line was part of that and stopped os many other attacks. I guess if we had more Centre backs to bring on Ange may have thought of going slightly more .defensive but i doubt it

 

[Grays_1890]

No the Liverpool game
I thought we were on top
Same when they had 11 men
Again Chelsea with 9 men we created some great chances too because of the way we played
The high line was part of that and stopped os many other attacks. I guess if we had more Centre backs to bring on Ange may have thought of going slightly more .defensive but i doubt it

The Chelsea stuff always gets my goat, people still use it as a stick to beat Ange with, see it alot still on social media, but being honest 9 men lose against 11 men, you sit back for 45 mins you get picked off equally, so going brave and for it was a free hit IMO and a chance that early to show abit of bravery and cement a mentality

 

[Bedfordspurs]

The Chelsea stuff always gets my goat, people still use it as a stick to beat Ange with, see it alot still on social media, but being honest 9 men lose against 11 men, you sit back for 45 mins you get picked off equally, so going brave and for it was a free hit IMO and a chance that early to show abit of bravery and cement a mentality

Yeah but we have a lot of fans who think we need to be more defensive
A lot of my mates moaning are the same ones who moaned about conte and mourinho
They all want perfection but don’t what to give it time

 

[Muttley]

Yeah but we have a lot of fans who think we need to be more defensive
A lot of my mates moaning are the same ones who moaned about conte and mourinho
They all want perfection but don’t what to give it time

Even what you say though feels a generalisation about fans opinions. The net, net is that we did concede over 60 goals last season and I genuinely believe that fans want to see that reduced down to top levels (<40???). I do think that some of us fans want us to be smarter at defending, but also like Ange's attacking principles. It really is only tweaking the current tactical system and I think that is a fair ask in season 2. I also think it is slowly happening as well.

I also don't really see that where we are now is worth comparing to Jose and Conte whose football was turgid. I do read the occasional "Ange out" comment but they really are few and far between.

One man's opinion.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Even what you say though feels a generalisation about fans opinions. The net, net is that we did concede over 60 goals last season and I genuinely believe that fans want to see that reduced down to top levels (<40???). I do think that some of us fans want us to be smarter at defending, but also like Ange's attacking principles. It really is only tweaking the current tactical system and I think that is a fair ask in season 2. I also think it is slowly happening as well.

I also don't really see that where we are now is worth comparing to Jose and Conte whose football was turgid. I do read the occasional "Ange out" comment but they really are few and far between.

One man's opinion.

As I said .. a lot of fans
It’s not everyone
But there are a lot who still don’t get/like/want Ange ball
That’s their choice and opinion
We had the second best defence in The league before the Brighton Game
If that’s a one off then I think we should consider it that.. we don’t know yet

 

[DeanoAustin]

They lost by a last-minute own goal after we toiled and toiled playing into their hands quite stupidly most of the time by always trying to attack through the centre and by crossing high into the box for the giant CBs to lap up. I was impressed with Liverpool in that game. Chalk and cheese how they played with 9 men vs how we did, no comparison excpet one last by a last minute own-goal and the other lost by getting ultimately smashed and gifting the space to Chelsea's brick forwards.

I indeed haven't forgotten who we were missing in the Chelsea game after the sending-offs and injuries, yet we played as though nothing had changed...

I thought Liverpool were absolutely tremendous against us, they fought like lions to protect their box. We were very very fortunate.

On the Chelsea game, I came out of the stadium that night proud as punch and thoroughly entertained. I never thought I’d have an ounce of pride in a 4-1 defeat especially to them.

Fact of the matter is that if you play any amount of time with 9, you’re likely to lose whatever you do. In fairness to Ange, he went down absolutely swinging and it was a joy to watch.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I thought Liverpool were absolutely tremendous against us, they fought like lions to protect their box. We were very very fortunate.

On the Chelsea game, I came out of the stadium that night proud as punch and thoroughly entertained. I never thought I’d have an ounce of pride in a 4-1 defeat especially to them.

Fact of the matter is that if you play any amount of time with 9, you’re likely to lose whatever you do. In fairness to Ange, he went down absolutely swinging and it was a joy to watch.

They did fight
They had a team of defenders on to do just that
It almost worked
But ultimately having too many defenders cost them

 

[DeanoAustin]

They did fight
They had a team of defenders on to do just that
It almost worked
But ultimately having too many defenders cost them

Don't think you could fault Klopp for his approach no more than you can fault Ange for his. Odds are you're getting beaten either way so it's a free hit for me.

Think two red cards probably cost them more than anything Klopp did to be honest.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Don't think you could fault Klopp for his approach no more than you can fault Ange for his. Odds are you're getting beaten either way so it's a free hit for me.

Think two red cards probably cost them more than anything Klopp did to be honest.

Course they did
He had 9 men
But he chose to defend rather than attack some think that was the way to play
Some think it wasn’t
Neither got a result because 9 men don’t get results in elite football unless their playing a vastly inferior side

 

[Cundies undies]

I'll be upfront here, I fudging hate Ange, I despise him, his press conferences to me are a chore to watch and he comes across as a bully, I'd rather punch the fudger than have a pint with him, mate.
I never liked him nor fancied for the job.

However I'm shortly turning 50, have been a spurs supporter (or victim) since ive been able to toddle.
It hurts me to say, we need to give him time, I dont think we will finsh in a euro qualifier position this season, Angeball will ensure that, but maybe, maybe he will learn to be a little "pragmatic" and drop the def line, just 3 yards will do...

I wrote this season off after 3 games, I am also willing to do the same for next season, but that comes with a caveat.
We have the same manager in place.
If DL wants to pull the trigger early, well, thats his prerogative. It also says he didnt really back him. As far as I am concerned there is no room for not backing a freshly appointed manager, especially when its a 5 year project.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I'll be upfront here, I fudging hate Ange, I despise him, his press conferences to me are a chore to watch and he comes across as a bully, I'd rather punch the fudger than have a pint with him, mate.
I never liked him nor fancied for the job.

However I'm shortly turning 50, have been a spurs supporter (or victim) since ive been able to toddle.
It hurts me to say, we need to give him time, I dont think we will finsh in a euro qualifier position this season, Angeball will ensure that, but maybe, maybe he will learn to be a little "pragmatic" and drop the def line, just 3 yards will do...

I wrote this season off after 3 games, I am also willing to do the same for next season, but that comes with a caveat.
We have the same manager in place.
If DL wants to pull the trigger early, well, thats his prerogative. It also says he didnt really back him. As far as I am concerned there is no room for not backing a freshly appointed manager, especially when its a 5 year project.

I don’t agree with where you think we will be this season, but I fully agree about your principles on the appointment
And credit wire it’s due, your being honest in your views yet also recognise what needs to happen

 

[Muttley]

On the Chelsea game, I came out of the stadium that night proud as punch and thoroughly entertained. I never thought I’d have an ounce of pride in a 4-1 defeat especially to them.

Fact of the matter is that if you play any amount of time with 9, you’re likely to lose whatever you do. In fairness to Ange, he went down absolutely swinging and it was a joy to watch.

For me, it was the next 4 games that we learned more from, in the 1 point from 15 run including the Chelsea game at the start of it.

I guess you always do when your squad is stretched to it's limit. You learn about who your manager rates, what tactics they will deploy and which young guns they trust.

I still genuinely feel that the guy that lost out the most was Ashley Phillips. I reckon Ange would have thrown him in, but for his injury at Eng U19 level at the same time.

 

[braineclipse]

Even what you say though feels a generalisation about fans opinions. The net, net is that we did concede over 60 goals last season and I genuinely believe that fans want to see that reduced down to top levels (<40???). I do think that some of us fans want us to be smarter at defending, but also like Ange's attacking principles. It really is only tweaking the current tactical system and I think that is a fair ask in season 2. I also think it is slowly happening as well.

I also don't really see that where we are now is worth comparing to Jose and Conte whose football was turgid. I do read the occasional "Ange out" comment but they really are few and far between.

One man's opinion.

I think most people agree that we have to concede fewer goals. Various ways to achieve that and various opinions on what Ange should do to achieve that.

Had we been turgid, as we were for spells at least under those two, and had gotten the results we have gotten this season and in the second half of last season I think the "Ange out" voices would be stronger and more numerous.

It's one of the things I like about this approach. It does give Ange a little bit more time to get it right, because nothing like disappointing results and boring football to get a manager out the door quicker.

I also like the approach for other reasons just to be clear. I think the development path for the team and the players is better with this kind of approach.

 

[braineclipse]

I think I agree....the variety of potential outcomes does appear to linger throughout many (most) of our matches.

This is part of what still really excites me about the future under Ange. The changes necessary to skew that significantly to where it goes on our favour significantly more often may be difficult and may take time. But the potential in this team, in this system and under this manager is massive if that can be sorted out.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

This is part of what still really excites me about the future under Ange. The changes necessary to skew that significantly to where it goes on our favour significantly more often may be difficult and may take time. But the potential in this team, in this system and under this manager is massive if that can be sorted out.

The two question marks against it succeeding is 1. Is the quality of player it takes to get it close to perfection beyond our means (£). Or can great coaching, canny player selection surmount that?
2. Is the tactic/approach doomed to failure in the first place due to the quality of the league (using the benchmark that you probably can only lose 3or4 games if your aim is league winners).

We have to try though...we have a great setup, our finances are solid and can provide enough, if combined with smart operation, which although not 100% proven yet, looks like we are moving towards. And of course, the manager, a decent human being, with an endearing view of the game, laser focus and determination.

 

[braineclipse]

The two question marks against it succeeding is 1. Is the quality of player it takes to get it close to perfection beyond our means (£). Or can great coaching, canny player selection surmount that?
2. Is the tactic/approach doomed to failure in the first place due to the quality of the league (using the benchmark that you probably can only lose 3or4 games if your aim is league winners).

We have to try though...we have a great setup, our finances are solid and can provide enough, if combined with smart operation, which although not 100% proven yet, looks like we are moving towards. And of course, the manager, a decent human being, with an endearing view of the game, laser focus and determination.

Fully agreed.

1. Maybe, but definitely possible to improve in that direction.

2. I don't think so, but perhaps depends somewhat on the first question as well. And as you say still worth trying.

For me a third related question is where would failure leave us? It's not all because of Ange, but under him we seem to attracting great talented players. We're giving game time to and imo developing young talented players that can succeed also under other managers in the future if Ange fails to really succeed.

Even if he fails he would most likely leave us in a significantly stronger position than we were when he took over. That's a good thing no matter what.

 

[glorygloryeze]

We lost that game in added minutes. Dier was robbed of a fantastic equalizer by the narrowest of margins. That game was an important statement IMO; of course, the statement was only worth it if everyone believed!

IIRC going into added minutes we were already 2-1 down as they had scored on 75 minutes; maybe what you meant to say is that we lost two further goals in added time to make the score look more of a pasting?
Agreed we nearly amazingly equalised but for a tight VAR call.

What was the important statement you refer to? Also, who did and did not believe it?

 

[glorygloryeze]

I'll be upfront here, I fudging hate Ange, I despise him, his press conferences to me are a chore to watch and he comes across as a bully, I'd rather punch the fudger than have a pint with him, mate.
I never liked him nor fancied for the job.

However I'm shortly turning 50, have been a spurs supporter (or victim) since ive been able to toddle.
It hurts me to say, we need to give him time, I dont think we will finsh in a euro qualifier position this season, Angeball will ensure that, but maybe, maybe he will learn to be a little "pragmatic" and drop the def line, just 3 yards will do...

I wrote this season off after 3 games, I am also willing to do the same for next season, but that comes with a caveat.
We have the same manager in place.
If DL wants to pull the trigger early, well, thats his prerogative. It also says he didnt really back him. As far as I am concerned there is no room for not backing a freshly appointed manager, especially when its a 5 year project.

Very fair points, especially the last paragraph