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Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

DeanoAustin said:
We contributed to it for sure but some of their play and passing was abysmal. And they didn't seem to have a plan for how to play through our press.

When we lose, the reactions can be extreme. I feel people are getting a little carried away with themselves on the back on Sunday. It was a great win, we absolutely dingdonged them, we were a great watch. But how good we really are won't be defined solely by Sunday. It'll be whether we can now reproduce that sort of performance against teams that set up to really frustrate us and teams that are better than us. As you said to me earlier in the season, let's see where we are after a dozen or 15 games.
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It’s well worth looking at the stats for our pressing and ball recovery from this game
They are exceptional
And this game does 5 fix anything
Minimum of 10 games to judge for sure
The key now is we have the style of play and players who seem to finally get it
 
Bedfordspurs said:
It’s well worth looking at the stats for our pressing and ball recovery from this game
They are exceptional
And this game does 5 fix anything
Minimum of 10 games to judge for sure
The key now is we have the style of play and players who seem to finally get it
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Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought we were brilliant particularly when they had 11. It was even better than Leicester first half when we looked a very powerful and dominant side. And we have been a great watch in every league game this season (potentially Woolwich aside).

If we do maintain that level of performance, we'll all be very happy albeit I'm not sure that suits my personality. I'll have to find something else to bitch about :)
 
Raziel said:
His post match interview he stated that in training Ange emphasized the threat United would have is the counter, and that everyone needed to be aware, and yes, it's the most I've seen Johnson defend, one he cleared a ball in the box, great awareness



That is an utter hindsight statement, United is exactly the type of side we are worse suited for, they don't care about possession, happy in that mid-block, habit of raising their game for top opponents, they are best suited for counter/transitions and have the pace/individual quality to hurt you. That first half was extraordinary, if you didn't know you would have said we were playing a side two leagues below.

I don't think Ange has anything to prove on the system on a per game scenario, the sterner test is consistency, this system works, and when it works well it's capable of results like against United. Can we get this to work more games than not? can we get this to play out in a cup run?
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You're right that as a counter based side United were on paper a damaged but honestly I said before the match they are brick. There was no way we should ever be losing to them because despite them being counter based it's uncoordinated. They play moments and individual based football. There's no system in place, it's just get the ball run and hope someone else is on the same wavelength when you get close to the opposition box.

So on paper a threat yes but only possible due to our own ineptitude and not due to any actual quality united don't posses.
 
Bishop said:
You're right that as a counter based side United were on paper a damaged but honestly I said before the match they are brick. There was no way we should ever be losing to them because despite them being counter based it's uncoordinated. They play moments and individual based football. There's no system in place, it's just get the ball run and hope someone else is on the same wavelength when you get close to the opposition box.

So on paper a threat yes but only possible due to our own ineptitude and not due to any actual quality united don't posses.
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The fear is their badge
Not the players
 
DeanoAustin said:
Not hindsight at all. I had said to a couple of my mates before the game that if United are open we could smash them, if they play against us like they did in the cup final against City, they would probably beat us. It’d be a very brave United manager who would play like that at OT v Spurs though.

As it was, United were a mess, very open and coughed up possession time and again. It was a great performance by us, and we contributed to their poor play in a big way but the game proved little in the scheme of things for me.

Let’s see how we go against teams who set up to stop us and hit us on the counter.
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That's exactly what Man Utd were trying to do
 
DeanoAustin said:
We contributed to it for sure but some of their play and passing was abysmal. And they didn't seem to have a plan for how to play through our press.

When we lose, the reactions can be extreme. I feel people are getting a little carried away with themselves on the back on Sunday. It was a great win, we absolutely dingdonged them, we were a great watch. But how good we really are won't be defined solely by Sunday. It'll be whether we can now reproduce that sort of performance against teams that set up to really frustrate us and teams that are better than us. As you said to me earlier in the season, let's see where we are after a dozen or 15 games.
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Man Utd's plan was to go long and get in behind us. The problem was that our pressing was so effective their players rarely had the time to pick out a good ball over the top into the space.
 
DeanoAustin said:
Well, if that's what it was, they couldn't have done it any worse. You stop us by being compact. They were anything but...first goal is a great illustration of that.
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Frist goal was effectively a counter attack from us.

Man Utd did not really engage at all in a press against us. They tried to keep the middle of the pitch occupied to cut out the danger of our inverted full backs. Our full backs instead got themselvse higher and wider, which occupied Man Utd's two wide forwards and gave space in the middle for Bentancur or Maddison to get on the ball.

I was pleased to see us change our shape a little at the weekend to counter teams who have got wise to us overloading the centre with our fullbacks.

Man Utd were poor I know. However they were trying to play the defensive oriented, counter attacking game that we have been struggling against. Our situational high press and adjustment of the positions our full backs took up when we were in possession in our own half really helped us here.
 
Finney Is Back said:
Frist goal was effectively a counter attack from us.

Man Utd did not really engage at all in a press against us. They tried to keep the middle of the pitch occupied to cut out the danger of our inverted full backs. Our full backs instead got themselvse higher and wider, which occupied Man Utd's two wide forwards and gave space in the middle for Bentancur or Maddison to get on the ball.

I was pleased to see us change our shape a little at the weekend to counter teams who have got wise to us overloading the centre with our fullbacks.

Man Utd were poor I know. However they were trying to play the defensive oriented, counter attacking game that we have been struggling against. Our situational high press and adjustment of the positions our full backs took up when we were in possession in our own half really helped us here.
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They've 7 outfield players behind the ball when VdV wins it. You also have a massive gap between Dalot and De Ligt that VdV strolls through. Man U were anything but compact.

I'll take your word on their game plan but I didn't pick that up from watching the game. I struggled to understand exactly what they were trying to do. Even on the second goal, we end up with 4 against 3 or 4 of their players. I'm not taking away from how good we were but if United were trying to be compact and play counter attacking football we'll encounter teams this season that do it a hundred times more effectively. Those games will be a better test of where we are under Ange.
 
DeanoAustin said:
We contributed to it for sure but some of their play and passing was abysmal. And they didn't seem to have a plan for how to play through our press.

When we lose, the reactions can be extreme. I feel people are getting a little carried away with themselves on the back on Sunday. It was a great win, we absolutely dingdonged them, we were a great watch. But how good we really are won't be defined solely by Sunday. It'll be whether we can now reproduce that sort of performance against teams that set up to really frustrate us and teams that are better than us. As you said to me earlier in the season, let's see where we are after a dozen or 15 games.
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I agree as much as a love beaTing Utd its a work in progress and it will so for a while yet and too many fans [IM0] are reading to much into our season so far. Doom and gloom about our start and now the opposite after a win against Utd.

I have heard fans say Ange is not up to managing a Prem team and now as you say some are getting carried away after TRASHING Utd i hate the bastards, Utd i mean not some fans.
 
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parklane1 said:
I agree as much as a love beaTing Utd its a work in progress and it will so for a while yet and too many fans [IM0] are reading to much into our season so far. Doom and gloom about our start and now the opposite after a win against Utd.

I have heard fans say Ange is not up to managing a Prem team and now as you say some are getting carried away after THRASING Utd i hate the bastards, Utd i mean not some fans.
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You seem to hate United more than you hate Woolwich or Chelsea?
 
parklane1 said:
I may have got this wrong but i tend to remember it being El Tel.
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Ah, i certainly thin k he was the last one that did the double on them, in Gary Lineker's first season with us. I think IIRC he won 3 games in total against them that season, one of which was the league cup.

I don't think he went three league games unbeaten against them though..
 
glorygloryeze said:
Ah, i certainly thin k he was the last one that did the double on them, in Gary Lineker's first season with us. I think IIRC he won 3 games in total against them that season, one of which was the league cup.

I don't think he went three league games unbeaten against them though..
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My memory is not as good as it was:(, first game i saw Spurs against Utd was in the semi final in 1962 and there have been a lot of defeats since then. Bogey club[along with Liverpool] over the years for us.
 
Surfless said:
If you watch it back it's not a terrible pass, but he misses the first contact and it slips away from him. A rationale settled centre half, given the quality of the opposition, would try to recover legitimately, and if we concede should have the presence to realise he's better value on the pitch and a goal down than 10 men after 8 minutes.

The reality is he's young, he's not played much and he's a fair way from having the necessary confidence to play our way..... Yet. He's very highly rated and intelligent so with time (manager affords this, fans less so) he can become a power house for us.
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My question is how many times in his life (boy to man) has Dragu found himself in a position where he has no "out-ball" to either full-back? Would his body shape been the same if he knew it was either keeper or take the man on? I think we have to remember that one year ago, this kid was playing on the right of a back three. I think these positions he finds himself in Ange-ball are alien to him. They won't be for too long.

Yes, he messed up and probably got a hug from his manager. He'll know next time to give it to Venom and receive it in a wide area and keep the ball moving.
 
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