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Vlad Chiriches
- Thread starter Rossi22
- Start date
screen nayim
John Gorman
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
Re: Official - Chiriches
this is true
..actually thanks for that
i forgot to mention something else to braineclipse
"take a look at the CASUAL and nonchalant track back when the team is on the back foot or he's been beaten by said ball...almost like he lets others covering him deal with it"
this is true
..actually thanks for that
i forgot to mention something else to braineclipse
"take a look at the CASUAL and nonchalant track back when the team is on the back foot or he's been beaten by said ball...almost like he lets others covering him deal with it"
Kingdawson
Banned
Modric THFC
Jimmy McCormick
Re: Official - Chiriches
Personally i'd rather he would have dropped deep in both occasions. But if he's gonna go to Gnabry it cant be the half arsed effect he ended up making.
Agree with you about Rose. There's no Rose thread getting this attention because there isn't a Danny Rose manlover fan group trying to say he's better than he is. Rose has pace and nothing else in his game. Can't cross with any accuracy, average passer, not strong enough for a defender, poor positioning. He should have been let go to Sunderland when his stock was high.
Modric THFC:
Do you see the similarity between the following two situations?
(buildup to the United goal)
(buildup to the Arsenal goal)
See how in both situations there's a striker making the run in between Dawson and Chiriches. In one of these situations you want Chiriches to drop deep to track the run behind his back. In the other you want Chiriches to push up and leave the player going in behind his back.
A touch assumptive of me, but I think had Chiriches been closer to Gnabry and the pass had come for Walcott like it did for Welbeck you would have said exactly the same as you did about the Welbeck goal and been sure that Chiriches should have been tracking the runner in between the defenders. Had the pass from Januzai been hit at the United player running in front of Chiriches (in between him and the central midfielder) and a goal had resulted from that I think you might have ended up saying that Chiriches should have been closer to that player.
The point for me remains, when you get runs like that in and around the central defenders and you give opponents on the ball time to to play an accurate well timed pass all central defenders will struggle, chances and goals will result and almost as certainly as that people will be pointing fingers saying that the central defender should have been marking whatever space or player that ended up being the danger man. Despite there being multiple danger men and multiple danger areas.
The common denominator for those isn't Chiriches by the way, it's Rose. He first fails to get close to Januzai (perhaps not surprising seeing as Januzai had been getting the better of him consistently). And he completely leaves Gnabry against Arsenal, leaving our central defenders two against two against Gnabry and Walcott, not exactly a good situation. You can see from the image even how he's rushing to get back into positions knowing full well that he's marking vacant grass.
Personally i'd rather he would have dropped deep in both occasions. But if he's gonna go to Gnabry it cant be the half arsed effect he ended up making.
Agree with you about Rose. There's no Rose thread getting this attention because there isn't a Danny Rose manlover fan group trying to say he's better than he is. Rose has pace and nothing else in his game. Can't cross with any accuracy, average passer, not strong enough for a defender, poor positioning. He should have been let go to Sunderland when his stock was high.
braineclipse
Steve Sedgley
Re: Official - Chiriches
Doesn't that contradict what you said earlier?
He's in line with Dawson when the ball is played to Gnabry. How much deeper do you want him to be?
Doesn't that contradict what you said earlier?
He's in line with Dawson when the ball is played to Gnabry. How much deeper do you want him to be?
Modric THFC
Jimmy McCormick
Re: Official - Chiriches
Wasnt me that said it. I was quoting that goal analysis blog.
Against Wellbeck or Walcott, I want both him and Dawson real deep. Neither isnt much a threat apart from running into space using their pace. I dont think Gnabry himself is much of a threat running forward with the ball.
Wasnt me that said it. I was quoting that goal analysis blog.
Against Wellbeck or Walcott, I want both him and Dawson real deep. Neither isnt much a threat apart from running into space using their pace. I dont think Gnabry himself is much of a threat running forward with the ball.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Re: Official - Chiriches
You're the first person who has managed to dig deep despite not wanting to hint at it and partially admit that Dawson's position in that goal was horrific all ways. And when he sees Chiriches move up and try to stop Gnabry, all he needs to do is stay a little deeper and move to his right. Instead he gets caught trying to track a run he doesn't need to and then trying to push up when he doesn't need to. He needed to be calm and composed. He was like a chicken running around an a marble-strewn floor.
As for Rose, he cost us the August derby with a very very similar positional blunder to his positional blunder in this derby. He is a liability.
You're the first person who has managed to dig deep despite not wanting to hint at it and partially admit that Dawson's position in that goal was horrific all ways. And when he sees Chiriches move up and try to stop Gnabry, all he needs to do is stay a little deeper and move to his right. Instead he gets caught trying to track a run he doesn't need to and then trying to push up when he doesn't need to. He needed to be calm and composed. He was like a chicken running around an a marble-strewn floor.
As for Rose, he cost us the August derby with a very very similar positional blunder to his positional blunder in this derby. He is a liability.
IulianSteaua
Jose Dominguez
Re: Official - Chiriches
The second pick was taken a little late, the free man was actually Dawson's man 2 seconds before the pick was made, you wouldn't know it looking at this pick, that's how fast the striker lost him. If you are in between the ball and the striker you literally depend on how good the pass is, that is why in the 1st lesson as a defender you learn to stay behind the striker. Dawson was the one that should have just stayed with his man, it's that simple, in the arsenal pick Chiriches just can't let the man with the ball go forward and enter the box with the ball, someone has to challenge him, there is absolutely no one there except him. You don't leave the man with the ball clear on goal because you follow another striker who isn't even you're man it's absolutely rubbish for him to get blamed on that action, shows some people know nothing, or very little about football tactically ...Modric THFC:
Do you see the similarity between the following two situations?
(buildup to the United goal)
(buildup to the Arsenal goal)
See how in both situations there's a striker making the run in between Dawson and Chiriches. In one of these situations you want Chiriches to drop deep to track the run behind his back. In the other you want Chiriches to push up and leave the player going in behind his back.
A touch assumptive of me, but I think had Chiriches been closer to Gnabry and the pass had come for Walcott like it did for Welbeck you would have said exactly the same as you did about the Welbeck goal and been sure that Chiriches should have been tracking the runner in between the defenders. Had the pass from Januzai been hit at the United player running in front of Chiriches (in between him and the central midfielder) and a goal had resulted from that I think you might have ended up saying that Chiriches should have been closer to that player.
The point for me remains, when you get runs like that in and around the central defenders and you give opponents on the ball time to to play an accurate well timed pass all central defenders will struggle, chances and goals will result and almost as certainly as that people will be pointing fingers saying that the central defender should have been marking whatever space or player that ended up being the danger man. Despite there being multiple danger men and multiple danger areas.
The common denominator for those isn't Chiriches by the way, it's Rose. He first fails to get close to Januzai (perhaps not surprising seeing as Januzai had been getting the better of him consistently). And he completely leaves Gnabry against Arsenal, leaving our central defenders two against two against Gnabry and Walcott, not exactly a good situation. You can see from the image even how he's rushing to get back into positions knowing full well that he's marking vacant grass.
metalgear
Luka Modric
Re: Official - Chiriches
That would invite the shot and doesn't negate the risk; its pretty easy to turn and wrong foot a backpedalling defender.
To me a DM should be chasing the opponent down but we seem to lack that discipline/player selection these days.
1-striker should be countered with two defenders, spare one looking out for the cutback assist
2 strikers should be countered with 3 defenders; could be the wingbacks if the CB pushes forwards, or the DM as part of a defensive triangle with the two CBs
That would invite the shot and doesn't negate the risk; its pretty easy to turn and wrong foot a backpedalling defender.
To me a DM should be chasing the opponent down but we seem to lack that discipline/player selection these days.
1-striker should be countered with two defenders, spare one looking out for the cutback assist
2 strikers should be countered with 3 defenders; could be the wingbacks if the CB pushes forwards, or the DM as part of a defensive triangle with the two CBs
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Kingdawson
Banned
JerusalemMan
Chris Perry
Re: Official - Chiriches
Well, I think that ended the argument pretty emphatically.
Well, I think that ended the argument pretty emphatically.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Re: Official - Chiriches
I've watched this a dozen times. Eriksen's pathetic shuffle towards Sagna starts it all, and as for Rose (as we've said) mugged again. Having said all of that, I absolutely cannot fathom why Daws didn't step across towards Cazorla/that side, realizing that any through ball would see Walnut offside. Instead he half-tracks Walnut and then steps UP TOWARDS Gnabry who already has Walker by then on his shoulder!!!!! In fact, right before Gnabry plays that pass, Walker looks like he's about to slide across and try to block the ball but Daws is in the way (no man's land) whence Walker has to then sprint across and try to block Cazorla. Dawns should've moved over there earlier. He had no need to track Walnut's run as he would've been clearly offside. We all see things differently, I get that, but I've watched this many many times and it still adds up the same way to me.
I've watched this a dozen times. Eriksen's pathetic shuffle towards Sagna starts it all, and as for Rose (as we've said) mugged again. Having said all of that, I absolutely cannot fathom why Daws didn't step across towards Cazorla/that side, realizing that any through ball would see Walnut offside. Instead he half-tracks Walnut and then steps UP TOWARDS Gnabry who already has Walker by then on his shoulder!!!!! In fact, right before Gnabry plays that pass, Walker looks like he's about to slide across and try to block the ball but Daws is in the way (no man's land) whence Walker has to then sprint across and try to block Cazorla. Dawns should've moved over there earlier. He had no need to track Walnut's run as he would've been clearly offside. We all see things differently, I get that, but I've watched this many many times and it still adds up the same way to me.
screen nayim
John Gorman
screen nayim
John Gorman
Re: Official - Chiriches
Tottenham 2 Crystal Palace 0 | Post Match Analysis
Says it all...
Spurs’ defence simply put, is not very good at the moment. They seem to be caught in a weird transition from AVB’s defensive system and a less complex counter-attacking system from the looks of it. Crystal Palace like many teams this season found it ridiculously easy to play 1 direct ball into either channel with a willing runner like Jerome or Chamakh chasing it down. Chiriches and Dawson are often too far expanded from each other and neither covers the other effectively. The majority of the time it seemed as if Chiriches’ side has been targeted, as it is common knowledge that Dawson does not have the pace or mobility to fulfill his covering duties in this high-line defensive block. Also, one wonders how Sherwood can persist with this high-line with next to no pressure on the ball. Spurs do not press anymore and are being badly exposed. In fact, Crystal Palace created 7 total chances in open play and were it not for some woeful finishing could have scored a couple of goals. With all due respect to Palace, if they can create chances so easily against this Tottenham team, what would a top quality side have done to them on Saturday?
http://eplindex.com/47861/tottenham-20-crystal-palace-post-game-analysis.html
Tottenham 2 Crystal Palace 0 | Post Match Analysis
Says it all...
Spurs’ defence simply put, is not very good at the moment. They seem to be caught in a weird transition from AVB’s defensive system and a less complex counter-attacking system from the looks of it. Crystal Palace like many teams this season found it ridiculously easy to play 1 direct ball into either channel with a willing runner like Jerome or Chamakh chasing it down. Chiriches and Dawson are often too far expanded from each other and neither covers the other effectively. The majority of the time it seemed as if Chiriches’ side has been targeted, as it is common knowledge that Dawson does not have the pace or mobility to fulfill his covering duties in this high-line defensive block. Also, one wonders how Sherwood can persist with this high-line with next to no pressure on the ball. Spurs do not press anymore and are being badly exposed. In fact, Crystal Palace created 7 total chances in open play and were it not for some woeful finishing could have scored a couple of goals. With all due respect to Palace, if they can create chances so easily against this Tottenham team, what would a top quality side have done to them on Saturday?
http://eplindex.com/47861/tottenham-20-crystal-palace-post-game-analysis.html
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
Re: Official - Chiriches
I simply don't believe that the intention is to play a high line and not press. The two options just don't compute with each other. It's more likely that against Palace for example we were supposed to press but they were just so much better than us that it looked like we weren't even trying. Which is pretty much what happened.
I simply don't believe that the intention is to play a high line and not press. The two options just don't compute with each other. It's more likely that against Palace for example we were supposed to press but they were just so much better than us that it looked like we weren't even trying. Which is pretty much what happened.
tynesidespur
Terry Yorath
Re: Official - Chiriches
what I am seeing in both of those pictures is one centre-half on the half turn ready to anticipate danger (regardless of his lack of pace). The other centre-half is square-on and has no idea what is going around or behind him. Chriches needs to alter his body position when facing the ball imo.
what I am seeing in both of those pictures is one centre-half on the half turn ready to anticipate danger (regardless of his lack of pace). The other centre-half is square-on and has no idea what is going around or behind him. Chriches needs to alter his body position when facing the ball imo.
Re: Official - Chiriches
The Palace players ran themselves ragged in the first half, same as with Southampton and their pressing style, making it easy for us to dominate in the second half. If you're playing more or less the same XI in every game it will come back to haunt you. It's important to pace yourself somewhat to last the full 90 minutes, though not necessarily to the levels we saw under AVB.
The Palace players ran themselves ragged in the first half, same as with Southampton and their pressing style, making it easy for us to dominate in the second half. If you're playing more or less the same XI in every game it will come back to haunt you. It's important to pace yourself somewhat to last the full 90 minutes, though not necessarily to the levels we saw under AVB.