• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Vlad Chiriches

Re: Official - Chiriches

braineclipse said:
I thought we were talking about his pace?

Dawson and Vertonghen is an alright partnership to me. Vertonghen is clearly our best defender at the moment imo, when he is fit and back playing as a centre back anyone who wants to play centre back is competing to play next to him.

Kaboul and Dawson has never looked good so I'm not sure why you would like a Kaboul type player paired with Dawson. Dawson has his strengths and weaknesses, amongst his weaknesses is that he seems to need a top class player next to him to work well. Players like King, Naybet, Woodgate, Gallas and Vertonghen have all managed to make the player next to them look better. Dawson has needed someone next to him to make him better. He hasn't been the leader or organizer that we've wanted him to be, he hasn't been the player we could trust to help bring someone else along to integrate and get better.
As for Chiriches, he also has his strengths and weaknesses. He's still adjusting to the league and he's still to play next to Vertonghen - our best central defender and the only central defender we have that currently seems capable of making the players around him better. At the very least I'm going to withhold my judgement on Vlad until he's had over a full season for us, but to me he looks very promising at this point.
Click to expand...

I know this is not the "Dawson" thread but I have to take you up on this one. Who exactly looked better with Vertonghen playing alongside them? Caulker didn't look better (remember Leeds in the FA Cup?). Vertonghen's partnership with Gallas, I seem to recall, was not great either. If anything I would say that Vertonghen's defensive game, at CB, actually improved when Dawson was put alongside him. Problem is that it is unfashionable to give Dawson any credit.
 
Last edited:
Re: Official - Chiriches

Jurgen the German said:
But surely seeing it all from block 29 as you do you must be able to see why some of us believe that defensive abilities should count more than whether he's a silky footballer? Dembele gets the blame for giving the penalty away, but Chiriches still put the team in a difficult position by going on another marauding run, which ultimately resulted in him losing the ball and having to sprint back. It's one thing when a full back does it, it's worse when a CB does it time and time again.
Click to expand...
Although i do agree that a lost ball going forward is a mistake, the fact that we did not concede a goal, NOT 1 single goal from these actions show that they did not cost us anything in all competitions, and it's mid January already. You fail to see the flip side of a CB going forward with the ball, I remember 1-2 goals being scored for spurs that had the initial start of a Chiriches going forward with the ball(one being in the EL match away at Sheriff I feisty game we barely won). So on the scoreboard it's really a positive thing, and that's where it counts.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

IulianSteaua said:
Although i do agree that a lost ball going forward is a mistake, the fact that we did not concede a goal, NOT 1 single goal from these actions show that they did not cost us anything in all competitions, and it's mid January already. You fail to see the flip side of a CB going forward with the ball, I remember 1-2 goals being scored for spurs that had the initial start of a Chiriches going forward with the ball(one being in the EL match away at Sheriff I feisty game we barely won). So on the scoreboard it's really a positive thing, and that's where it counts.
Click to expand...

he is just a goal and a loss waiting to happen, before the fans turn on him!
that said i don't think that is only chiriches fault. coaching and the teamwork between the back four and keeper needs to be tip-top when defending a high line.

too few games but i saw that post-avb we still keep a pretty high defensive line, but loris has not been too quick in coming out to collect balls behind the CBs. Not sure if it was his head injury or sherwood's instructions.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

Jurgen the German said:
But surely seeing it all from block 29 as you do you must be able to see why some of us believe that defensive abilities should count more than whether he's a silky footballer? Dembele gets the blame for giving the penalty away, but Chiriches still put the team in a difficult position by going on another marauding run, which ultimately resulted in him losing the ball and having to sprint back. It's one thing when a full back does it, it's worse when a CB does it time and time again.
Click to expand...




I don't have to be watching from block 29 to know that defensive abilities are the priority for a CB, and in my post I say that "Chiriches" has some learning to do. I also believe once he has got used to the league then his defending abilities matched with his ball playing skills will make him a very good player indeed.

But when Dawson goes flying into a challenge on his **** missing everything when he's the last man, don't you think that's just as risky as VC doing a marauding run?

After all, a marauding run might bring some attacking reward as well as risk, and it shouldn't be too hard for a midfielder to cover for him when he does it.



Seeing it all from block 29.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

Actually, to be honest if you stuck Franco Baresi between Rose and Dawson even he'd look sh!te.

Seeing it all from block 29.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

metalgear said:
he is just a goal and a loss waiting to happen, before the fans turn on him!
that said i don't think that is only chiriches fault. coaching and the teamwork between the back four and keeper needs to be tip-top when defending a high line.
Click to expand...
It just seems like some fans turned on him already before we get scored upon by one of the going forward runs. So let's say it happens and we end the season with 1 goal scored against us from a chiriches mistake going forward... like i said 2 goals have already been scored by spurs because of vlad going forward with the ball, probably it will be more that 2 at the end of the season... What's the problem ?
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

I'm starting to think some people here don't understand the detailed picture on a player's ability.

Not that I have anything with Dawson (I think he is good, but we can do with an upgrade) and leaving aside that I have the same nationality as Chiriches - think he is really top class - of course he's still adjusting, needs to improve his heading and overall abilities, is playing maxed out minutes after two injuries, is playing on his weaker side with the clearly less potent defensively Rose and Eriksen (as opposed to Walker and Lennon). But answer these questions:

- How is he responsible for Dawson's man making runs behind him all the time when there's no pressure on the ball from midfield and Rose hardly doubles him from the left?
- Does Dawson put pressure on the ball like Chiriches always does?
- Does he hoof passes up front?
- How many good passes does the guy have to make to get the credit he deserves?

Sure, you can argue that he lost a ball that led to Dembele's idiotic tackle, but how many passes did the rest of our team misplace horribly in the first half - Dembele, Eriksen in particular and basically everyone and they still got higher ratings?
Anyway, I think we have conceded less goals with Chiriches in the team than any other player in the back line for that matter (he was not part of Liverpool or City...I'm sure we wouldn't have allowed 11 goals with him in the lineup).

And to wrap up my view on things..yes, he sometimes looks shaky on the ball and I'm sure that will be ironed out with experience and time but no goals conceded..must mean something, no?
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

I think that chiriches attracts this type of attention because he seems to take risks, when in the other hand, central defenders are there to nullify risks.

Like I said earlier, it's always a collective decision and if we allow chiriches to roam forward, we must also accommodate for the counter. Otherwise it will be too easy for the opposition to target the weak link in the chain.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Fapatalk
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

Not just a romanian said:
I'm starting to think some people here don't understand the detailed picture on a player's ability.

Not that I have anything with Dawson (I think he is good, but we can do with an upgrade) and leaving aside that I have the same nationality as Chiriches - think he is really top class - of course he's still adjusting, needs to improve his heading and overall abilities, is playing maxed out minutes after two injuries, is playing on his weaker side with the clearly less potent defensively Rose and Eriksen (as opposed to Walker and Lennon). But answer these questions:

- How is he responsible for Dawson's man making runs behind him all the time when there's no pressure on the ball from midfield and Rose hardly doubles him from the left?
- Does Dawson put pressure on the ball like Chiriches always does?
- Does he hoof passes up front?
- How many good passes does the guy have to make to get the credit he deserves?

Sure, you can argue that he lost a ball that led to Dembele's idiotic tackle, but how many passes did the rest of our team misplace horribly in the first half - Dembele, Eriksen in particular and basically everyone and they still got higher ratings?
Anyway, I think we have conceded less goals with Chiriches in the team than any other player in the back line for that matter (he was not part of Liverpool or City...I'm sure we wouldn't have allowed 11 goals with him in the lineup).

And to wrap up my view on things..yes, he sometimes looks shaky on the ball and I'm sure that will be ironed out with experience and time but no goals conceded..must mean something, no?
Click to expand...

Good post
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

screen nayim said:
The guy already said he watched it.

I'm starting to think you're losing the argument and are having a personal dig at the fella tbh.

Anyway, I saw the game from block 29 which is level with the 18 yard line so I get a great view of our defence at work.
Firstly I've got to say that Vlad has still got some work to do to get up to the speed of the English game. Sometimes he drops off too deep then realises and scurries forward again. Also he too often dwells on the ball or tries to play his way out of danger when, occasionally a boot would be the better option. But to blame him for this after a dozen or so games is ridiculous. As for the numerous situations illustrated by Rossi22's graphic, the first problem here is usually no midfield pressure on the passer. Next is often too big a gap between Rose and Vlad. which can be eradicated with more games and training (or an upgrade on Rose). But Iulian is correct in that it is ultimately Dawson's man getting on the end of those passes. He's been playing in this league for ten years and has got no excuses.

Finally, Vlad is an accomplished footballer with great ball control, dribbling skills, an eye for a pass and can shoot accurately too.

Those abilities in a centre back used to be treasured by Spurs fans. Not sure why there is so much antipathy towards the guy. I think and hope he has a big future here.



Seeing it all from block 29.
Click to expand...

How can anyone win or lose the argument? it's an opinion.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

screen nayim said:
I don't have to be watching from block 29 to know that defensive abilities are the priority for a CB, and in my post I say that "Chiriches" has some learning to do. I also believe once he has got used to the league then his defending abilities matched with his ball playing skills will make him a very good player indeed.

But when Dawson goes flying into a challenge on his **** missing everything when he's the last man, don't you think that's just as risky as VC doing a marauding run?

After all, a marauding run might bring some attacking reward as well as risk, and it shouldn't be too hard for a midfielder to cover for him when he does it.



Seeing it all from block 29.
Click to expand...

Ah ok, now i know why you said that, ignore previous post please.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

thfcsteff said:
Good post
Click to expand...

You agree that Chiriches always puts pressure on the ball? wowzers ok. That was exhibited very well for the Cazorla goal right? how he stood still, then ran a bit to the player in possession of the ball...that's putting pressure?
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

For some reason the argument turned to his forward runs. His runs from deep are the only good thing about his game.

If you look at the goals he's cost us since he came back they're nothing to do with his forward runs and everything to with him being completely exposed as unable to defend without a 2 man defensive shield sitting in front of him all game.

Chiriches was a decent defender in AVB's safety first set up, now he's a liability, easily exposed as a one dimensional limited defender with no pace and an inability to head the ball.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

Kingdawson said:
You agree that Chiriches always puts pressure on the ball? wowzers ok. That was exhibited very well for the Cazorla goal right? how he stood still, then ran a bit to the player in possession of the ball...that's putting pressure?
Click to expand...

To be fair I should've been more specific in my liking of that post as that was not a specific point I would agree with all the time...but if you want to discuss that goal again mate, Chiriches was not, IMO, the guiltiest party. That remains Daws for reasons discussed before. To me, it was clear that Vlad wasn't sure what Daws was king ( pushing up, dropping off) and himself got dragged ino the trap by Gnarby. I look to Daws, as the skipper, to lead. I think it's very very fair to say Vlad can improve, but I think it's equally fair to say we can clearly see he will when certain elements are set.
 
Re: Official - Chiriches

Modric THFC said:
For some reason the argument turned to his forward runs. His runs from deep are the only good thing about his game.

If you look at the goals he's cost us since he came back they're nothing to do with his forward runs and everything to with him being completely exposed as unable to defend without a 2 man defensive shield sitting in front of him all game.

Chiriches was a decent defender in AVB's safety first set up, now he's a liability, easily exposed as a one dimensional limited defender with no pace and an inability to head the ball.
Click to expand...

Do you think of any other player in our side as a liability also? I'm interested. 'Easily exposed' eh? Wow...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back