The Official 2016/17 Premier League Thread

[parklane1]

For those there is no need, as the ref already got it right

But, but ,but who will the fans blame then. It always been the same if a fans team lose the ref gets the blame no matter what. I often wonder how many of the loudest moaners have ever tried to ref a game.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

Part of the problem with refs is they have now become "celebrities", the only refs I can remember being "names" back in the dark ages were Jack Taylor, Roger Kirkpatrick and Ken Aston. There use to be an old adage "the best refs were the ones you didn't notice", now days some appear to seek the "limelight"

 

[mudshark]

For those there is no need, as the ref already got it right

Unless he didn't.

 

[mudshark]

But, but ,but who will the fans blame then. It always been the same if a fans team lose the ref gets the blame no matter what. I often wonder how many of the loudest moaners have ever tried to ref a game.

All the more reason to give him the option of asking for help, then, and there's no better argument for it. Just like with goal-line technology — the idea of which was also opposed for years, as I recall — if everyone can see the decision is correct, then there is no blame game to be played. If the question he asks can't be resolved straight away by the video ref, then it can't be resolved, and there will be a default decision. We'll all know in a few tens of seconds at most (in the majority of cases, much quicker than that), people can see that the best attempt at fairness has been made, the issue of blame doesn't even arise, and the authority of the referee is undiminished. The opposite, in other words, of the situation you're lamenting, which is what we have to put up with now. The idea that huge amounts of time would be eaten up with this is an absurd straw man. How often are we still waiting for a decision these mythical weeks later in rugby, where there are usually far more technicalities to consider and bodies in the way?

 

[parklane1]

All the more reason to give him the option of asking for help, then, and there's no better argument for it. Just like with goal-line technology — the idea of which was also opposed for years, as I recall — if everyone can see the decision is correct, then there is no blame game to be played. If the question he asks can't be resolved straight away by the video ref, then it can't be resolved, and there will be a default decision. We'll all know in a few tens of seconds at most (in the majority of cases, much quicker than that), people can see that the best attempt at fairness has been made, the issue of blame doesn't even arise, and the authority of the referee is undiminished. The opposite, in other words, of the situation you're lamenting, which is what we have to put up with now. The idea that huge amounts of time would be eaten up with this is an absurd straw man. How often are we still waiting for a decision these mythical weeks later in rugby, where there are usually far more technicalities to consider and bodies in the way?

We will disagree then.

 

[mudshark]

We will disagree then.

Fair enough, although I must say I find your stance a bit confusing. You complain about people always moaning and blaming the ref, but you're against something that would shoot that fox. The current situation is a moaner's charter.

 

[parklane1]

Fair enough, although I must say I find your stance a bit confusing. You complain about people always moaning and blaming the ref, but you're against something that would shoot that fox. The current situation is a moaner's charter.

I am sorry you find my stance confusing, the last thing i want to see is a game that lasts forever and having video to check every decision by a ref will lead to that. Goal line technology is one thing ( and is a good idea) as for the rest i disagree with you that it will shoot the fox because it will not ( imo).

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I like it when refs make mistakes - it proves their human and not robots

Football is rapidly going down the road of being over analysed and their is blame for everything. I'm amazed a fan hasn't sued a club yet for costing him money in a bet and referred to sky for evidence

The more we look at technology the more clinical the game becomes. Perfect for over the line calls and also for offsides IMO as their black and white decisions. Awful for subjective calls such and fouls and handballs

 

[mudshark]

I am sorry you find my stance confusing, the last thing i want to see is a game that lasts forever and having video to check every decision by a ref will lead to that. Goal line technology is one thing ( and is a good idea) as for the rest i disagree with you that it will shoot the fox because it will not ( imo).

Ok, I get you, but I'm not advocating every decision going to video; only important, potentially game-changing ones, and at the discretion of the ref.

 

[mudshark]

I like it when refs make mistakes - it proves their human and not robots

Football is rapidly going down the road of being over analysed and their is blame for everything. I'm amazed a fan hasn't sued a club yet for costing him money in a bet and referred to sky for evidence

The more we look at technology the more clinical the game becomes. Perfect for over the line calls and also for offsides IMO as their black and white decisions. Awful for subjective calls such and fouls and handballs

You liked it, then, when Mendes's goal was disallowed. Did you?

 

[mudshark]

Part of the problem with refs is they have now become "celebrities", the only refs I can remember being "names" back in the dark ages were Jack Taylor, Roger Kirkpatrick and Ken Aston. There use to be an old adage "the best refs were the ones you didn't notice", now days some appear to seek the "limelight"

In that vein, I used to like (ie trust) Martin Bodenham. You can say it's ridiculous hyperbole, and it almost certainly is, but in his day, he might have been the British Isles's Pierluigi Collina.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

You liked it, then, when Mendes's goal was disallowed. Did you?

Did you read my comment about technilogy should only be used for black and white decisions such as over the line decisions?!?!?

And I didn't complain when the refs got it wrong against Emirates Marketing Project at home last year in our favour

 

[mudshark]

Did you read my comment about technilogy should only be used for black and white decisions such as over the line decisions?!?!?

And I didn't complain when the refs got it wrong against Emirates Marketing Project at home last year in our favour

Saying you "like it" when referees make mistakes just strikes me as silly, that's all. And whether or not a decision is black-and-white usually depends on how much information is available to the person making it.

 

[r-u-s-x01]

Editing can alter perception, do not feel comfortable giving sky (who I assume will be in charge of cameras) influence over the game

 

[mudshark]

Editing can alter perception, do not feel comfortable giving sky (who I assume will be in charge of cameras) influence over the game

Video refs aren't going to be looking at doctored images. It's just making more information available, if required.

 

[r-u-s-x01]

Video refs aren't going to be looking at doctored images. It's just making more information available, if required.

Who owns the camera's, instructs the camera men etc. Will just move the debate on to that.

Is the ref seeing replays who chooses which ones.

This isn't my main objection but it is real consideration

 

[Lost Mango]

Doesn't quite fit with debate but it goes in with reffing but following a link on the Trivia Question of the Day page on penalties thought the imbalance in penalties between the 7 ever present clubs was somewhat telling. I know certain players earn more penalties and certain teams are allegedly more attacking so in the opponents box more often (and presuming Stattos' stats are correct!) I just found these discrepancies somewhat surprising:

From 2002-03 up to the present:

Arsenal F76 A55 (+21)
Chelsea F82 A39 (+43)
Everton F56 A51 (+05)
Liverpool F85 A51(+34)
Emirates Marketing Project F79 A50 (+29)
Man Utd F77 A37 (+40)
Tottenham F61 A61 (00)

Out of those 14 seasons we have been more 'successful' than Liverpool in at least half of the seasons. We are definitely not as dirty or as cynical as Chelsea. I just can't see why those figures would be so out of balance between the Sky 5 and the other 2 if refs were being consistent. Are we just too soft? is this the Fergie/Wenger/Mourinho ref-rant effect? Is the Anfield crowd that much of a 12th Man?

 

[Bullet]

Doesn't quite fit with debate but it goes in with reffing but following a link on the Trivia Question of the Day page on penalties thought the imbalance in penalties between the 7 ever present clubs was somewhat telling. I know certain players earn more penalties and certain teams are allegedly more attacking so in the opponents box more often (and presuming Stattos' stats are correct!) I just found these discrepancies somewhat surprising:

From 2002-03 up to the present:

Arsenal F76 A55 (+21)
Chelsea F82 A39 (+43)
Everton F56 A51 (+05)
Liverpool F85 A51(+34)
Emirates Marketing Project F79 A50 (+29)
Man Utd F77 A37 (+40)
Tottenham F61 A61 (00)

Out of those 14 seasons we have been more 'successful' than Liverpool in at least half of the seasons. We are definitely not as dirty or as cynical as Chelsea. I just can't see why those figures would be so out of balance between the Sky 5 and the other 2 if refs were being consistent. Are we just too soft? is this the Fergie/Wenger/Mourinho ref-rant effect? Is the Anfield crowd that much of a 12th Man?

Exactly, refs are biased and we need TV replays to help redress the balance and get more calls right. It will never be 100% but it will move from 70% to 90% or whatever.

 

[parklane1]

Exactly, refs are biased and we need TV replays to help redress the balance and get more calls right. It will never be 100% but it will move from 70% to 90% or whatever.

GHod help us if/when they bring replays into the game. The game will be as long and as boring as a 60 minute game which lasts 3 hours ( NFL)

 

[Lemonade Money]

GHod help us if/when they bring replays into the game. The game will be as long and as boring as a 60 minute game which lasts 3 hours ( NFL)

You've seen the future then?