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The Goon Thread

milo said:
What makes it even worse is that City, Chel53a and United all have obvious weaknesses and it is easy to see them under performing this season. A couple of astute signings and Ar5ena1 would have strengthened their chances of capitalising on any slip ups.
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I think we may have done this before, but...

That's not much of a business plan is it? I can't see Samsung betting the farm on a new phone which is better than their last one but will only sell well if Apple release one that turns out to spontaneously combust.
 
Not "genius" status I'm afraid. And if you're honest with yourself you'd agree - hence the question marks. Great coach, very poor DOF.
 
galeforce said:
I think we may have done this before, but...

That's not much of a business plan is it? I can't see Samsung betting the farm on a new phone which is better than their last one but will only sell well if Apple release one that turns out to spontaneously combust.
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They don't need to bet the farm though. Cover better than Arteta in central midfield and a striker would have done it. They could have cleared out some players to free up some wages to cover it. It might have given them a chance of progressing past the first decent team that they face in Europe too.
 
Neymar said:
who is a genius dof then?
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I'm not suggesting a DOF needs to be a genius, just pragmatic. Quite simply would Wanyama, Shneiderlin, Martial - all easily attainable for them - have improve them and made them a stronger team? It does not take genius to answer that question!

That is the point. With all the choices they could have made, they made the wrong ones in the transfer windows probably due to Wenger. Clubs like Southampton, Swansea, ourselves etc. are pragmatic with far less cash.
 
milo said:
They don't need to bet the farm though. Cover better than Arteta in central midfield and a striker would have done it. They could have cleared out some players to free up some wages to cover it. It might have given them a chance of progressing past the first decent team that they face in Europe too.
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arteta has been at arsenal for a number of years now. whos to say a replacement backup dcm would be any better given that arteta has already build an understands of the club and players, style of play etc. its not like arteta is a mug
 
milo said:
They don't need to bet the farm though. Cover better than Arteta in central midfield and a striker would have done it. They could have cleared out some players to free up some wages to cover it. It might have given them a chance of progressing past the first decent team that they face in Europe too.
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Yeah, but they could have signed a striker who had a run of luck like Soldado, there isn't any guaranteed pay off, whilst staying the course is incredibly unlikely to make them any worse off, why risk it, how do you justify that financially?
 
SpurMeUp said:
I'm not suggesting a DOF needs to be a genius, just pragmatic. Quite simply would Wanyama, Shneiderlin, Martial - all easily attainable for them - have improve them and made them a stronger team? It does not take genius to answer that question!
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with those they would still be the 4th best team mate.

by not singing them wenger has probably saved arsenal close to 100m. proving why you shouldnt quit your day job to be a dof

in all seriousness though. this is why football fans arent able to evaluate wenger. all you guys think about is "was it possible for wenger to improve arsenal on the pitch?" you dont consider if that improvement was worth the financial outlay.

all you ask yourself is: was it possible to improve arsenal with that rumoured 50m transfer budget.

wenger has to consider whether its worth spending that 50m too. and none of you take this into consideration
 
SpurMeUp said:
I'm not suggesting a DOF needs to be a genius, just pragmatic. Quite simply would Wanyama, Shneiderlin, Martial - all easily attainable for them - have improve them and made them a stronger team? It does not take genius to answer that question!
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Well two of them were attained by a much bigger club so I'm assuming the answer is that they were not easily attainable, is that a trick question?
 
galeforce said:
Well two of them were attained by a much bigger club so I'm assuming the answer is that they were not easily attainable, is that a trick question?
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Late in the window for Martial. The scum could have easily had them and many other top players had they identified their targets in a methodical way. Clearly, and happily, they don't; as with Wenger's coaching skills, they would have won the league with more astute purchases.
 
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SpurMeUp said:
Late in the window for Martial, and they could have had Schneiderlin had they really pushed for him. The scum could have easily had them and many other top players had they identified their targets in a methodical way. Clearly, and happily, they don't; as with Wenger's coaching skills, they would have won the league with more astute purchases.
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I don't buy it, we've all seen how things work, both players would have known last season that United were tracking them, players (and selling clubs) hold out to see if a better deal materialises.
 
Neymar said:
with those they would still be the 4th best team mate.

by not singing them wenger has probably saved Ar5ena1 close to 100m. proving why you shouldnt quit your day job to be a dof

in all seriousness though. this is why football fans arent able to evaluate wenger. all you guys think about is "was it possible for wenger to improve Ar5ena1 on the pitch?" you dont consider if that improvement was worth the financial outlay.

all you ask yourself is: was it possible to improve Ar5ena1 with that rumoured 50m transfer budget.

wenger has to consider whether its worth spending that 50m too. and none of you take this into consideration
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In this hypothetical 50m scenario of course it's worth the outlay - by improving their team they are giving themselves a better chance of success, they can easily afford the money so what argument is there for not doing it?

If the money is there ready available and the team needs improving, it's bordeline negligance afaic if it doesn't get spent
 
Neymar said:
arteta has been at Ar5ena1 for a number of years now. whos to say a replacement backup dcm would be any better given that arteta has already build an understands of the club and players, style of play etc. its not like arteta is a mug
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I think that sentimentality is part of the problem there. Wenger would never have allowed this situation to develop when he was still hungry.
 
billyiddo said:
In this hypothetical 50m scenario of course it's worth the outlay - by improving their team they are giving themselves a better chance of success, they can easily afford the money so what argument is there for not doing it?
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the cost of the increase in the chance of success does not equal the potential returns from this increase in the chance of success.

you are of the opinion that all football clubs are success chasers.

arsenal and their board are profit chasers. and a lot of football fans seem to massively struggle to understand this concept. but once you do understand it, you will see why wenger is actually much better than you think
 
galeforce said:
I don't buy it, we've all seen how things work, both players would have known last season that United were tracking them, players (and selling clubs) hold out to see if a better deal materialises.
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By all accounts we were trying to buy Martial for a fraction of what united paid late in the window. Schneiderlin was available last summer at the right price, and if they'd committed probably this summer too at the right price. Wenger just dithers and doesn't have a good approach to transfers and wages - which is awesome....for us!

That is why their fans are frustrated. They don't see it as Neymar does, they see very clearly that they are missing a couple of key players. Furthermore, the stacks of cash are not being spent wisely. But these fans who spend all their time focused on the arse are wrong?
 
billyiddo said:
In this hypothetical 50m scenario of course it's worth the outlay - by improving their team they are giving themselves a better chance of success, they can easily afford the money so what argument is there for not doing it?

If the money is there ready available and the team needs improving, it's bordeline negligance afaic if it doesn't get spent
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arsenal's end goal is money. thus, if they are to spend money, they better well see a financial return on it.

most other clubs competing at this elite level are after trophies. therefore if they have x amount of spare cash, they will spend it in order to chase the trophies. arsenal are built on a fundamentally different model to their competitors. its a wonder how they even manage to stay in touch with them.
 
galeforce said:
You know what, it's something I've been thinking about recently, I intend to expand it further, but the short version is, they are probably the perfect team to support as they will never let you down, there is no expectation as they are financially so far behind the big three, you don't have to worry about them not winning anything as they don't even try to, they play "nice football" which is what most fans only claim to actually want, they have young players the fans identify with and a nice stadium with plenty of leg room and good transport links. They are so bloody convenient it's unreal.
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They're not that far off the big 3 to be fair. The following are the financial figures:

Man United £433m with wages 50% or £216m;
Emirates Marketing Project £347m with wages 59% or £205m
Chelsea £324m with wages 59% or £191m
Arsenal £304m with wages 55% or £167m
Liverpool £256m with wages 56% or £143m
Spurs £181m with wages 55% or £100m

Now make of that what you will, but that says to me that the gap between them and Chelsea is not that big. Yet Chelsea have won the league. I think being in the top 4 allows you to buy a better standard of player, but with there are enough good players for the top 4 clubs to be on a close par with eachother given that it is CL football that the players seem to want. The figures above were last years, but Arsenal have now grown top line to £345m off the back of the Puma deal.

My point is simply that they could be doing better than they are, as they have done in the past. They can afford to make a net spend of £40m each season without incurring debt, they don't have a stadium to finance, they don't have a training complex to finance. They lack ambition to be better. The biggest reason for why they have fallen away is David Dein no longer playing a part because he was the one with that ambition.

And @galeforce , that scummy club is no where near the perfect club to support!!!
 
SpurMeUp said:
That is why their fans are frustrated. They don't see it as Neymar does, they see very clearly that they are missing a couple of key players. Furthermore, the stacks of cash are not being spent wisely. But these fans who spend all their time focused on the arse are wrong?
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they arent wrong in thinking that spending this spare cash would improve their team (although they are probably wrong in thinking that they would be genuine, consistent title challengers). but their line of thinking is fundamentally wrong. they think their club is a charity who will spend every last penny so that their club can chase trophies (like chelsea and Emirates Marketing Project). they need to realise this isnt what their club is.

their club is a business that provides entertainment, who are looking to maximise profits at the end of the day. once they fully accept this, they wont be so frustrated anymore, and will probably lose their love of the club too lol.
 
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