Probably the most sensible reply! If you have an ache or pain and you try something different (that definitely doesn't work as there's no scientific evidence) and the pain goes away, then that's all there is to it. Whether it's a trick of the mind or whatever, if it no longer hurts then it's job done as far as pain relief goes.
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Quacks & Pseudoscience
- Thread starter scaramanga
- Start date
Probably the most sensible reply! If you have an ache or pain and you try something different (that definitely doesn't work as there's no scientific evidence) and the pain goes away, then that's all there is to it. Whether it's a trick of the mind or whatever, if it no longer hurts then it's job done as far as pain relief goes.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
To be honest mate i would not waste my time trawling through looking for stuff they you would close your mind too, you are blinkered and have tunnel vision on a lot of things and its a pointless debate.
But if it makes you feel any better " fill your boots".
I wouldn't advise anyone who has cancer to try and cure it with acupuncture. But for a back ache, it's worth a go for some people.
People often turn to alternative "medicine" when their pain is at its worst. It is usually the increased magnitude of pain that drives them to do so.
When pain is at its worst, there is only one direction in which it can go. Assigning causation to their actions is merely a side effect of how we have evolved and as a species we have never properly grown out of it. It was always beneficial to assume the thing that looks like a tiger is a tiger because doing the opposite ends up in being eaten every now and then by dappled sunlight. It's the same trickery that makes us see faces in clouds and Jesus on toast.
On the contrary, my mind is entirely open to anything which can be shown by empirical methods to be effective.
You know what they call alternative medicine that's been proven to work? Medicine.
Why not just burn £50 notes? It's as relevant to curing backache as acupuncture but it avoids putting money into the hands of dangerous charlatans.
metalgear
Luka Modric
So did acupuncture cure the woman in the production line in the first post of this thread?
Sent from my SM-T819Y using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
Sent from my SM-T819Y using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
Her sickness recurred, she didn't enjoy her working environment and left. A good win in the end.
If you say so.
Remember everyone -- if you go and pay someone to put pins in your back and you feel better afterwards, you are actually killing people.
If everybody stopped funding acupuncturists these people would be alive:
https://edzardernst.com/2013/02/how...ture-caused-and-are-acupuncturists-in-denial/
That doesn't count those people who thought alternative "medicine" was a viable alternative to real medicine.
By paying an acupuncturist, you are propping up an industry that kills people for no benefit and does no good to balance it.
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nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
I think this is the catch.
At a minor level, if you think taking some sort of extract makes you feel good - then fine. If acupuncture makes you feel better - then fine. I think the issue is when you have a more serious issue, and continue to turn to alternative and unproven methods.
I think the issue for many is, without wanting to sound like Im being sarcy, things like Acupuncture could be a gateway to rather more harmful choices later on.
milo
Jack L. Jones
Surely acupuncture is hard woo (needles and that) and homeopathy is the gateway
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
Well its not like they are big needles, or they are doing anything major, not sure I see it as "hard" at all.
ShipOfTheseus
Clint Dempsey
@nayimfromthehalfwayline has it right.
Homeopathy is the hardest form of woo there is. The water memory is bad enough, the dilution is utterly barking and the ritual beating of water against a leather cushion (yes, really) takes it to levels of nutso that flower remedies and crystal therapy can only dream of.
Acupuncture has a variety of mutually inconsistent woo theories to underpin it, but the idea that sticking pins in nerves might have an impact on pain responses sounds plausible enough on the surface, drawing people in to a world of arrant nonsense.
Homeopathy is the hardest form of woo there is. The water memory is bad enough, the dilution is utterly barking and the ritual beating of water against a leather cushion (yes, really) takes it to levels of nutso that flower remedies and crystal therapy can only dream of.
Acupuncture has a variety of mutually inconsistent woo theories to underpin it, but the idea that sticking pins in nerves might have an impact on pain responses sounds plausible enough on the surface, drawing people in to a world of arrant nonsense.
milo
Jack L. Jones
I wasn't being serious.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
On the contrary mate, you are all those things and have shown that in some of your posts over several subjects. However i will say i love you mate because you always make me laugh.
milo
Jack L. Jones
On the contrary mate, you are all those things and have shown that in some of your posts over several subjects. However i will say i love you mate because you always make me laugh.
Are you saying that Scara would not accept the results of trial following empirical methods?
I hope you have never smoked or drank alcohol, because by doing so, you have propped up an industry that has killed thousands of people every year since GHod knows when.
If people are stupid enough to try and treat a serious illness with unproven methods and then they die, that is on them. If someone has a gimpy back/shoulder/whatever and they try something different and get relief from it, then more power to them.
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
Acupuncture is the same as massage. It reaches trigger points and relieves pressure. That is proven. It is legitimate pain relief.
Whether it can cure internal and structural issues is not proven. I would have reservations about that but it is a proven method of pain relief.
If you don't believe in it then you can't believe in massage and should be contacting the club saying we employ quacks because massage does not work.
Whether it can cure internal and structural issues is not proven. I would have reservations about that but it is a proven method of pain relief.
If you don't believe in it then you can't believe in massage and should be contacting the club saying we employ quacks because massage does not work.
milo
Jack L. Jones
Like you, I am inclined to not care what people spend their own money on. I do think though that it is wrong for public health systems, like the NHS, to spend money on things that are unproven. I also think that unproven remedies should not be sold in chemists alongside medicine because it gives them unearned authencity/credibility.