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Politics, politics, politics

scaramanga said:
Did they? Seeing as London tends to vote left most of the time (except in the nice bits) I'd say it's just a return to norm.

In order for the Conservatives to get a London mayor past the postal vote they'd have had to run a massive personality again.

It probably shows how little the parties care about the role now that the best they could find was Goldsmith.
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with the current uncertainty over DC's long term plans and the EU issue no Tory with aspiration was going to risk tying themselves up in London for 4 years, could be plenty of real jobs available soon.
 
scaramanga said:
I've yet to hear a single person express an intention to vote outside their usual party preference.

In fact, nobody has even mentioned the campaigns at all.
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Peter Oborne, lifelong Tory, aid he was disgusted with Zac's campaign and that he would be voting Labour for the first time ever; he said if a liberal, centrist Muslim candidate (who voted for Gay marriage) could still be smeared in such an appalling way then he dispared there would really be no hope that Islamophobia could ever be challenged...
 
scaramanga said:
And they'd get away with it too if it wasn't for all that pesky democracy.


If it would stop everyone blowing each other up for 5 minutes then it might be a worthwhile aim.
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Hilarious that you think Islam and Christianity are made-up religion and perfect for ridicule, but Judaism is not because 'it is also a racial identity'...one based on the some of the same ancient texts that the other two are based on:D
 
glorygloryeze said:
Peter Oborne, lifelong Tory, aid he was disgusted with Zac's campaign and that he would be voting Labour for the first time ever; he said if a liberal, centrist Muslim candidate (who voted for Gay marriage) could still be smeared in such an appalling way then he dispared there would really be no hope that Islamophobia could ever be challenged...
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Oborne says whatever makes people read the Spectator. I'm talking about your average voter.

And why the fudge would anyone want to challenge Islamophobia anyway? It's one of very few things the great unwashed gets right.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Hilarious that you think Islam and Christianity are made-up religion and perfect for ridicule, but Judaism is not because 'it is also a racial identity'...one based on the some of the same ancient texts that the other two are based on:D
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Judaism is just as ridiculous as the other two.

But being Jewish means more than a religion now, it's pretty much interchangeable with "Israeli" for most people. I don't see any element of religion bashing in antisemitism, but that's exactly what Islamophobia is.
 
scaramanga said:
Oborne says whatever makes people read the Spectator. I'm talking about you average voter.

And why the fudge would anyone want to challenge Islamophobia anyway? It's one of very few things the great unwashed gets right.
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Yeah right re Oborne. He's a died-in-the-wool Tory and i don't think he'd want left-leaning Union types flocking to his paper - do you?

scaramanga said:
Judaism is just as ridiculous as the other two.

But being Jewish means more than a religion now, it's pretty much interchangeable with "Israeli" for most people. I don't see any element of religion bashing in antisemitism, but that's exactly what Islamophobia is.
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So being Jewish is different to following Judaism:D
Comedy gold!
There was a time when being 'Christian' was interchangable with being 'European' or being 'Roman'...it's HILARIOUS you are drawing such a distinction...and the joke is that being either 'Jewish', 'Christain' or 'Muslim' is more or less based on the same 'Holy Words of GHod' as well!
 
glorygloryeze said:
Yeah right re Oborne. He's a died-in-the-wool Tory and i don't think he'd want left-leaning Union types flocking to his paper - do you?
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He's the sub-editor of a magazine, numbers are all that matter.

glorygloryeze said:
So being Jewish is different to following Judaism:D
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In the eyes of most people, yes. Most people would call an Israeli Jewish and a Jew Israeli. Despite the inaccuracy of that, once the public perception is that the two are interchangeable then you have to protect both because "Jewish" is now common parlance for a race or ethnicity.

"Muslim" isn't commonly used to describe a race of ethnicity, it's just a way of describing a load of people who cannot tell that fairy stories are made up.

glorygloryeze said:
Comedy gold!
There was a time when being 'Christian' was interchangable with being 'European' or being 'Roman'...
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Roman maybe, I don't think that was ever the case for European.

In the same of the Romans it would have been as wrong as it is for Israelis.

glorygloryeze said:
it's HILARIOUS you are drawing such a distinction...and the joke is that being either 'Jewish', 'Christain' or 'Muslim' is more or less based on the same 'Holy Words of GHod' as well!
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You're missing the point.

None of those religions are any different from each other, they're all equally ridiculous. The point I'm making is that the term "Jewish" doesn't just mean a religion for most people now.
 
I agree with Scara, except for the Israeli/Jewish part. I would think of someone from Israel as Jewish, but I wouldn't think of someone Jewish as Israeli unless they were from Israel. For example, I don't think "ah yes, the famous Israeli, Larry David." But then I do think of Larry David as being Jewish and not in a religious way (so that's where I agree with Scara).

This is sort of where people confuse criticism of the Israeli Government with Anti-Semitism. They are not the same thing.

Anyway, this thread is Politics!
 
the dza said:
This is sort of where people confuse criticism of the Israeli Government with Anti-Semitism. They are not the same thing.
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Except in the Labour Party and trades unions where criticism of the Israeli Government is a perfect cover for anti-Semitism.
 
scaramanga said:
Except in the Labour Party and trades unions where criticism of the Israeli Government is a perfect cover for anti-Semitism.
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This is a complete misrepresentation and is as illogical, as accusing me of being racially prejudiced against Americans because I oppose their foreign policy agenda. Apples and oranges.
 
Gilzeantoscore said:
This is a complete misrepresentation and is as illogical, as accusing me of being racially prejudiced against Americans because I oppose their foreign policy agenda. Apples and oranges.
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Not at all.

I fully understand the distinction between the two. If you reread my post you'll see that I said that some use one as a cover for another, not that the two are equivalent.
 
scaramanga said:
Not at all.

I fully understand the distinction between the two. If you reread my post you'll see that I said that some use one as a cover for another, not that the two are equivalent.
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Some do, I agree. There are also those who think that any wrong-doing by Israel can be countered by shouting "anti-semitism!" at legitimate criticisms. Two sides of the same coin.
 
first time an opposition party has lost votes in local elections which is when the public give the government a kicking as a rule, wow, I aint a sympathizer of Labour far from it, but I would rather they got their act together so we had a strong opposition who could hold the tories to account when they regularly fcuk up.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
first time an opposition party has lost votes in local elections which is when the public give the government a kicking as a rule, wow, I aint a sympathizer of Labour far from it, but I would rather they got their act together so we had a strong opposition who could hold the tories to account when they regularly fcuk up.
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I don't think going back too far in history is relevant to politics at the moment. EU Ref, Scotland changed completely by the Scottish Indy Ref, UKIP.

The coalition had a massive kicking and the brunt was taken by the Lib Dems. We are only 1 year into this Tory government, with Corbyn leading Labour for only 8 months. When Corbyn took over, Labour were 14 points behind in the polls. According to local election results, they are now 1 point ahead. That's not a bad trajectory.

I'd be very surprised if Labour could win a majority in 2020, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Tories lost theirs, small as it is.

As for opposition, Labour actually oppose the government now, rather than vote along with them and wring their hands. Tories have made U-Turn after U-Turn because Labour have been opposing them, causing Tory backbenchers to fear a backlash from voters who might seek an alternative now a clearer one has been presented to them. See Tax Credits, cuts to disability benefits, this latest stuff with the academisation of schools etc.

Considering the media establishment are entirely against him, Corbyn is doing a very good job. If only the Scottish Labour party would get rid of their Blairite leader, they might do a bit better up there as well.
 
IF - Thie EgyptAir flight is a terror attack, when is the time for drastic action to protect nations rather than accept these attacks as the norm?
 
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