really love that! spot on with a lot of it. Fans and players alike expect instant success. i think certain players now feel they need to go up the pay grade.
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Nearly Club? Only For Pessimists
- Thread starter thfcsteff
- Start date
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
If they want more money, I'm sure everyone would have a difficult time holding them back from that. If Walker says he's had a great 8 years and wants to double his salary, fair play. Sad, we wish he would stay etc but when the dust settles, we'll look back on him fairly fondly, like Bale. Well maybe Bale gets better treatment because he went to Madrid rather than a rival, but maybe it wouldn't be vitriolic.
But to say we are a nearly club and use that as the excuse? When we've finished ahead of Emirates Marketing Project for the last 2 years? Despite all their spending? At what point is it supposed to call come together for them? fudge that.
Parklaner81
Steve Hodge
'Nearly' might be applied to the Jol & Redknapp eras. But I think that was all part of the progression...
parklane1
Tony Galvin
I do not believe we can be called a "nearly club" its just as idiotic as the S pursy brick that some of our fans bleat about all the time. Gutterboy summed it up in his earlier post, as for the Rose situation as i said in that thread there are several fans who are making mountains out of molehills over his words. imo
thfcsteff
George Hunt
You have hit a key question. For me, we are in a place where the platform is being built for a decade-plus era of dominance. Ferguson waited 5 years. The fact that the phrase 'nearly club' is being entertained by our supporters (let alone voiced by a player regardless of context) infuriates me personally.
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Yermiyahu
Scott Parker
My issue with Danny Rose using the 'nearly club' phrase is that it gives ammunition to the media to use that label to deride us. I notice over the past few months the media agenda has been to force discussions about player salary and agitate for moves for some of our team. I appreciate that Danny was possibly put on the spot but his response should have been along the lines of " I cant imagine why anyone would want to leave Spurs at this point in time" and then moved on. Answering the way he did was not his smartest move unless as some have claimed he is indeed agitating for a move.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Great post GB couldn't agree more. I think the phrase "nearly club" was coined by the loathesome Ken Bates after we lost the 2002 league cup final to Blackburn.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Excellent post mate.
mephitis
Niko Kranjcar
Post of the year!
Speaking personally, I'm really happy with the place we're in right now. If it all fell apart tomorrow, this would be a period in our history I would be proud of and grateful to have witnessed. Fans of other clubs may not remember it, but we will!
However, there's a good reason for everybody putting us down, they see us a threat, and a real threat. Over the passed two seasons, if you want to win the league you'll have to have beaten Spurs! Can't see that changing anytime soon and I like it. I've said previously, at the moment, owners, management, players and fans all seem to be pulling in the same direction (and to good effect). Let's keep it that way.
90291Spur
Paul Walsh
You put the 'brain' in 'brain of levy'.
90291Spur
Paul Walsh
The most entertaining thing the Goons did this year was protest and spout off on ArseTV, innit fam. Blud?
nayenezgani
Jimmy Neighbour
One thousand times this! Context is irrelevant, just don't fudging say it in the first place you silly git.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Well, I'll take up the customary role as a contrarian to general opinion here and say that I can see where he's coming from...sort of.
Let's look at us from the time he joined us in 2007. Forget the barren 2000's and 1990's prior to that, because footballers don't tend to think of the ultra long-term in that manner. Just think of the ten-odd years he's been here.
In 2007-2008, we won the Carling Cup. It felt like we were on the verge of something. We had a truly magnificent strike force up top, and only needed a more robust midfield and defence (alongside a more mentally strong unit as a whole - one that didn't give up on the season in March) to go on to big things.
2008-2009 - We lost that strike partnership that summer. Got to the Carling Cup final again in 2008-2009 under Harry. Lost to United. Finished 8th.
2009-2010 - Spent a load of money in January 2009 and the summer of 2010. Had a great league season. Finished 4th. Got to the FA Cup semi-final, but lost, unbelievably, to relegated Portsmouth.
2010-2011 - got to the quarter finals of the CL before being thumped by Real Madrid. Finished 5th - looked capable of repeating our CL qualification late on, but fell away in the end.
2011-2012 - got to 4th, but missed out on the CL after a mid-season collapse and Chelsea winning the CL in one of the most unfortunate circumstances in recent footballing memory - one that was rectified afterwards, so we were the only club which would ever suffer under those unique circumstances. Got to the FA Cup semi-final, but lost, to Chelsea.
2012-2013 - had a great league season, our highest ever points total prior to this year - but juuuuust lost out to Arsenal for that final CL spot.
2013-2014 - aimless drifting. Spent a buttload of money from the Bale sale on players we thought would win us the league. They didn't. 'Spurs will always let you down', came Roy Keane's jibe.
2014-2015 - first season under Poch. Inconsistent, fun to watch, managed to finish 5th. Got to the CC final, but lost to Chelsea.
2015-2016 - Second season under Poch. Fun to watch, mostly consistent, but a horrible end to the season removed any lingering hopes of the title and let Arsenal finish above us again (which they'd been doing for the entirety of the past nine years, incidentally) on the final day.
2016-2017 - third season under Poch. Magnificent to watch, ruthlessly consistent, record points tally by an enormous margin, *still* lost out on the title to an even more consistent Chelsea side, lost in the FA Cup semi final to that same Chelsea side, were ingloriously dumped out of the CL and then lost to Gent in the EL. And, after a season where all the boys said the next step was winning a trophy, we ended up sitting on our hands watching United win the EL and CC, Arsenal with the FA Cup and Chelsea win the league.
As fans, it's easy for us to discard Rose's opinions as so much tattle because of the past three years under Poch bringing gradual progress and a stadium on the horizon. But, even if you ignore the terrible 90's and early-to-mid 2000's, the decade Rose has spent with us has been full - chock full of the sort of chokes, bottles and valiant 'nearly' finishes that signify challenging but not quite succeeding. Them's the facts. So it isn't surprising when Rose mentions us as a 'nearly' club given the way his spell here has gone - and I feel like all you chaps are being a bit disingenuous (no disrespect intended, of course) in talking about why it's *okay* to be a nearly club now (as @Gutter Boy did, for example) rather than contesting his assertion that we are one. Just my two cents.
Let's look at us from the time he joined us in 2007. Forget the barren 2000's and 1990's prior to that, because footballers don't tend to think of the ultra long-term in that manner. Just think of the ten-odd years he's been here.
In 2007-2008, we won the Carling Cup. It felt like we were on the verge of something. We had a truly magnificent strike force up top, and only needed a more robust midfield and defence (alongside a more mentally strong unit as a whole - one that didn't give up on the season in March) to go on to big things.
2008-2009 - We lost that strike partnership that summer. Got to the Carling Cup final again in 2008-2009 under Harry. Lost to United. Finished 8th.
2009-2010 - Spent a load of money in January 2009 and the summer of 2010. Had a great league season. Finished 4th. Got to the FA Cup semi-final, but lost, unbelievably, to relegated Portsmouth.
2010-2011 - got to the quarter finals of the CL before being thumped by Real Madrid. Finished 5th - looked capable of repeating our CL qualification late on, but fell away in the end.
2011-2012 - got to 4th, but missed out on the CL after a mid-season collapse and Chelsea winning the CL in one of the most unfortunate circumstances in recent footballing memory - one that was rectified afterwards, so we were the only club which would ever suffer under those unique circumstances. Got to the FA Cup semi-final, but lost, to Chelsea.
2012-2013 - had a great league season, our highest ever points total prior to this year - but juuuuust lost out to Arsenal for that final CL spot.
2013-2014 - aimless drifting. Spent a buttload of money from the Bale sale on players we thought would win us the league. They didn't. 'Spurs will always let you down', came Roy Keane's jibe.
2014-2015 - first season under Poch. Inconsistent, fun to watch, managed to finish 5th. Got to the CC final, but lost to Chelsea.
2015-2016 - Second season under Poch. Fun to watch, mostly consistent, but a horrible end to the season removed any lingering hopes of the title and let Arsenal finish above us again (which they'd been doing for the entirety of the past nine years, incidentally) on the final day.
2016-2017 - third season under Poch. Magnificent to watch, ruthlessly consistent, record points tally by an enormous margin, *still* lost out on the title to an even more consistent Chelsea side, lost in the FA Cup semi final to that same Chelsea side, were ingloriously dumped out of the CL and then lost to Gent in the EL. And, after a season where all the boys said the next step was winning a trophy, we ended up sitting on our hands watching United win the EL and CC, Arsenal with the FA Cup and Chelsea win the league.
As fans, it's easy for us to discard Rose's opinions as so much tattle because of the past three years under Poch bringing gradual progress and a stadium on the horizon. But, even if you ignore the terrible 90's and early-to-mid 2000's, the decade Rose has spent with us has been full - chock full of the sort of chokes, bottles and valiant 'nearly' finishes that signify challenging but not quite succeeding. Them's the facts. So it isn't surprising when Rose mentions us as a 'nearly' club given the way his spell here has gone - and I feel like all you chaps are being a bit disingenuous (no disrespect intended, of course) in talking about why it's *okay* to be a nearly club now (as @Gutter Boy did, for example) rather than contesting his assertion that we are one. Just my two cents.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Also....
....fantastic!
Where are our medals for all of those great things?
Jamie Carragher, a former player (albeit a professional git) himself, put it best when he said that, at the end of the day, players still care about winning things in their careers, whatever they may be. When you get to a new dressing room, it isn't 'oh, how did you improve yourself over the last two seasons?', it's 'show us your medals - what have you got?'. Gary Neville agreed with his assessment to an extent when he said that we need to win something to actualize this progress we're making - FA Cup, Europa League, whatever. He only disagreed when pointing out that our circumstances mean we're doing well to challenge, never mind win things.
If you're bored of the 'Spurs need to win a trophy stuff', wait till our players sod off because they haven't won any and then go through awkward pauses in their later interviews when their time at Spurs is brought up. 'Oh, we had some great years. You know, we could have won things, we came close. But we had some great years.'
Somewhat mystifying, that stance. Again, don't mean to be disrespectful or anything. But it's just a bit baffling to me, is all.
....fantastic!
Where are our medals for all of those great things?
Jamie Carragher, a former player (albeit a professional git) himself, put it best when he said that, at the end of the day, players still care about winning things in their careers, whatever they may be. When you get to a new dressing room, it isn't 'oh, how did you improve yourself over the last two seasons?', it's 'show us your medals - what have you got?'. Gary Neville agreed with his assessment to an extent when he said that we need to win something to actualize this progress we're making - FA Cup, Europa League, whatever. He only disagreed when pointing out that our circumstances mean we're doing well to challenge, never mind win things.
If you're bored of the 'Spurs need to win a trophy stuff', wait till our players sod off because they haven't won any and then go through awkward pauses in their later interviews when their time at Spurs is brought up. 'Oh, we had some great years. You know, we could have won things, we came close. But we had some great years.'
Somewhat mystifying, that stance. Again, don't mean to be disrespectful or anything. But it's just a bit baffling to me, is all.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Don't be baffled, just reserve judgement. Poch has overseen an enourmous shift in the way our club operates, behaves and plays. We now spend one season 'homeless' before returning to a brilliant new stadium. And I will bet you right here, right now that Kane, Alli, Jan, Toby, Hugo, Christian, Victor and Eric (of the 'big boys') will ALL both want to, and will, run out at the new Lane for that first home game of the season. IF at the end of THAT season there has been no silverware then I would agree, break-up is a potential issue.
But not before.
Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
Parklaner81
Steve Hodge
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
As I said, the trophies that actually mean something are the Premier League and the Champions League. When the players say they want to win trophies, I assume they are the two they are referring to.
The League Cup is an excuse to blood youngsters. The FA Cup has seen some terrible teams make it to the final and has seen Arsenal beat two non league teams on their way there. The Europa League has always been a consolation prize for clubs that would rather not be in it. The FA Cup didn't save LVG's job because it was some massive achievement that proved he could win trophies. He beat a terrible Palace team and that was that. I don't think Dele is going to look back on his time at Spurs and think 'all that hard running was worth it' if he has a League Cup to show for it.
I'm right there with you, the players want trophies, and I get that. But to me, the trophies that mean something are the PL and CL. We've looked like the team most likely to win the PL over the last two years. Emirates Marketing Project haven't. Liverpool haven't. Man United and Arsenal most certainly haven't. If we are a nearly club, they are in some discussion that doesn't even warrant a mention.
We finished second, but not a limp to second like Arsenal last year. A second which was 'damn did you see how good Spurs were all season long!? Harsh on them to not win the title'. We were great. And we are building a team to consistently challenge for the league, the domestic trophy which is an undeniable proof of consistent excellence all season long. The fact we are doing this with our budget and our history of being a nearly/nowhere club in the Jol/Harry/AVB/Tim years seems irrelevant to you, but it does make the achievement even more remarkable to me too.
And again, every single player we have has improved beyond recognition and is playing the best football of their career. No, we haven't gotten them a nice shiny League Cup or the European booby prize to show for it, but we've set our sights higher. We are competing for the title, and have been the only team doing that, while competing in Europe, over the last 2 years. It's a fantastic acheivement and again, if anyone thinks we are a nearly club given all of that, I wouldn't mourn their sale.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Good on you Dubai and long may you remain the contrarian.
Speaking for my self, it's not that I don't want us to win a trophy, I really yearn for one, but I am willing to be patient. There is something that doesn't feel right to belittle this teams magnificent season because we are judging it through the prism of other teams, Chelsea aside, having succeeded in winning less challenging tournaments than the one we went for.
We went for the title -to win it, not finish second. As you know great teams are measured by their league title wins not FA cups not League cups or Europa league wins. I am not saying I would not celebrate winning one of those tournaments but if we are in a position to it is right to go for the league over all other tournaments given our squad is not yet good enough to challenge on multiple fronts. That is the very essence of Bill Nick's " it is better to fail aiming high than to succeed aiming low".
So if Spurs are to win the league we need to achieve 90 points or more. Seeing as we had been hovering between 70-72 points to then achieve 86 points was incredible. Psychologically that puts us in a great position to go for our target. In the players and Poch's minds it is now achievable. We can be a top team that other teams fear. Or we can go back to being a team that wins the odd cup but don't really amount to much in the big tournaments, like Arsenal have become.
What we should be celebrating is that we are becoming a force to be reckoned with. A team who you will have to beat to win the title. A team with multiple £20million possibly £30million players. That is the first time in my 37 years supporting Spurs.
A final point, we should not be beholden to our players. If they want to leave so be it, winning a trophy will not necessarily keep them at the club as we saw all too painfully with Berba and Keane. Leicester won the title and still lost Ngolo Kante to Chelsea. There will always be bigger fish ready to hoover up our players. We must however remain focused on our target and not lose Pochettino.
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Spur of the moment
Frederic Kanoute
Can you imagine how Poch must be feeling after such an outstanding season when not just the fans but even his own players are now revealing precisely the weak mentality he is trying with all his might to overcome?
So many times in the past two / three seasons I have heard phrases like 'We are on a journey.'
Yes, we are on a journey. Poch and Levy are on a journey no less than to establish Tottenham among the elite of England and ultimately Europe. And one of the most pernicious obstacles in their way is this pestilential weak mentality thing that has been allowed to take root within the club over decades.
Another is the fact that for the past decade or so Tottenham have represented by far the most real and increasing threat to the hegemony of the Sky Four / money doped clubs. Therefore those same clubs are inevitably going to be that much more resolved when they play us than most others. It was hardly a coincidence on 2nd May 2016 that Chelsea produced their game of the season in the Battle of Stamford Bridge.
It was a game whereby stopping us meant far more than simply grabbing a point. They were determined to do whatever it took to spike our chances of winning the League.
It was infinitely preferable for Leicester to become Champions because they were seen as a one-off who were never going to be a long-term threat to their cartel. But even more importantly the Foxes would be helping prevent Tottenham from successfully gatecrashing their cosy little elite and expanding the so-called Big Five into a Big Six, thereby increasing the competition for the big trophies they felt was rightfully theirs and theirs alone.
So it is against this background that our present progress must be measured rather than our failures in the past. It is why Poch will once again need to tear into the mentality of the squad once he gets back pre-season, only this time to demand that all talk of being a 'nearly club' be banished forthwith and to throw down the gauntlet to his players, okay then you lot, you''ve proved you are good enough to compete for trophies, now go out PROVE to me it's not you that are part of this weak mentality 'nearly' thing, go out and fudging win something this time round.
So many times in the past two / three seasons I have heard phrases like 'We are on a journey.'
Yes, we are on a journey. Poch and Levy are on a journey no less than to establish Tottenham among the elite of England and ultimately Europe. And one of the most pernicious obstacles in their way is this pestilential weak mentality thing that has been allowed to take root within the club over decades.
Another is the fact that for the past decade or so Tottenham have represented by far the most real and increasing threat to the hegemony of the Sky Four / money doped clubs. Therefore those same clubs are inevitably going to be that much more resolved when they play us than most others. It was hardly a coincidence on 2nd May 2016 that Chelsea produced their game of the season in the Battle of Stamford Bridge.
It was a game whereby stopping us meant far more than simply grabbing a point. They were determined to do whatever it took to spike our chances of winning the League.
It was infinitely preferable for Leicester to become Champions because they were seen as a one-off who were never going to be a long-term threat to their cartel. But even more importantly the Foxes would be helping prevent Tottenham from successfully gatecrashing their cosy little elite and expanding the so-called Big Five into a Big Six, thereby increasing the competition for the big trophies they felt was rightfully theirs and theirs alone.
So it is against this background that our present progress must be measured rather than our failures in the past. It is why Poch will once again need to tear into the mentality of the squad once he gets back pre-season, only this time to demand that all talk of being a 'nearly club' be banished forthwith and to throw down the gauntlet to his players, okay then you lot, you''ve proved you are good enough to compete for trophies, now go out PROVE to me it's not you that are part of this weak mentality 'nearly' thing, go out and fudging win something this time round.
Lemonade Money
Les Medley
Look at that lovely trophy.