Mario Gomez

[Gutter Boy]

Re: Mario Gómez

He scored goals which is important but he does nothing else. He contributes less to team play than both Defoe and Darren Bent.

You mean he'll average less than 10 touches a game and have a pass completion rate of below 25%? Is that possible?

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Mario Gómez

straight swap i can see your point.....but how much is gomez going to cost us?

No thanks to 1 trick pony

I completely agree with your opinion about Gomez BUT do you think there's a possibility a poacher can be successful in our system? i mean Gomez to me offers absolutely jack brick bar goals and i like my striker to offer more, but with the solid 3 in the centre who are all extremely hard working and Bale and an inverted winger on the other side...do you think we'd be able to 'get away with it' so to speak?

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Mario Gómez

You mean he'll average less than 10 touches a game and have a pass completion rate of below 25%? Is that possible?

Defoe offers far more in general play than Gomez and that's saying something. Bent works harder than Gomez too.

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

Defoe offers far more in general play than Gomez and that's saying something. Bent works harder than Gomez too.

Yeah but Gomez is a pure finisher. Im not one for stats but goals is goals and an average of over 1 in 2 is better than both Ade and Defoe thereby an improvement. I want Ade gone and now. Defoe ill keep as he offers something different than someone like Gomez would.

I think if you have Villa, Bale and Gomez you will have the full repertoire of skill, pace, power, creativity, intelligence and clinical finishing. Sometimes its not just one player that has to have all those attributes (Bale does actually) but more the trio and what they offer.

 

[africanspurs]

Re: Mario Gómez

You mean he'll average less than 10 touches a game and have a pass completion rate of below 25%? Is that possible?

for him yes. I have seen him do that several times

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Mario Gómez

Yeah but Gomez is a pure finisher. Im not one for stats but goals is goals and an average of over 1 in 2 is better than both Ade and Defoe thereby an improvement. I want Ade gone and now. Defoe ill keep as he offers something different than someone like Gomez would.

I think if you have Villa, Bale and Gomez you will have the full repertoire of skill, pace, power, creativity, intelligence and clinical finishing. Sometimes its not just one player that has to have all those attributes (Bale does actually) but more the trio and what they offer.

My opinion is that Villa will only consider coming here if he's given assurances that he's seen as a central striker.

 

[camspur]

Re: Mario Gómez

I completely agree with your opinion about Gomez BUT do you think there's a possibility a poacher can be successful in our system? i mean Gomez to me offers absolutely jack brick bar goals and i like my striker to offer more, but with the solid 3 in the centre who are all extremely hard working and Bale and an inverted winger on the other side...do you think we'd be able to 'get away with it' so to speak?

You mean could Gomez score goals alongside two wingers (Bale and Lennon for now), hmm bit like asking could a striker score goals alongside two wingers like Ribery and Robben.

All last season we moaned about how many times Lennon and Bale got the ball into the penalty area and noone was there, Gomez would be. It is what we lacked last season and now we're saying he doesn't fit our system.

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

My opinion is that Villa will only consider coming here if he's given assurances that he's seen as a central striker.

Not the right of a front three? Or switching it up with Bale

I love Lennon and he should and will stay but we need someone who can play on the right in a front three - im assuming we will be playing 433

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

You mean could Gomez score goals alongside two wingers (Bale and Lennon for now), hmm bit like asking could a striker score goals alongside two wingers like Ribery and Robben.

All last season we moaned about how many times Lennon and Bale got the ball into the penalty area and noone was there, Gomez would be. It is what we lacked last season and now we're saying he doesn't fit our system.

I totally agree - but of course people seem to forget we have Ade.

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Mario Gómez

Not the right of a front three? Or switching it up with Bale

I love Lennon and he should and will stay but we need someone who can play on the right in a front three - im assuming we will be playing 433

I agree, we need someone that can play on the right or left (depending on where Bale plays) of a front 3.

Villa has stated that he wants to be playing centrally, how it's very important to him especially with the world cup coming up. That's where he sees himself so i'm pretty sure whoever he joins will have to give him these reassurances.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Mario Gómez

You mean could Gomez score goals alongside two wingers (Bale and Lennon for now), hmm bit like asking could a striker score goals alongside two wingers like Ribery and Robben.

All last season we moaned about how many times Lennon and Bale got the ball into the penalty area and noone was there, Gomez would be. It is what we lacked last season and now we're saying he doesn't fit our system.

Bale didn't play as a winger at all for the second half of last season. If he's moved wide again I think it will be on the right of a 4-3-3 and he will play a fairly narrow role.

Yes, Gomez did score goals with Ribery and Robben on the flanks. Yet that wasn't enough and Bayern fairly easily replaced him for not that much money with a player that did better.

I totally agree - but of course people seem to forget we have Ade.

It's not a choice between Gomez and Ade. People haven't forgotten that we have Ade. People see us being linked to a host of strikers from around the world and are unimpressed with Gomez compared to those other names.

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Mario Gómez

You mean could Gomez score goals alongside two wingers (Bale and Lennon for now), hmm bit like asking could a striker score goals alongside two wingers like Ribery and Robben.

All last season we moaned about how many times Lennon and Bale got the ball into the penalty area and noone was there, Gomez would be. It is what we lacked last season and now we're saying he doesn't fit our system.

That's not what i meant. Gomez offers fudge all but being a goal threat which you can get way with against certain teams but against other bigger teams i don't think you could get away with a passenger. Have you seen his work rate? it's fudging pathetic...he literally just stands there and doesn't even bother chasing down defenders. His link up play is equally non existent so it's a big gamble having a player like that.

Saying that though you have to take into account the extraordinary work rate our midfield 3 produce. That's why i'm asking AS if it might work.

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

Bale didn't play as a winger at all for the second half of last season. If he's moved wide again I think it will be on the right of a 4-3-3 and he will play a fairly narrow role.

Yes, Gomez did score goals with Ribery and Robben on the flanks. Yet that wasn't enough and Bayern fairly easily replaced him for not that much money with a player that did better.



It's not a choice between Gomez and Ade. People haven't forgotten that we have Ade. People see us being linked to a host of strikers from around the world and are unimpressed with Gomez compared to those other names.

I see your point, I guess I see it as a comparison between Ade and the other strikers we are linked with rather than a comparison between the strikers we are linked with. If someone like Gomez and Villa came in - those two would automatically make us stronger in an attacking sense thus an improvement. I think you have to compare what youre bringing in with what you already have rather than comparing the potential prospects (although there is a case for that).

The reason I dont consider thegroup of 'being linked to a host of strikers around the world and are unimpressed with Gomez compared to those other names' is simply because we could have been linked to Ibrahimovic for example (an unrealistic proposition) who would no doubt cost a bit more. You can always get in better than the players you are buying but factors play a part such as the players value, wages etc

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Mario Gómez

Your forgetting that its not important how many goals a striker scores :lol:

The measure of a good striker is how well he can "dove tail" (whatever that means) with Gareth Bale apparently.

Whether he can stick the ball in the back of the net is neither here nor there.

This is a misrepresentation of what people are saying.

Some of us want a striker that can score goals and also do other things. Not just a pure poacher, but a more complete forward. I don't think that's unreasonable.

You mean he'll average less than 10 touches a game and have a pass completion rate of below 25%? Is that possible?

Last season:

Bundesliga: Apps - 9(12). Avg passes - 7.5

CL: Apps - 2(5). Avg passes - 6.4

Now those numbers aren't that accurate since so many of his games were as a sub, so I looked at some of his recent games as a starter just as examples:

4-0 home win against Nurnberg, Gomez played 90 minutes, 20 passes, 65% pass accuracy.
6-1 away win against Hannover, Gomez played 63 minutes, 12 passes, 75% pass accuracy.
4-0 home win against Barcelona, Gomez played 71 minutes, 5 passes, 80% pass accuracy.
1-1 away draw against Dortmund, Gomez played 67 minutes, 9 passes, 78% pass accuracy.
3-2 home win against Stuttgart, Gomez played 62 minutes, 13 passes, 62% pass accuracy.

Those were his 5 last starts in all competitions I think. Worth noting that very rarely do we dominate a game like Bayern did against Nurnberg or Hannover. But even when they did his involvement wasn't exactly massive.

I don't think saying that he's contributing less to team play than Defoe and Bent is all that far fetched to be honest.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Mario Gómez

I see your point, I guess I see it as a comparison between Ade and the other strikers we are linked with rather than a comparison between the strikers we are linked with. If someone like Gomez and Villa came in - those two would automatically make us stronger in an attacking sense thus an improvement. I think you have to compare what youre bringing in with what you already have rather than comparing the potential prospects (although there is a case for that).

The reason I dont consider thegroup of 'being linked to a host of strikers around the world and are unimpressed with Gomez compared to those other names' is simply because we could have been linked to Ibrahimovic for example (an unrealistic proposition) who would no doubt cost a bit more. You can always get in better than the players you are buying but factors play a part such as the players value, wages etc

At least some of the targets we're being linked with are realistic and at least some of them would cost around the same or less than Gomez.

I was talking about the realistic players we've been linked with, not Ibrahimovic.

If we're spending around £15m on a striker I think him being better than the two strikers we already have that failed us last season is a rather low bar to be judging him by.

Edit: And although Gomez would have been better than Ade was last season I don't think he would have been much better, if better at all, than Ade was during his loan season.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Re: Mario Gómez

Not the right of a front three? Or switching it up with Bale

I love Lennon and he should and will stay but we need someone who can play on the right in a front three - im assuming we will be playing 433

IMO Bale will play on the right.

Then it'll either be Villa on the left and a new CF, or Villa in the centre and a new leftie who cuts in (someone like Bernard or Rebic?).

It will be pretty fluid anyway.

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

At least some of the targets we're being linked with are realistic and at least some of them would cost around the same or less than Gomez.

I was talking about the realistic players we've been linked with, not Ibrahimovic.

If we're spending around £15m on a striker I think him being better than the two strikers we already have that failed us last season is a rather low bar to be judging him by.

Edit: And although Gomez would have been better than Ade was last season I don't think he would have been much better, if better at all, than Ade was during his loan season.

All I know in terms of strikers we have been linked with is Villa, im unsure who else we have been linked with. Leandro? who seems not to be rated on here. Martinez from Porto? will likely cost £30m.

15m doesnt actually get you much of a striker, unless youre spending 50m on a Falcao or Cavani who are the finished product you are going to have to buy a striker who has some deficiencies. A striker who can finish like Gomez but may not have that great linking up abilities etc is better than the opposite in my opinion (providing that you accept that for 15m you wont buy the perfect striker). I mean some on here want Benteke for 20 odd million (which he will cost) well for 20m youre buying potential which may not be realised.

Personally? im unsure why we cant go for Higuain and get Villa by selling Ade. So whilst a total outlay of 23m im sure we have that cash floundering around and if we dont then just not get Villa and lay the cash on Higuain.

 

[DHSF]

Re: Mario Gómez

IMO Bale will play on the right.

Then it'll either be Villa on the left and a new CF, or Villa in the centre and a new leftie who cuts in (someone like Bernard or Rebic?).

It will be pretty fluid anyway.

I think it will be fluid - I dont think any of the three will be really stationary in their positions. So Villa makes sense but also a new centre forward as it were.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Mario Gómez

All I know in terms of strikers we have been linked with is Villa, im unsure who else we have been linked with. Leandro? who seems not to be rated on here. Martinez from Porto? will likely cost £30m.

15m doesnt actually get you much of a striker, unless youre spending 50m on a Falcao or Cavani who are the finished product you are going to have to buy a striker who has some deficiencies. A striker who can finish like Gomez but may not have that great linking up abilities etc is better than the opposite in my opinion (providing that you accept that for 15m you wont buy the perfect striker). I mean some on here want Benteke for 20 odd million (which he will cost) well for 20m youre buying potential which may not be realised.

Personally? im unsure why we cant go for Higuain and get Villa by selling Ade. So whilst a total outlay of 23m im sure we have that cash floundering around and if we dont then just not get Villa and lay the cash on Higuain.

Villa is so far and beyond Gomez he should be insulted to even be mentioned in the same sentence as Gomez.

Soldado is also heads and shoulders above Gomez, would be more expensive, but also far better.

I suppose we haven't been linked with a ton of obvious first choice strikers apart from Villa at this point. I would take anyone Baldini and AVB agree on ahead of Gomez though. And I would rather see us spend £20+ on Benteke than spend £15m on Gomez.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Mario Gómez

I think it will be fluid - I dont think any of the three will be really stationary in their positions. So Villa makes sense but also a new centre forward as it were.

If we want fluidity in a front 3 then Gomez cannot be one of those three.