Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
Looks that way
It’s been flipped around and the trust are trying to make it look very “tit for tat”
Next thing the trust will threaten to take their ball away
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European Super League - Dead on arrival
- Thread starter milo
- Start date
It’s been flipped around and the trust are trying to make it look very “tit for tat”
Next thing the trust will threaten to take their ball away
The THST are idiots. The come across as a bunch of busy-bodies (never thought I'd use that word!) with too much time on their hands and not enough brain power.
Rejecting the meeting with the club in the first instance was daft as is the 'mediation' thing which they're on about - they have no rights to demand that and equally no rights to demand chance in ownership of teh club (unless they buy ENIC out).
The club's statement yesterday was fine and putting a fan on an advisory board is a good idea. That person is going to have to be carefully selected and equally will need to adhere to appropriate confidentiality obligations, so people shouldn't expect this to open up flows of information, but its a sensible step for the club to take
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
I’d bet a large amount of money that Emirates Marketing Project have drastically closed the gap from 10 years ago.
milo
Jack L. Jones
That might have something to do with the average age of Facebook users.
the funny thing is people who are/in around the club & Levy and think they will outsmart him .
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
Well... the trust has some smart people on it
But it does feel like they need a change of face too
The guys are passionate about the club and passionate about what they believe is right
What they don’t get is they have actually very little say in anything and the club can abs will flatly ignore them
Using their voice as much as they can is all they can do but to get traction you need traction. They have never quite managed that for many reasons I’m sure
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
I agree. I think we were in there merely because they needed 6 in the PL for the others to avoid potential of expulsion. I agree with you that once up and running the actual big clubs (you know the ones that actually have won lots of trophies) would seek their true slice of the pie. We’d be better off than the other 14 PL clubs (at least until the rest of the ESL decide we bring nothing to the party other than a nice stadium) but probably actually end up with a much larger gap between us and the truly big English clubs. My belief is that the ESL would’ve made our owners richer but reduce our chance of actually winning things.
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Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
Indeed. If you look at Instagram as a platform for the younger generation it is already much closer. Emirates Marketing Project have already overtaken Arsenal. They are probably 5 to 10 years of similar success to the last 5 years from being the most followed UK team.
Enic would have sold the club as quick as they could. Probably to an american who thought it would work like the nfl.
Let me try to answer (perhaps too long and much too personal but hey, you asked)
- I've lived in 9 countries, worked in 6 (long story)
- Not born in UK, but some of my family is from.
- Been a Spurs fans since the early 80's
- Not that it means anything but I've flown back to see games pretty much every year since 2009 (also seen us play in multiple countries)
- Back in London now, got my season tickets
- As humbly as I can say it, I work with/for significantly bigger companies than Spurs and often look at it from a business perspective
Re some of the other stuff
- No, I would not support the club moving or leaving the PL (both of those in my opinion are red herring arguments/fear mongering, because ESL has some components of American sport does not mean clubs suddenly move, for many reasons but as example in American sport often the the stadium doesn't belong to the club as vs. here where we/everyone have an asset on the books for 30 years)
- I loved WHL and the atmosphere of a CL night there, but I'm also ok with the fact that part of our progress has different type of fans (e.g. the Korean fans that fly all the way to London and spend a lot of money on tickets/merch/etc. Perhaps I identify because for years that was me)
- I'm not a football fan, I'm a Spurs fan and pragmatic (I'm not going to believe we are going to fix FIFA/FA/UEFA anytime soon)
- Part of Spurs success is the change, yes (like it or not) casuals, corporate (who will pay the price of car for a season ticket) and overseas have to be a key part of the business plan, even over the "local"/traditional supporter.
What I want to see is Spurs successful, win something. To do that there are two routes
- The club is successful as a business and takes that and translates into on field success (I have no expectations of Spurs being United size, winning trophies every year but occasional success and being part of the top clubs will do)
- We get a sugar daddy (I'd prefer option 1 but am comfortable enough with my inner hypocrite to know I'd still support even enjoy our wins)
My frustration around this topic is regardless of if it's the Trust, other supporters, the media, it's all the same view
- fear mongering -> ESL will cause teams in the championship to die, really how the fudge do you make that connection, same for us suddenly becoming "insert US city" Spurs (word of advice, when people have to appeal to your anger or make tenuous connections -> you are being played, and the entire UK fanbase became stooges to protect Sky/BT/UEFA revenue and the current imbalance in the game)
- More fear mongering above, ESL top clubs would have asked for more share = no, they wouldn't, there was 23 year business model with guarantees (what the clubs want), and this is supporter lack of business understanding kicking in. The top 15 clubs on even footing is ok (only Chelsea/CIty/PSG/Bayern who all have a huge advantage today would be upset with that), again real world, the top banks don't see each other as competitors (they have been competing with each other as long as some football clubs), it's someone outside coming in that is the concern (the "uber" of every business threat)
- problem without solution or help. The club has financial challenges it did not make with Covid, has the Trust, this board, any fudging supporter said -> hey, maybe we (anyone who can) all buy an extra kit this season? no, lets bitch about ESL, demand ticket price freezes and call Levy a cheap fudge when he doesn't buy 10 more players this summer.
- An external to domestic league football without relegation/promotion bad! why? = bad, mutter, game dying, everyone get bored, mutter, mutter. To sit here and say sport (not even the whole sport, just one competition external to domestics) without relegation/promotion is dead/boring/non competitive is just fudging ignorant and judgemental (because it's not in your experience doesn't mean it sucks or doesn't work)
- The entire lack of acknowledgement that the game is currently broken, and Spurs fans are cheering at the rafters at keeping in place a system that has fudged us over and over and making sure City/Chelsea use the UK game as their plaything for the next decade.
wow .. that was too long ...
There is a third route that can make the premier league more competitive. A salary cap. La liga now have a sort of one. We are also seeing with la liga and the bundesliga the beginnings of more equal tv rights distribution. Which will make those leagues more competitive.
The champions league needs a serious overhaul. Every time a tv rights deal has come up the biggest clubs have asked for more and got it. This needs to be reversed with some of the money goi g to the domestic leagues rather than the clubs.
Also remember the esl was not going to be one club one vote like the prem. Real madrid owned the largest share followed by barca, then utd. Barca and madrid are not motivated by profit. They are by their very nature not meant to make profit. They are not interested in a fair and competitive league that benefits all (they fought la liga tooth and nail over the redistribution of tv rights). They are solely interested in winning trophies. So will they ask/demand more? Every single time in their history they have, so to think they'll stop now and be happy is naive.
Spur of the moment
Frederic Kanoute
One reason - not the only one tbf - that the PL is globally successful is because average salaries are higher than for all but a handful of players at elite clubs in Europe. Helps attract top talent from all over the world even to some of the more average clubs.
A salary cap might still work for the PL so long as the average pay is higher than elsewhere.
A salary cap might still work for the PL so long as the average pay is higher than elsewhere.
Baleforce
Arthur Rowe
any cap would need to be continent wide, else PL clubs would be at a disadvantage in the CL
It may well happen. Most clubs in europe are in massive financial trouble. Serie a has just lost 20% of it's tv rights. La liga already decides how much each club can spend on wages. Ligue 1 hasn't got a tv deal as media pro france went bust (canal plus are paying a 3rd to show games). The bundesliga rights have just dropped and 25% will be determined by league position rather than the 50% it used to be. Champions league has lost a lot of viewers. That's not to mention covid.
It's going to be an interesting summer.
The only route that can work is a real implementation of fair business practice rules, e.g.
- Some kind of wage cap as % of income (and yes, this will cause a bias in the system, but improve your club, improve your ability to spend)
- Closely tied to that is true examination of sponsorships/sales (e.g cousin of owner suddenly buys 10M jerseys flimflam, or sponsorship deals from sister companies way out of expected range)
- Clubs can't have £1B+ in owner debt on the books for a decade with no plan to pay off
- Maximum number of players in squad (no player hoarding, 35+ players on loan, etc.)
- You can't spend £2B+ and sell your product at a loss, this is classic anti-trust in any other industry
The problem is the solutions are there, but you have a combination of self serving and corrupt organizations who are happy with the status quo (and don't give a fudge about the game at a grass roots level or fans), have invested in the status quo and the ESL was the first real challenge to that system.
And those organizations got the response they wanted from supporters, i.e.
- Instead of saying we understand why the clubs are looking at this based on the flaws in current system, we do not support but we demand accountability from the FA/UEFA/Government/etc. to work with the clubs to come up with a plan that over time addresses the real issues and the direction the game is taken.
What we got is
- ESL bad! all the clubs fault, greedy evil foreign owners (the level of outright bigotry in some of the ESL coverage was outrageous), Sky/BT/FA/UEFA are bastions of our game and the guardians of football integrity, what we have is perfect and now (see Trust and the flimflam) instead of asking for accountability from the FA (e.g. your question), we are asking for accountability from the clubs ..fudging amazing
Baleforce
Arthur Rowe
are all of those things legally enforceable though?
The initial reaction we got was esl bad. Because it was.
Now we are talking about those things. Salary caps etc... are being discussed in the media. The government are taking a look with the fan led review. Debt and financial problems of clubs are being discussed european wide.
Hopefully something good can come out of it.
Boris is on record saying he'd look at changing laws if needed to. We are not constrained by eu law as much now. So we will see what the fan led review says and if boris will actually do what he says.
Baleforce
Arthur Rowe
again, I can't see changes being made in the UK that put our clubs at a disadvantage to those in the EU
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
Not really no.