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Eric Dier

Baleforce said:
We struggle to play out whoever launches the attack.

We are lazy with our positioning, passing and control across the team.
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We can only hope our next manager helps with that but it won’t make Dier be able to pass the ball better or have better positioning, have better instincts etc. He needs to go to a club like Palace where there’s not as much riding on it if he has a poor game or a poor season.
 
I never abuse players when I'm at the lane not even the opposition ... however when I'm at home and have had time to reflect I find it hard to defend him.

I've had enough of seeing him in a spurs shirt. He has had every chance under numerous managers, just don't think he is the smart answer.

When he goes ill wish him all the best and expect him to become a world beater
 
billyiddo said:
Defense has been our weakest position for a few years now - i think the balance of criticism is about right with that in mind.
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For me, the criticism then has to go onto managers who have declined a possession ‘front-foot’ ethos for one were possession is ceded and advantage supposedly gets taken on the break. That approach
A) does not suit players who are not technically excellent at all times and
B) offers a lot more margin for error(s) all round.

IMO…
 
Raziel said:
And that's on the managers

In possession, Dier is suspect against a press, the midfield is constantly outnumbered so the out ball isn't obvious and his passing is a bit hit or miss.
Out of possession, he isn't great 1:1 or in the air and out model often leaves CB's exposed against runners from opposition midfield (see point above) or the WB's get beaten and put crosses in.

He's not good enough for us anymore (if he ever was), but the system isn't helping, and why you would continue that system with these players is beyond me.

Look at Klopp's Liverpool, when he first came in the defenders all looked like jokers (Lovren anyone?). VVD & Alison stabilized it, now VVD has regressed and they don't press the front as much their back line looks like jokers again.
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I am all onboard with observations/criticisms like this. The fairest I have seen TBH…there is something strange afoot when a club continues with a footballing philosophy which does not make the best use of the players available. Having said that, with 8 games left, it would be ludicrous to try an all-change right now. I think if we start next season like this, with similar personnel trying to execute it, then I’ll have some issues.
 
thfcsteff said:
For me, the criticism then has to go onto managers who have declined a possession ‘front-foot’ ethos for one were possession is ceded and advantage supposedly gets taken on the break. That approach
A) does not suit players who are not technically excellent at all times and
B) offers a lot more margin for error(s) all round.

IMO…
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Wouldn't really make a difference in Dier's case as his base defensive ability isn't high enough. Add that in a possession heavy technical side his poor passing range and general lack of mobility would hinder him.

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Bishop said:
Wouldn't really make a difference in Dier's case as his base defensive ability isn't high enough. Add that in a possession heavy technical side his poor passing range and general lack of mobility would hinder him.

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See, I am fine with criticisms of performance, but this sort of stuff? Come on fella, let’s just take a step back and reflect on the appearances he’s made, the managers who have picked him, the dozens and dozens of England caps…are you telling me that they’re all the consequence of luck and bad judgement?

Does he need replacing in the starting 11 should we wish to win big silverware? Yes…
 
thfcsteff said:
See, I am fine with criticisms of performance, but this sort of stuff? Come on fella, let’s just take a step back and reflect on the appearances he’s made, the managers who have picked him, the dozens and dozens of England caps…are you telling me that they’re all the consequence of luck and bad judgement?

Does he need replacing in the starting 11 should we wish to win big silverware? Yes…
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Agree with this Steff.

He is a paradox. He’s ubiquitous but not a total footballer. He’s a leader but doesn’t seem to be listened to, and seen as a failure despite largely being ‘successful’.

Hindsight will record he should have been kept in front of the defence - and it’s not too late for a club to restore him to that role.

He has an £85k a week contract though - so we will have another season of him - which is good and bad.

Outwardly, it seems to me he could make a good coach.
 
thfcsteff said:
See, I am fine with criticisms of performance, but this sort of stuff? Come on fella, let’s just take a step back and reflect on the appearances he’s made, the managers who have picked him, the dozens and dozens of England caps…are you telling me that they’re all the consequence of luck and bad judgement?

Does he need replacing in the starting 11 should we wish to win big silverware? Yes…
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I think you took what I said as if I'm saying he's brick. He's not brick, but he's also clearly not top class. In the type of side you suggested his base qualities are not high enough to perform in them. That's not to say he's a totally useless clodger (which I didn't say) just that he isn't good enough for a title challenging side and he isn't quite good enough for a top 4 chasing either in reality.

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Bishop said:
I think you took what I said as if I'm saying he's brick. He's not brick, but he's also clearly not top class. In the type of side you suggested his base qualities are not high enough to perform in them. That's not to say he's a totally useless clodger (which I didn't say) just that he isn't good enough for a title challenging side and he isn't quite good enough for a top 4 chasing either in reality.

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He is most certainly good enough for a side chasing top 4 given he has been part of a generation which saw us become a top 4 regular. Where I agree is we need a step up to actually win trophies.
 
thfcsteff said:
See, I am fine with criticisms of performance, but this sort of stuff? Come on fella, let’s just take a step back and reflect on the appearances he’s made, the managers who have picked him, the dozens and dozens of England caps…are you telling me that they’re all the consequence of luck and bad judgement?

Does he need replacing in the starting 11 should we wish to win big silverware? Yes…
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The only one who had anything like alternative options (Poch) didn’t tend to pick him (at least not at CB). Mourinho and Conte both tried to get new CBs but the recruitment team didn’t deliver them.

If Eric Dier is still a first choice player or Spurs then we have almost no chance of a trophy and a very slim chance of winning Levy’s 4th place trophy IMO.
 
Bishop said:
I think you took what I said as if I'm saying he's brick. He's not brick, but he's also clearly not top class. In the type of side you suggested his base qualities are not high enough to perform in them. That's not to say he's a totally useless clodger (which I didn't say) just that he isn't good enough for a title challenging side and he isn't quite good enough for a top 4 chasing either in reality.

Sent from my XQ-BC72 using Fapatalk
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Title challenging sides aren't made up of the best 20 players in the world or the league. Look at Utd squads through the years, they've had the likes of Phil Jones and David May, ffs Phil Neville has 6 PL winner medals.
Dier is better than any of them and would be a good squad member.
 
DubSpur said:
Title challenging sides aren't made up of the best 20 players in the world or the league. Look at Utd squads through the years, they've had the likes of Phil Jones and David May, ffs Phil Neville has 6 PL winner medals.
Dier is better than any of them and would be a good squad member.
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All better players than Eric Dier IMO. Anyway, Dier being in our SQUAD would be OK, Dier being first choice is anything but.
 
DubSpur said:
Title challenging sides aren't made up of the best 20 players in the world or the league. Look at Utd squads through the years, they've had the likes of Phil Jones and David May, ffs Phil Neville has 6 PL winner medals.
Dier is better than any of them and would be a good squad member.
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All three were way better than Dier.

At Diet's peak, he was made by Poch as a DM. The system made him, he was put in to that team to do job and it worked, that was all due to great management by Poch.
There was no way he was gonna play as CB when we had Toby and Jan....and we were where we were because we had two of the best CB's in the the Prem.

The moment they had to retire and we moved Dier back into Defence you could see how much we have declined.

We need good/top quality CB's to be able to compete at the top....and Dier is no where near that and never has been.

He should be what Sanchez is to us at the moment, cover from the bench when we need it.... That's the level we need to compete at the top again.
 
Baleforce said:
Didn’t we play a whole season under Poch, with Dier in the back 3, with the Dutch pair either side of him?
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I don't remember a whole season.

I know we played a few games with a back 3, and Dier getting caught out of position for late goals (Man U game immediately comes to mind).

I also remember he kept I insisting he wanted to be a CB, and saw it as his best position. But our best and most consistent performances were always with a back 4.
 
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