Vinai Venkatesham - CEO

[thfcsteff]

I can't substantiate this but I think the Frank appointment was a Levy fixation and call, more than a Lange blind spot for his fellow countryman. It was yet another example of Levy not acknowledging his own lack of football operational DNA but overpowering his team to go with what he felt was best. I've always felt Levy should have been nowhere near hiring or firing football managers. It's definitely not his specialist subject.

You would also recognise the work scenario where the most senior leader fixates on a hire so everyone below them keep the peace by following that choice. They even try to convince themselves that the boss is right. Then the passive aggression starts with everyone nodding their heads in meetings and then off to the coffee machine to say what they really think to their closest pal in the workplace. Then a horrible culture ensues.

The thing is, that culture permeates from the CEO. If they were less headstrong and more empowering in the first place then the path would be smoother. What we're actually discovering is that Lange is probably not a Paul Mitchell. He keeps the peace rather than rattles the cages.

Lange came from a data-driven background. Post-Conte, the decision was made to go for this data-driven model. Paratici was in hot hot water, thus the gap appeared. Enter Lange and all the data. Old friends with Frank, similarly into data and at a club where that was a huge part of the DNA. Our ambitions were pitched to be a bigger version of Brighton and Brentford. Take snobbery out of it, we were never going to be that club because those are not the roots which have established us. It's as thought someone had ingested Moneyball about Billy Beane's A's (I remember Comolli referencing that book BTW). Munn was a further disastrous appt. I genuinely believe Levy was thinking he was being 'modern' in getting behind the Lange/Munn train. It is, of course, a fundamental lack of understanding as to who we'd been as much as who we are.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Vinai is a communicator, something Levy very rarely did. So he communicated the Frank appointment I don't particularly think that means he exclusively appointed him and we know that's not the case even in the quotations from that article. Levy would have still been the driving force, if you read what Vinai actually says he implies the choice was Levy's and he agree with it.

I'm actually not fussed about Vinai getting flack I just find it amusing that the narrative has shifted to the idea that Vinai appointed him and Levy is blameless.

Think you're making a lot of assumptions there that run contrary to what we know. You said it was Levy's decision. Vinai said:

"We ran a really, really thorough process at speed,” said former Arsenal chief executive Venkatesham.

"We defined 10 characteristics that we think are important to be a successful manager at Tottenham Hotspur. We analysed in real detail through our technical staff led by [technical director] Johan (Lange), more than 30 candidates."

“We had a shortlist, we spent a lot of time with the shortlist, and Thomas was absolutely the number one candidate. I could not be more excited to have him join the club."

No one said it was exclusively his decision. He had a hand in it, Levy had a hand in it, Lange had a hand in it. He's answerable for that decision and I'd love to know now why the style of football is important enough to mention but either wasn't part of his 10 characteristics or he was part of a decision where they got that bit spectacularly wrong.

 

[Bishop]

Think you're making a lot of assumptions there that run contrary to what we know. You said it was Levy's decision. Vinai said:

"We ran a really, really thorough process at speed,” said former Arsenal chief executive Venkatesham.

"We defined 10 characteristics that we think are important to be a successful manager at Tottenham Hotspur. We analysed in real detail through our technical staff led by [technical director] Johan (Lange), more than 30 candidates."

“We had a shortlist, we spent a lot of time with the shortlist, and Thomas was absolutely the number one candidate. I could not be more excited to have him join the club."

No one said it was exclusively his decision. He had a hand in it, Levy had a hand in it, Lange had a hand in it. He's answerable for that decision and I'd love to know now why the style of football is important enough to mention but either wasn't part of his 10 characteristics or he was part of a decision where they got that bit spectacularly wrong.

Yes lots of "we" as I said he is the communicator. Do you expect him to say he had nothing to do with the appointment? My point is not that Vinai had no part but that many are trying to assign Frank entirely to Vinai and exclude Levy from any related criticism.

In regards to the quality of the football probably because the expectation was that the football would be more attractive than it ended up being.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Yes lots of "we" as I said he is the communicator. Do you expect him to say he had nothing to do with the appointment? My point is not that Vinai had no part but that many are trying to assign Frank entirely to Vinai and exclude Levy from any related criticism.

In regards to the quality of the football probably because the expectation was that the football would be more attractive than it ended up being.

Your original point was "You're asking Vinai to explain a decision that Levy made." Levy didn't make the decision - Vinai seemed to be at least as involved if not more so.

If the style of football was important, Thomas Frank should have been nowhere near the discussion. His football wasn't attractive at Brentford. Even allowing for that, by the time we got to Arsenal and Chelsea, it was very obvious that this wasn't a manager who had any intention of playing attractive football. Yet he lasted three more months even as results deteriorated to the point that we were pulled into a relegation battle.

That's where Vinai should be accountable.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

All well and good making these statements and there may well be truth in there. But its your club to run now, so its time to put up, because you seem very good at pointing out whats wrong with the club

 

[Raziel]

If I'm not mistaken the unveiling videos were all Vinai Lange & Frank.

I think it's pretty obvious the review of operations carried out by Charrington resulted in the decision to replace Levys influence at the club which started with the removal of the likes of Caplehorn, Vinai was appointed shortly after. I don't really see any logic in them letting Levy call the shots from that point - given the noise currently is about how much was/is wrong with the club this must have been highlighted during the review - so why let that continue?

Charrington was on board and "reviewing and auditing" since March.

No question, even if just as prudence, Levy would have included others or left some of those decisions to be made by the appropriate people.

 

[Muttley]

Lange came from a data-driven background. Post-Conte, the decision was made to go for this data-driven model. Paratici was in hot hot water, thus the gap appeared. Enter Lange and all the data. Old friends with Frank, similarly into data and at a club where that was a huge part of the DNA. Our ambitions were pitched to be a bigger version of Brighton and Brentford. Take snobbery out of it, we were never going to be that club because those are not the roots which have established us. It's as thought someone had ingested Moneyball about Billy Beane's A's (I remember Comolli referencing that book BTW). Munn was a further disastrous appt. I genuinely believe Levy was thinking he was being 'modern' in getting behind the Lange/Munn train. It is, of course, a fundamental lack of understanding as to who we'd been as much as who we are.

Lange evolved into a data driven football person. Let's be fair to him. In 2009 he started a coaching career and was mostly tagged as an assistant manager for many years. He did the hard yards in coaching way before the recent transition to building these database of players. He is more than able to look at a footballer without a laptop in his hand. Personally, I'm not sure about his performance in role, but I'm also not sure what is on his job description. Some of the fans are jumping to all sorts of conclusions about him. They think he's senior enough to be making all of the decisions at the club. I find that naive, but also hilarious. They just want to spacegoat him and find any narrative without any supporting detail. They build stories.

Personally, I would demand to know what Charrington is up to first and foremost. I was never a fan of Caplehorn, Cullen, Collecott etc. Their collective failures (with Levy) on the football pitch is as clear as day. What is this new guy building and what are the roles of people in the organisation. The only one that I really know what their job is would be De Zerbi, plus his coaching team. There's grey space everywhere else.

 

[Gazza]

It’s just more lip service, I’ve read more fighting talk in the beano and more realism than found in fictional books.

We have all read these statements … how about blaming yourselves, telling it how it is and taking penetrations without the fluff.

We are a money making machine that can easily lure the punters in to line the pockets of the few. It’d accept it as the truth. They really think we are stipud.

 

[Finney Is Back]

That is total spin mate. The season was recoverable in Oct-Dec, it was recoverable in January.

Think Nuno season, fired in 10 games, Conte in, we got Deki/Bentancur in Jan, we ended up 4th.

Sunderland got Europe with a minus 6 GD and 54 points, this of all seasons was recoverable.

p.s. (edit) And if anyone in the club believes (other than PR covering their ass) that spin, we are truly fudged,

If you don't think us ending up where we are right now is due to the last 5 or 6 years of poor decisions and investment on the football side of things then we'll just have to agree to disagree. I find it strange how some on here are so blind to Levy's poor performance since the stadium was opened.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

If you don't think us ending up where we are right now is due to the last 5 or 6 years of poor decisions and investment on the football side of things then we'll just have to agree to disagree. I find it strange how some on here are so blind to Levy's poor performance since the stadium was opened.

Well we will soon find out how good Vinai is, certainly not shy are pointing the finger of blame, claims to know whats needed to be done, so now he has no choice but to deliver on it. Between him and the other guy they have made some pretty bold statements on things, they have to produce now otherwise all this looks really silly

 

[Gazza]

Well we will soon find out how good Vinai is, certainly not shy are pointing the finger of blame, claims to know whats needed to be done, so now he has not choice but to deliver on it. Between him and the other guy they have made some pretty bold statements on things, they have to produce now otherwise all this looks really silly

They have got the RDZ hire right. I’m willing to give them a chance … let’s see. More hopeful moving forward, in seeing another combustible Italian at the helm. I just hope that we don’t do the usual rinse and repeat … the Tottenham way.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Well we will soon find out how good Vinai is, certainly not shy are pointing the finger of blame, claims to know whats needed to be done, so now he has not choice but to deliver on it. Between him and the other guy they have made some pretty bold statements on things, they have to produce now otherwise all this looks really silly

Depends on your definition of 'soon'. I think it will be at least 2 years from now and perhaps more like 3 before we really know.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

They have got the RDZ hire right. I’m willing to give them a chance … let’s see. More hopeful moving forward, in seeing another combustible Italian at the helm. I just hope that we don’t do the usual rinse and repeat … the Tottenham way.

I will 100% give him a chance, but he has to get things right given the nature of his statements. And I hope he does get t
It right, I honestly do.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Depends on your definition of 'soon'. I think it will be at least 2 years from now and perhaps more like 3 before we really know.

Footballs a fairly fluid game though IMO, a good summer and things change quick. Their statement is all around the footballing side and investment etc. Time to Ante up

 

[billyiddo]

Depends on your definition of 'soon'. I think it will be at least 2 years from now and perhaps more like 3 before we really know.

But we should see an instant change across how we operate in key areas right? Wager to turnover ratio should fly up, transfer spend should increase, the level of player we bring in, no more getting gazumped, stadium sponsorship etc these are all easy wins and would be a good sign that we're moving in the right direction even if the benefits of all that take a few seasons to bare fruits

 

[DeanoAustin]

They have got the RDZ hire right. I’m willing to give them a chance … let’s see. More hopeful moving forward, in seeing another combustible Italian at the helm. I just hope that we don’t do the usual rinse and repeat … the Tottenham way.

They did get RDZ right and deserve some credit for that. However, they did it by massively overpaying for him and putting him on a 5 year contract. That offsets some of the credit for me - they had to overpay for a huge gamble because they got so many calls badly wrong before that.

 

[Finney Is Back]

But we should see an instant change across how we operate in key areas right? Wager to turnover ratio should fly up, transfer spend should increase, the level of player we bring in, no more getting gazumped, stadium sponsorship etc these are all easy wins and would be a good sign that we're moving in the right direction even if the benefits of all that take a few seasons to bare fruits

I don't think transfer spend will or should increase. We spend more than enough on transfers, we just spend it badly (and some of that 'badly' could be more because of the way we flip flop between different managers).

It may also take a while for the club to put the right scouting and data structures in place and then a little while longer for us to see the fruits of that. Rome wasn't built in a day. Yes I hope to see little things improving and those improvements to then have a kind of snowball effect but I don't think we should expect miracles early.

 

[Raziel]

If you don't think us ending up where we are right now is due to the last 5 or 6 years of poor decisions and investment on the football side of things then we'll just have to agree to disagree. I find it strange how some on here are so blind to Levy's poor performance since the stadium was opened.

Not what I said mate, I'm happy to concede many things, 17th this season isn't one I put on Levy.

If Vinai/Lange/Lewis family had pulled their finger out and fired Frank in December, bought 3 players in January for first team, brought in RDZ and we still only got12th-14th, I'd totally say that's on Levy.

Their lack of action/urgency and failure to re-enforce is 100% on them, and the main reason we were 17th (Tell me you don't believe if RDZ had 7 more games we wouldn't have been safe earlier?)

It's all done now, up to them to learn, get their brick together and start the club moving in the right direction.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

I don't think transfer spend will or should increase. We spend more than enough on transfers, we just spend it badly (and some of that 'badly' could be more because of the way we flip flop between different managers).

It may also take a while for the club to put the right scouting and data structures in place and then a little while longer for us to see the fruits of that. Rome wasn't built in a day. Yes I hope to see little things improving and those improvements to then have a kind of snowball effect but I don't think we should expect miracles early.

No but equally there should be signs of easy and quick wins, for example, we shouldn't see another situation where we are kazumped on a player because of wages because they have said they identified that weakness and will fix it.

 

[Bishop]

Your original point was "You're asking Vinai to explain a decision that Levy made." Levy didn't make the decision - Vinai seemed to be at least as involved if not more so.

If the style of football was important, Thomas Frank should have been nowhere near the discussion. His football wasn't attractive at Brentford. Even allowing for that, by the time we got to Arsenal and Chelsea, it was very obvious that this wasn't a manager who had any intention of playing attractive football. Yet he lasted three more months even as results deteriorated to the point that we were pulled into a relegation battle.

That's where Vinai should be accountable.

Why do you think Vinai was more involved other than that being how you want it to be? Levy was the chairman who has always appointed the coaches, why would this change? Even looking at his own words he takes ownership of the appointment.

"Whenever you appoint a coach, you always believe it's right," Levy said. "You need a lot of ingredients for it to be right.

"Thomas is a highly intelligent individual, a fantastic way about him in terms of communication. I think he will be great at both developing young players and older players and making them better. He gets the style of football we want to play.


"He understands Rome wasn't built in a day. We haven't said to him that we want to win the Premier League this year."

"We haven't told him, 'You’ve got to win the league this year'. We just want to compete at the highest level. We will support him to the best of our ability. I very much hope that Thomas will bring all the right ingredients and bring this team to where it belongs - which is right at the top.”

Levy talking about the hiring and firing of coaches.

"Of course, the decision always has to rest with me," said Levy. "But it's always a collective decision. We have a board of directors but under that we have a group of technical staff and they advise.

"Ange just won us a trophy, a European trophy. It's highly significant, it will always be in our history and we were asking him to leave. But we can't lose sight of the fact we finished 17th in the league, we lost 22 Premier League games. It's impossible for Tottenham to be in that position.

So again my only real question is why are the Levy diehards trying to separate the man from the decision that he himself claims to have been involved in and which it was actually his job and responsibility to initiate?

In regards to Frank's football, he has managed attractive attacking football with Brentford previously, specifically in their promotion season. Quite possibly and probably the committee of Levy and Vinai thought that he would be able to implement that style at Spurs. Even looking at his Brentford side, in the PL they played far better football than what we saw at Spurs so I don't if apportioning the football style entirely at Frank is accurate. Just as much of it was the players he had available as we saw the season before and since his sacking. The football has improved but its not exactly entertaining or quality as yet but I think that will come with time and additions.