Transfer thread

[DubaiSpur]

You’re living in a dream world if you think Southampton are going to value their captain up until he said he wanted to leave the same as a guy who has played a handful of games at RB for them....

Their captain, who has one year left on his deal? Who Soton fans don't think is very good? Who's already been replaced in their side by James Ward-Prowse? Who's already (if reports are correct) ruled out going anywhere but Spurs?

Versus a homegrown English kid who has time on his deal for us, who has been damn good for them and who they would apparently dearly like to keep?

I certainly don't think it's out of the question. I think Soton expecting anything over 20m is a stretch for someone of Hojberg's limited abilities - and I think us expecting less than 12.5m-15m for KWP is similarly a stretch. With a bit of effort, a straight swap certainly seems possible to me.

 

[The Swellhead Spur]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1284197830077190144

 

[LutonSpurs]

There's a load of good street footballers but strength and power seem to be a big part of the youth system traditionally. I think that's changing and we will see the fruits of it soon. Also a lot of immensely talented lads end up losing focus, not just to crime but to an easy life. The sacrifice required to make it is huge.

 

[AdamB]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1284197830077190144

....and so the usual Spurs saga begins. Always the same:
- Spurs want player
- player seems to want to join
- Spurs and selling club discuss fee
- gap of 10%-20% emerges between what we're offering and what they want
- .....saga drags on til the end of the window and risks another club intervening or the deal not happening

 

[AdamB]

Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere:

https://windycoys.com/2020/07/homegrown/

...however the key conclusion is that if his assumptions about obvious players leaving are correct, then we would only be able to add three non-homegrown players this summer.

So we could add Kim, Hojbjerg and Castagne, but then we couldnt add an overseas CF without selling a non-homegrown player (or leaving someone out of the squad). Personally I'm sceptical whether we'll add a CF so we might be ok

 

[Grays_1890]

....and so the usual Spurs saga begins. Always the same:
- Spurs want player
- player seems to want to join
- Spurs and selling club discuss fee
- gap of 10%-20% emerges between what we're offering and what they want
- .....saga drags on til the end of the window and risks another club intervening or the deal not happening

Isn’t that the case of 90% of transfers.

Their club over values a player as it’s good business and we refuse to pay the inflated value. Happens to many clubs and I would imagine it’s the reason a fair few transfers in football break down

The whole “just pay them what they want” idea is madness unless you can afford to splash the odd 3-10m here and there but any club run well are not going to do that.

100% there are other clubs that lose out in same way but it’s not reported as freely as Spurs as its apparently “our thing”. Additionally as Spurs fans we don’t notice when other clubs transfers fall through for same reason, I mean why would we?

 

[AdamB]

Isn’t that the case of 90% of transfers.

Their club over values a player as it’s good business and we refuse to pay the inflated value. Happens to many clubs and I would imagine it’s the reason a fair few transfers in football break down

The whole “just pay them what they want” idea is madness unless you can afford to splash the odd 3-10m here and there but any club run well are not going to do that.

400% there are other clubs that lose out in same way but it’s not reported as freely as Spurs as its apparently “our thing”. Additionally as Spurs fans we don’t notice when other clubs transfers fall through for same reason, I mean why would we?

Of course we shouldn't just pay what other clubs want all the time - however any deal whether its in football, business or any walk of life is a negotiation and unless the party on the other side of the negotiation has a weak hand, then its unrealistic to get whatever you're negotiating over on terms which are far away from 'market'.

In terms of Kim, assuming the reported figures are correct, then the $17m (or €17m or £17m, whichever currency it was in) which they're apparently looking for is extremely reasonable. Look what we paid for Sanchez - another young CB with some international experience but playing in a second tier league. Very comparable situation. I would argue that this price for Kim looks very good compared to what might be expected and what we've paid historically.

Again, assuming all the reports are correct, that is a price which is just worth meeting relatively quickly before someone else steps in

 

[Grays_1890]

Of course we shouldn't just pay what other clubs want all the time - however any deal whether its in football, business or any walk of life is a negotiation and unless the party on the other side of the negotiation has a weak hand, then its unrealistic to get whatever you're negotiating over on terms which are far away from 'market'.

In terms of Kim, assuming the reported figures are correct, then the $17m (or €17m or £17m, whichever currency it was in) which they're apparently looking for is extremely reasonable. Look what we paid for Sanchez - another young CB with some international experience but playing in a second tier league. Very comparable situation. I would argue that this price for Kim looks very good compared to what might be expected and what we've paid historically.

Again, assuming all the reports are correct, that is a price which is just worth meeting relatively quickly before someone else steps in

I know Mark Nobles agent and he said once that the idea that the press know the inner workings of deals is slim to none, so I would also be wary of the idea they know certain deals are 2/3m apart.

The press success rate of predicting transfers is low so considering their strike rate the idea they know the ins and out of certain deals is fanciful for me.

Additionally I would say a lot of clubs are in stronger hands in terms of handling its prospects. Saha as an example, Palace 10 years ago would haggled over 2m maybe but would be forced to move him on, now they are valuing him out of moves by 10-15m as they don’t need the money, not many clubs need the money anymore, so the negotiating is getting more stacked with the club that owns the player than it once was.

 

[Pirate55]

..which is why Ndombele could be more at-risk than is generally being let-on. I wouldn't mind moving him on to generate funds, tbh.

Also, some of @AdamB's estimates are probably on the low side. KWP's excellent form for Soton means we could just do a straight swap with Hojberg - that's 20m off the difference right there, instead of 5m vs 25m.

I can’t see NDombele suddenly acquiring the cohones to be a success in a Mourinho side. Best to move him on and free up funds for other positions.

 

[parklane1]

I know Mark Nobles agent and he said once that the idea that the press know the inner workings of deals is slim to none, so I would also be wary of the idea they know certain deals are 2/3m apart.

The press success rate of predicting transfers is low so considering their strike rate the idea they know the ins and out of certain deals is fanciful for me.

Additionally I would say a lot of clubs are in stronger hands in terms of handling its prospects. Saha as an example, Palace 10 years ago would haggled over 2m maybe but would be forced to move him on, now they are valuing him out of moves by 10-15m as they don’t need the money, not many clubs need the money anymore, so the negotiating is getting more stacked with the club that owns the player than it once was.

Would agree with this, the sad thing is there are fans who believe what they read and when it falls through ( as it usually does) they start screaming at Levy ( in our case).

 

[Pirate55]

Would agree with this, the sad thing is there are fans who believe what they read and when it falls through ( as it usually does) they start screaming at Levy ( in our case).

spot on. They blame Levy for every perceived failed transfer. They don’t realise that Sane and the Dutch guy chose Pool over us due ( mainly) to wages. Ditto Berkeley and Chelsea. And Fernandes said as soon as United showed interest in him he knew where he was going. Only perhaps Grealish can be laid at Levy’s door, but how could he have predicted the takeover of Villa would stymie the negotiations. Poch plainly desperately wanted NDombele and Levy delivered him at what now looks like a massively inflated price.

 

[Moby]

They blame Levy for every perceived failed transfer. They don’t realise that Sane and the Dutch guy chose Pool over us due.

Sane didn’t go to Liverpool, he went to Emirates Marketing Project and has now agreed to leave for Bayern Munich.

 

[AdamB]

Would agree with this, the sad thing is there are fans who believe what they read and when it falls through ( as it usually does) they start screaming at Levy ( in our case).

I'm a big Levy fan, but that doesn't mean he's above criticism. In my view, he seems to over-negotiate transfers, or we certainly seemed to have more protracted transfers than other clubs. We also hang on to dead-wood far too long rather than just getting shot, even if that means giving players away

 

[Kandi1977]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1284527388077039618

 

[thfcsteff]

spot on. They blame Levy for every perceived failed transfer. They don’t realise that Sane and the Dutch guy chose Pool over us due ( mainly) to wages. Ditto Berkeley and Chelsea. And Fernandes said as soon as United showed interest in him he knew where he was going. Only perhaps Grealish can be laid at Levy’s door, but how could he have predicted the takeover of Villa would stymie the negotiations. Poch plainly desperately wanted NDombele and Levy delivered him at what now looks like a massively inflated price.

I am trying to be selective in both what I reply to in this thread and what I say.
Mane and Winaldjum - I have not seen anyone critical of those deals not getting over the line say they did not know it was about wage demands.
Barkley - of all the players chased that did not happen this was the oddest one. The wages he wanted were mad. In fairness, I never think of him.
Fernandes - we had a big chance and did not take it for whatever reason.
NDombele - we finally paid for a player and got him in early, only to see the manager that signed him out months later...I suppose one of the things covid19 has taught us (me anyway) is that four months can be another lifetime.

I have always lamented the loss of Mitchell and our failure to get another DoF.

Of course (and without wishing to sound glib or pessimistic) at this point in history, these issues continue to recede into dust at warp speed. I'll take my bolts of happiness where I can find them. The past is certainly just that...

 

[Baleforce]

I know Mark Nobles agent and he said once that the idea that the press know the inner workings of deals is slim to none, so I would also be wary of the idea they know certain deals are 2/3m apart.

The press success rate of predicting transfers is low so considering their strike rate the idea they know the ins and out of certain deals is fanciful for me.

Additionally I would say a lot of clubs are in stronger hands in terms of handling its prospects. Saha as an example, Palace 10 years ago would haggled over 2m maybe but would be forced to move him on, now they are valuing him out of moves by 10-15m as they don’t need the money, not many clubs need the money anymore, so the negotiating is getting more stacked with the club that owns the player than it once was.

So cute that noble has an agent, like real footballers do.

 

[DubaiSpur]

spot on. They blame Levy for every perceived failed transfer. They don’t realise that Sane and the Dutch guy chose Pool over us due ( mainly) to wages. Ditto Berkeley and Chelsea. And Fernandes said as soon as United showed interest in him he knew where he was going. Only perhaps Grealish can be laid at Levy’s door, but how could he have predicted the takeover of Villa would stymie the negotiations. Poch plainly desperately wanted NDombele and Levy delivered him at what now looks like a massively inflated price.

Kind of pointless to get into it, because it will go around in circles. But the man who didn't sanction the wages Mane and Wijnaldum wanted wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who dropped our Fernandes pursuit when it was clear he was desperate to come to us wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who didn't pay extra to sort the image rights for Dybala wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who fudged up the Grealish deal and bought absolutely no one, sabotaging our team down to the present day, wasn't GHod, it was Levy. Barkley, Schneiderlin, Rodriguez, Moreno, David Villa, Hulk, Moutinho...look back enough years and the number of players who we claimed to be in for but routinely cheaped out on starts resembling a pattern. All of it, when a bit more daring, as the club motto so hollowly proclaims, might have seen us cross the line under potentially the best manager we've ever had in the modern era, and before that, some of the best teams we ever had.

The man's a mediocre, risk-averse, penny-pinching administrator who used our own money (not a single penny of ENIC's) basically adequately but routinely shirked at the last when it came to giving our managers what they desperately asked for. But of course, that will go in circles too.

All that to say, I take issue with your characterization of those deals, is all. They weren't all Acts of GHod.

 

[Baleforce]

Kind of pointless to get into it, because it will go around in circles. But the man who didn't sanction the wages Mane and Wijnaldum wanted wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who dropped our Fernandes pursuit when it was clear he was desperate to come to us wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who didn't pay extra to sort the image rights for Dybala wasn't GHod, it was Levy. The man who fudged up the Grealish deal and bought absolutely no one, sabotaging our team down to the present day, wasn't GHod, it was Levy. Barkley, Schneiderlin, Rodriguez, Moreno, David Villa, Hulk, Moutinho...look back enough years and the number of players who we claimed to be in for but routinely cheaped out on starts resembling a pattern. All of it, when a bit more daring, as the club motto so hollowly proclaims, might have seen us cross the line under potentially the best manager we've ever had in the modern era, and before that, some of the best teams we ever had.

The man's a mediocre, risk-averse, penny-pinching administrator who used our own money (not a single penny of ENIC's) basically adequately but routinely shirked at the last when it came to giving our managers what they desperately asked for. But of course, that will go in circles too.

All that to say, I take issue with your characterization of those deals, is all. They weren't all Acts of GHod.

Our money?

Sigh

ENIC own Spurs, it’s their money.

Also, that list of players, in most cases, thank GHod we didn’t buy them, they mostly turned out to be not good enough. I’ll give you Mane, Dybala and Mountinho, but the rest turned out to be no better than what we already had.

 

[parklane1]

I'm a big Levy fan, but that doesn't mean he's above criticism. In my view, he seems to over-negotiate transfers, or we certainly seemed to have more protracted transfers than other clubs. We also hang on to dead-wood far too long rather than just getting shot, even if that means giving players away

We all make mistakes in our life and Levy is no different and none of us are above criticism. However there are a small number of fans who can not wait to have a go at what he has done here ( which is not a lot is it ), but it takes all sorts i guess.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I was watching Norwich game on Sky and the "commentators" were running through which players will be leaving, luckily I was going out for a meal with family and listened to the game on radio where the main subject was who will be leaving Norwich. The media is full of kittens who cant do their job and spend the time spreading rumours, it's a disgrace the way they show no respect to some clubs.