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Tottenham Hotspur Stadium - Licence To Stand

Kandi1977 said:
Well, it's ugly as hell from every angle. Looks like a makeshift job done with leftover materials. It's full of uneven and weird angles. Charming maybe, but certainly not pretty. The new one can't be finished soon enough!
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This is not a critique of your opinion, just a different perspective. I look at WHL with different eyes. At most I get to one match a season for geographic and financial reasons, but every time I go I have a nervous sense of expectation as I walk up to the ground. Seeing the pitch when I come out of the tunnel still gives me a buzz every time without fail. It's not a perfect stadium by any stretch of the imagination but I will miss the old gal when she is gone.

The new stadium looks, well incredible really, and it will usher in a new era for this club. I love everything I read and see about the new stadium, but equally I love the current stadium like an old friend. Savour the moments you have there. I will.
 
Kandi1977 said:
Well, it's ugly as hell from every angle. Looks like a makeshift job done with leftover materials. It's full of uneven and weird angles. Charming maybe, but certainly not pretty. The new one can't be finished soon enough!
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When I started going we were fans not customers, members or revenue streams and I don't think many cared about the aesthetics of the ground, whatever the ground looks like the experience will always be a disappointment to me due to the inadequate infrastructure. The transport issue will continue to be "jam tomorrow" unless Boris can manage to get a cycle highway open for the vast majority of our fans who travel by bike.
 
I knew there would be reactions on my view of the stadium as ugly, but you talk about the emotions and feeling of going to the ground. It's sentiments. I don't question that, but that has nothing to do with how it looks. Just look at the pictures of it from above. There looks to be no cohesion or plan of how it's been put together. Different materials, different angles and so on. It's just a mess. But it's not the ground that makes the atmosphere, it's the people going there! Add a new showpiece stadium to that, and it will be truly magnificent!
 
Kandi1977 said:
I knew there would be reactions on my view of the stadium as ugly, but you talk about the emotions and feeling of going to the ground. It's sentiments. I don't question that, but that has nothing to do with how it looks. Just look at the pictures of it from above. There looks to be no cohesion or plan of how it's been put together. Different materials, different angles and so on. It's just a mess. But it's not the ground that makes the atmosphere, it's the people going there! Add a new showpiece stadium to that, and it will be truly magnificent!
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The outside isn't great, but the inside is almost perfect.

The rake, closeness to the pitch, optimum compactness of fans (the new ground will be too spaced out, whereas other old grounds like Bramall Lane and Elland Road are uncomfortably tight) won't be as good in the new stadium because of all the safety/FIFA restrictions on new stadiums.
 
Gutter Boy said:
The outside isn't great, but the inside is almost perfect.

The rake, closeness to the pitch, optimum compactness of fans (the new ground will be too spaced out, whereas other old grounds like Bramall Lane and Elland Road are uncomfortably tight) won't be as good in the new stadium because of all the safety/FIFA restrictions on new stadiums.
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The inside isn't almost perfect unless you like the restricted view in the East Stand. You appear to think that "compactness of fans" is somehow a good thing. I beg to differ. If you need to be pressed against other bodies to feel and generate atmosphere then I sympathise.
The rake of the lower West Stand isn't up to much in my opinion, and I've not been too impressed with the Lower level of the Paxton End in this regard either.
The stadium is also almost entirely different from the ground I first attended in 1956, other than the brick facade in Worcester Road, which has in any event been amended and repaired in a piecemeal and slovenly fashion.
I for one am very enthusiastic about the new stadium. The old one will live on in my memory, but the change is essential, and so is a safe environment.
But each to his own.
 
LesMedley said:
The inside isn't almost perfect unless you like the restricted view in the East Stand. You appear to think that "compactness of fans" is somehow a good thing. I beg to differ. If you need to be pressed against other bodies to feel and generate atmosphere then I sympathise.
The rake of the lower West Stand isn't up to much in my opinion, and I've not been too impressed with the Lower level of the Paxton End in this regard either.
The stadium is also almost entirely different from the ground I first attended in 1956, other than the brick facade in Worcester Road, which has in any event been amended and repaired in a piecemeal and slovenly fashion.
I for one am very enthusiastic about the new stadium. The old one will live on in my memory, but the change is essential, and so is a safe environment.
But each to his own.
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I agree that the current stadium is past its sell by date and needs replacing but a new stadium with increased leg room, wider aisles etc will inevitably lead to a further worsening of the atmosphere.
 
the section where i sit at WHL is quality and i know once we move it will never be replicated - the structure of the surroundings (gangway/fencing/wall/hoarding) has basically created a bit of an island encompassing 50 seats or so - everyone knows each other and the stewards leave us alone to stand all game - at any rate the same stewards have been in our bit for years also and are all sound - there's probably a good 10-20 people extra in this area each game who work their way down from other sections of the ground - it's like the section time forgot, I don't know how im going to adapt to being seated in a generic block layout :(
 
billyiddo said:
the section where i sit at WHL is quality and i know once we move it will never be replicated - the structure of the surroundings (gangway/fencing/wall/hoarding) has basically created a bit of an island encompassing 50 seats or so - everyone knows each other and the stewards leave us alone to stand all game - at any rate the same stewards have been in our bit for years also and are all sound - there's probably a good 10-20 people extra in this area each game who work their way down from other sections of the ground - it's like the section time forgot, I don't know how im going to adapt to being seated in a generic block layout :(
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Had this situation at work. Every time there was a reorganistion or change in work style we were seen by 'them' as almost dead and too much trouble to reform. We carried on in the old style and had the freedom to deliver, we were the envy of our colleages .... especially when our Users turned up with Champagne (at the own expense) to show their appreciation.

It didn't survive Brown and O'Donnel and their management lickspittles (a term I used to their faces - both of them). The clams. Who would trust anyone with a first initial G after them?.

Have sat in may parts of WHL, although nowhere near as frequently as other. Shame to see it go, but the crowd is the atmosphere, they took the standing away ... we are adpating to the new world.

I need TP for my bunghole


COYS !
 
Kandi1977 said:
Well, it's ugly as hell from every angle. Looks like a makeshift job done with leftover materials. It's full of uneven and weird angles. Charming maybe, but certainly not pretty. The new one can't be finished soon enough!
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The West stand is such a poorly designed stand. Could have been so much bigger, instead, the lower tier has about 9 rows of seats and two levels of boxes.
 
Gutter Boy said:
Just need the league to pull together to relegate Liverpool
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It needs a change in the law too and I cannot see a government doing that because there are very few votes to be won doing it and quite a lot to be lost if the law was changed and then there was another disaster.
 
Rorschach said:
Standing will be back eventually. It is just a matter of time.
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I like your optimism but unfortunately I don't think it ever will. All the groups who would have to approve it (has been a long time since I looked it up but I think the PL, FA & Parliament would all have to approve...) seem to be confined to their ignorance of the fact safe standing is, well, safe and point straight at Hillsbourgh laugh 'Why on earth would you want that?!' then switch off for whatever arguments you put at them.

As well as that, if football tickets rise over the next couple of decades at the rate they have in the last two decades then the type of people who attend football matches won't be interested in singing and certainly won't be interested in standing so it wouldn't make sense for clubs to bring it back.

I know standing is generally cheaper than seating but if I saw tickets going at £20 to sit and £50 to stand I would genuinely pay extra to stand.
 
Craig_J said:
I like your optimism but unfortunately I don't think it ever will. All the groups who would have to approve it (has been a long time since I looked it up but I think the PL, FA & Parliament would all have to approve...) seem to be confined to their ignorance of the fact safe standing is, well, safe and point straight at Hillsbourgh laugh 'Why on earth would you want that?!' then switch off for whatever arguments you put at them.

As well as that, if football tickets rise over the next couple of decades at the rate they have in the last two decades then the type of people who attend football matches won't be interested in singing and certainly won't be interested in standing so it wouldn't make sense for clubs to bring it back.

I know standing is generally cheaper than seating but if I saw tickets going at £20 to sit and £50 to stand I would genuinely pay extra to stand.
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I wouldn't be too sure. If the desire is there, and it obviously is, then standing will return some day. They are already trialing the rail seat system in the UK and this is just another step along the road to safe standing areas. Even our own stadium plans have made some provision for standing (in the kop stand I think). I'm pretty sure it will happen eventually. Maybe not any time soon but some day.
 
Rorschach said:
I wouldn't be too sure. If the desire is there, and it obviously is, then standing will return some day. They are already trialing the rail seat system in the UK and this is just another step along the road to safe standing areas. Even our own stadium plans have made some provision for standing (in the kop stand I think). I'm pretty sure it will happen eventually. Maybe not any time soon but some day.
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In order for that to happen, Victimpool fans would have to stop bleating about being victims for 5 minutes.

I don't think they can do that - it's in their DNA. Considering the cesspit they call a gene pool up there, it will probably be the case for a long time.
 
Personally I would not, nor could not stand at a match, but the actions of large crowds are so hard to predict that I think any governing body would be loathed to be seen responsible for allowing the conditions which allowed further tragedies to occur. There are also still mindless thugs attending games.
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
Personally I would not, nor could not stand at a match, but the actions of large crowds are so hard to predict that I think any governing body would be loathed to be seen responsible for allowing the conditions which allowed further tragedies to occur. There are also still mindless thugs attending games.
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With rail seating there is no risk of that sort of tragedy occurring again. The safety concerns are just a red herring the discussion now. It is more about the political will to change and that by rights should be swayed by public opinion.
 
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I'm sorry but safety concerns are never red herrings. You can probably never create a totally safe environment when you are dealing with human beings. I understand a lot of people want to stand but I would rather 30 million fans were disappointed than have anyones child died.
 
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