*** Tottenham Hotspur - Arsenal OMT ***

[Mumorn]

I actually think against Norwich he'll go:

............Sandro....Paulinho......
Lamela.......Eriksen.........Chadli
..................Soldado................

I don't feel I am reading too much in Dembele being subbed off early in the most games, I feel AVB knows he isn't playing at his best right now. Eriksen will no doubt play against Norwich, I hope he starts personally, but we know how AVB is and bedding in new players. Lamela is sure to start, infront of home fans.

 

[DHSF]

In general whilst we control the play we aren't doin much with the ball and most definitely AVB NEEDS to sort out the support for Soldado.

We are not creating much at all

 

[glorygloryeze]

What a **** day and result!

Can the very rational amongst you who went to the match or watched the full match live on TV give me any bones of positivity to take from the game?

From the 60 odds minutes I heard on the radio, it sounded like we were not as fast to the ball as they were and almost pedestrian in comparison?

 

[Mumorn]

What a **** day and result!

Can the very rational amongst you who went to the match or watched the full match live on TV give me any bones of positivity to take from the game?

From the 60 odds minutes I heard on the radio, it sounded like we were not as fast to the ball as they were and almost pedestrian in comparison?

Positives:

Lloris is class.
Sandro is back and is class.
Lamela plays for Spurs.

 

[NorwegianSpursFan]

Even though we're not creating to much these days, I think the fact that we've gone to the Emirates and had more possesion than Arsenal is a positive sign. They usually dominate possesion, but our midfield, dire as they were, never let them hold on to the ball.

 

[glorygloryeze]

Positives:

Lloris is class.
Sandro is back and is class.
Lamela plays for Spurs.

Thanks; we seemed to lack pace in midfield by the sounds of things; is this true and if so, is it a worry?

 

[braineclipse]

What a **** day and result!

Can the very rational amongst you who went to the match or watched the full match live on TV give me any bones of positivity to take from the game?

From the 60 odds minutes I heard on the radio, it sounded like we were not as fast to the ball as they were and almost pedestrian in comparison?

After a slightly shaky start in the opening 5 minutes we looked fairly solid up until the goal. We had more than our fair share of possession and looked more settled and comfortable. The goal changed things significantly, they could sit back, defend fairly deep and counter attack whilst we had to push forward as the game developed.

Despite this they didn't create a hell of a lot of chances. Nowhere near as many as we've seen them create in the past under similar circumstances at least.

The main thing lacking for us was movement and passing tempo. With the way the game developed I think you can imagine what it looked like based on last season. Our front 3 quite simply didn't get the ball in enough good situations to create the chances we want to see. We were largely limited to some crosses, but unfortunately we weren't good enough at getting into the box and our crosses weren't good enough.

The main positive to take from this is that we were far from outplayed, although 2nd best, away against a good team. Most here agree that as we get the new boys settled in and see the return of Kaboul and Sandro to the starting lineup after their injuries we'll see the team improve in the lacking attacking phases as well as in overall quality.

 

[glorygloryeze]

After a slightly shaky start in the opening 5 minutes we looked fairly solid up until the goal. We had more than our fair share of possession and looked more settled and comfortable. The goal changed things significantly, they could sit back, defend fairly deep and counter attack whilst we had to push forward as the game developed.

Despite this they didn't create a hell of a lot of chances. Nowhere near as many as we've seen them create in the past under similar circumstances at least.

The main thing lacking for us was movement and passing tempo. With the way the game developed I think you can imagine what it looked like based on last season. Our front 3 quite simply didn't get the ball in enough good situations to create the chances we want to see. We were largely limited to some crosses, but unfortunately we weren't good enough at getting into the box and our crosses weren't good enough.

The main positive to take from this is that we were far from outplayed, although 2nd best, away against a good team. Most here agree that as we get the new boys settled in and see the return of Kaboul and Sandro to the starting lineup after their injuries we'll see the team improve in the lacking attacking phases as well as in overall quality.

Thanks for the detail. Should we be worried that when we had to chase the game we seemed continually to be vulnerable on the break?
Also, our attacking movement seemed too slow and allowed them to get men behind the ball according to commentators. Why would this be in your view?

 

[braineclipse]

Thanks for the detail. Should we be worried that when we had to chase the game we seemed continually to be vulnerable on the break?
Also, our attacking movement seemed too slow and allowed them to get men behind the ball according to commentators. Why would this be in your view?

Being vulnerable on the break is just a fact of football when you push forward, that's why it's so advantageous to be able to sit back and attack on the break. I think with the pace and tackling ability we have in our back 4 and central/deep midfielders we're considerably less vulnerable than many other teams.

Attacking movement problems stem from a combination of a lot of things imo. Part of it will be that it's still early for many of these players, they haven't had time to work on movement patterns and their roles as much as is needed to get that attacking fluidity. Part of it is also a lack of player types on the pitch imo. We lack creativity/passing ability. Hopefully bringing Eriksen (or Holtby/Carroll) into that central trio will improve this. I'm generally very positive about AVB, this is one area where I feel that perhaps he could have done more to coach our current players though.

I also think that our back 4 aren't quite good enough on the ball. Walker and Rose both leave a lot to be desired in terms of close control and passing. I miss Ekotto personally. Vertonghen is excellent, but we end up in a situation where it's very easy for the opponents to get close to him and allow our inferior ball playing defenders time on the ball instead knowing that they are unlikely to make something happen. For me at least it will be interesting to see if this will improve when/if we see Vertonghen alongside either Kaboul or Chiriches.

 

[Rorschach]

Until we play to Soldado's strength's he almost serves no purpose. The guy looks exasperated at the service he is getting and who can blame him. I see him making the runs and doing the right things but it's rather pointless at the moment as no one has the vision or ability to execute the right pass.

We have a missing link to our attack and to me it is painful obvious that we need to sacrifice some of the midfield 'stability' in the hope that we involve our striker in our attacks. He looks totally isolated most of the time. He is not the hold-up/target man that our play seems to imply.

On the face of it today Walker and Rose had poor'ish games but they were for large parts of the match our main attacking outlets. This doesn't sit right with me. Walker hit a number of poor crosses and Rose was not fantastic with his crosses either, but at least they were giving the team some modicum of forward momentum which was sorely lacking all over the park.

The trio of Capoue/Sandro + Dembele + Paulinho doesn't feel right to me. Too much of one and not enough of the other I would say. We need a fulcrum of our attack in the centre of the park and it wasn't there today.

Eriksen, save our attack!!!!

 

[Robspur12]

What a **** day and result!

Can the very rational amongst you who went to the match or watched the full match live on TV give me any bones of positivity to take from the game?

From the 60 odds minutes I heard on the radio, it sounded like we were not as fast to the ball as they were and almost pedestrian in comparison?

The 1-0 score line flattered us I'm afraid. Wenger got it right in the post match interview, LLoris was our best player by a mile. Our midfield having barely played any games together came up against a very well organised and tricky **** midfield. They failed to support the forwards or to get back to protect back 4. I was disappointed in AVB today more so than in another game being the derby. I agree with Murmon on the positives however.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Until we play to Soldado's strength's he almost serves no purpose. The guy looks exasperated at the service he is getting and who can blame him. I see him making the runs and doing the right things but it's rather pointless at the moment as no one has the vision or ability to execute the right pass.

We have a missing link to our attack and to me it painful obvious that we need to sacrifice some of the midfield 'stability' in the hope that we involve our striker in our attacks. He looks totally isolated most of the time. He is not the hold-up/target man that our play seems to imply.

On the face of it today Walker and Rose had poor'ish games but they were for large parts of the match our main attacking outlets. This doesn't sit right with me. Walker hit a number of poor crosses and Rose was not fantastic with his crosses either, but at least they were giving the team some modicum of forward momentum which was sorely lacking all over the park.

The trio of Capoue/Sandro + Dembele + Paulinho doesn't feel right to me. Too much of one and not enough of the other I would say. We need a fulcrum of our attack in the centre of the park and it wasn't there today.

Eriksen, save our attack!!!!

I agree 1000% and I think it's 4-3-3 which is the problem

It basically means we only have 3 attack minded players where as in the prem you need a lot more than that. We look like United dud today and that was a team devoid of ideas

Inverted wingers are rubbish and just mean they become predictable as they nearly always use their best foot so can be taken out. We have the best finisher we have had in years yet we do not cross or pass to him behind the defence

We have to live back to a 4-2-3-1 systems with a real number 10 instead of 3 stoppers/beast to use the technical term. We're a football team not a rugby one and we need to play like that.

By way I am chuffed to bits with the beast we have signed but too many in a team that hasn scored in open play is hardly conducive to more goals!!!

 

[Robspur12]

Oh and our get out of jail free card has gone to Madrid unfortunately. Still we have Lamela and erikson to bring into midfield.

 

[diego_maradona]

Arsenal are elated at winning 1-0 to Spurs.

Spurs are bitterly disappointed at losing 1-0 to Arsenal.

Expectations are changing

 

[glorygloryeze]

I agree 1000% and I think it's 4-3-3 which is the problem

It basically means we only have 3 attack minded players where as in the prem you need a lot more than that. We look like United dud today and that was a team devoid of ideas

Inverted wingers are rubbish and just mean they become predictable as they nearly always use their best foot so can be taken out. We have the best finisher we have had in years yet we do not cross or pass to him behind the defence

We have to live back to a 4-2-3-1 systems with a real number 10 instead of 3 stoppers/beast to use the technical term. We're a football team not a rugby one and we need to play like that.

By way I am chuffed to bits with the beast we have signed but too many in a team that hasn scored in open play is hardly conducive to more goals!!!

Erm...which one..?

 

[onlyme]

We just went to Arsenal's ground and controlled the game. We set the tempo. Did we slice them open at will? No, of course not. But that is never going to happen at the Emirates anyway. I'm not even saying it was a great performance, but to go there and set the tempo like we did is damn impressive. I came away from this game actually feeling pretty happy. Creating chance after chance wasn't there but I think the pieces of the puzzle were to have a really good season.

Under AVB we aren't an 'attacking' team as I feel some commentators lazily point out. We don't play to attack like Harry. We play to control. So that means we don't create chance after chance but leave ourselves exposed. The idea is to create some very good chances and rarely give anything away at the back at all, while probing for openings in possession. The fact that we were able to go to the Emirates and implement this shows how far we have come. I liken this to the Saudi Sportswashing Machine away game last year. Yes they won, but we clearly looked like the better side and it was obvious it would be that way at the end of the season.

The chances we did give away come from a lack of concentration from an individual who probably isn't suited to how we want to go. And unfortunately despite fighting his way back into the plans, Dawson I think is the weak link for me in this team. And today the other problem was that some of the new signings clearly hadn't the time to settle in. Lamela had good touches but it was clear he didn't know exactly which positions to be taking up. But that will come in a couple of weeks, he only had one session.

But other than that - Lloris, class. Walker and Rose, actually pretty good. Dawson and Vertonghen lost concentration for the goal. Midfield was pretty imposing and controlled possession, while up town Chadli and Soldado showed nice touches and Townsend looks like a genuine threat.

The performance today for us looked like the better team unfortunately losing to the plucky mid-table team looking to sit back and hit on the break. So many times we may have beaten Arsenal that way but today it was other way around. We looked like the big dogs and once our signings are integrated, we are going to be very, very hard to stop.

Absolutely fantastic post that I agree with 100%.

Edit:99%. Just read it again. Dawson is not a weak link.

 

[glorygloryeze]

Arsenal are elated at winning 1-0 to Spurs.

Spurs are bitterly disappointed at losing 1-0 to Arsenal.

Expectations are changing

Indeed!

 

[onlyme]

Last season 2 points from the first three games.

This season 6 points from the first three games.

Nice stat.

What do points make? Prizes!!

 

[onlyme]

Arsenal won because they scored first. If we had scored when we were enjoying our spell of possession, in the first half, the result would have been different.

Arsenal could afford to sit back against us at 1-0 up. We had no player capable of playing an incisive through pass and our crosses were poor so we couldn't score. Our attacking mentality, in chasing the 1-0 deficit, left us exposed to further Arsenal attacks.

Good point.

 

[Pirate55]

DubaiSpur, I'm a bit shocked at your assessment to be honest, but I completely agree with Sandman.

I don't think this was Wenger's tactics at all. We just went to Arsenal's ground and controlled the game. We set the tempo. Did we slice them open at will? No, of course not. But that is never going to happen at the Emirates anyway. I'm not even saying it was a great performance, but to go there and set the tempo like we did is damn impressive. I came away from this game actually feeling pretty happy. Creating chance after chance wasn't there but I think the pieces of the puzzle were to have a really good season.

Under AVB we aren't an 'attacking' team as I feel some commentators lazily point out. We don't play to attack like Harry. We play to control. So that means we don't create chance after chance but leave ourselves exposed. The idea is to create some very good chances and rarely give anything away at the back at all, while probing for openings in possession. The fact that we were able to go to the Emirates and implement this shows how far we have come. I liken this to the Saudi Sportswashing Machine away game last year. Yes they won, but we clearly looked like the better side and it was obvious it would be that way at the end of the season.

The chances we did give away come from a lack of concentration from an individual who probably isn't suited to how we want to go. And unfortunately despite fighting his way back into the plans, Dawson I think is the weak link for me in this team. And today the other problem was that some of the new signings clearly hadn't the time to settle in. Lamela had good touches but it was clear he didn't know exactly which positions to be taking up. But that will come in a couple of weeks, he only had one session.

But other than that - Lloris, class. Walker and Rose, actually pretty good. Dawson and Vertonghen lost concentration for the goal. Midfield was pretty imposing and controlled possession, while up town Chadli and Soldado showed nice touches and Townsend looks like a genuine threat.

The performance today for us looked like the better team unfortunately losing to the plucky mid-table team looking to sit back and hit on the break. So many times we may have beaten Arsenal that way but today it was other way around. We looked like the big dogs and once our signings are integrated, we are going to be very, very hard to stop.

Now, I'd like to politely disagree. We did not 'set the tempo'. Far, far from it. We tried desperately to avoid Arsenal getting the ball, is what we did. In the main, we succeeded. We had very few ideas on what to do with the ball, and were content to pass it around on the half-way line. Any further and Arsenal's central midfielders pounced, repeatedly nicking the ball from our surprisingly brittle midfielders and bursting forward with pace and purpose. Lloris had to save us time and time again as Arsenal found gaps across our team at will, while anything we attempted to do in their half was quickly and effortlessly snuffed out by their central defenders and midfielders acting as a cohesive unit. They let us have the ball because they knew we would do absolutely nothing with it. That is not a triumph, not matter how much possession we rack up that way. If 'control' means terrified midfielders passing back and forth on the half-way line while the opposition team wait to pounce tigerishly when the ball moves forward ten yards into their half, then give me playing to attack any day.

You know, on second thought, I withdraw my first statement. we did set the tempo. The tempo being slow, laborious passing and penetration followed by quick, incisive counter-attacks and desperate defensive flailing, followed by regained possession, followed by slow, laborious passing and penetration, etcetera, etcetera, ad infinitum. It wasn't just Daws and Verts losing concentration, it was our midfield failing to hold on to the ball in the attacking third and failing to provide cover for our defenders, it was our full-backs giving away possession time and time again by putting in atrocious crosses, and it was Soldado, Chadli and Townsend struggling up front with no support or movement around them.

We played badly as a team, with Daws and Rose just being the most prominent examples of our bad performance. That much is attested to by my post in the ratings thread, where I gave nearly everyone a sub-par (below six) rating.

Look, I don't doubt we'll improve. And I have faith that AVB will eventually make us the team you envision: able to control possession and fashion chances when they choose to while remaining rock solid at the back. But please don't assert that it's already happened. Today's performance shows we have a long, long way to go.

Spot on the money. We were slow ponderous and completely lacking in creativity.

Even allowing for the fact this was the NLD, the shameful thing was that they wanted it more than us. Our lack of creativity (no goals from open play in three games) and quite what our midfield thre are up to remains somewhat of a mystery. Who plays where? If Capoue is the DM then either Paline one Dembele MUST take it in turns to support Solado in the box. So often the three today were sitting far to deep and left our CM completely isolated.

From the in game comments, it seemed clear to most that Dembele was having a mare and it was crying out for Holtby (or even Sig) but certainly not Defoe. Couldn't understand that one by AVB