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Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?


  • Total voters
    125
  • Poll closed .
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Exactly right, if we wanted to give it to someone who came through the system then it should have been Inglethorpe as he had the coaching badges and actually coached our youth team, not saying he would cut it or not.

It was a real shame we lost Inglethorpe. I hope it was for his own reasons and not because of Timmeh's power accumulation. At least he's in a good setup now at Liverpool.

True, but it also means he'll be busy when he should be conducting transfer business.

Though I think he'd be free on august 31st, so not a massive issue.

LVG has always worked under a DoF. He's into coaching and organic growth, rather than buying.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Sorry but,.. give over you tart...

Whats your hang up with being English, what's that got to do with it, why would you mention that, it's your hang up not anyone elses.

And last weeks capitulation at Chelsea had everything to do with bad attitude, **** all to do with tactics, please tell me otherwise. It's your forum to prove me wrong as I clearly am with your victriotic reply.

Ok here goes:

English football over many decades has often had a mistrust of using players who have skill, vision and the ability to use both whilst beating a player: often seen as 'fancy dans', 'luxury players', 'those who probably can't do it on a wet Tuesday night in Stoke'.

Examples:

Glenn Hoddle, Matt Le Tissier, Gazza (in the end, ironically by Glenn Hoddle); players who were above the ordinary but not trusted, whilst those who were often medicore but 'ran about a bit more' showing 'passion', 'guts' etc were getting multiple caps: Ince, Gerrard (to an extent), Robson ('Captain Marval') were often continually lauded and seen as first names on the team sheet whilst they always failed to dictate tempo for England or create out of nothing like the previous players mentioned could. I have always believed if more of the first types of players mentioned were trusted by the English game at international level England would have done better than they have done since 1966. But alas, it's what most England fans demand: 'blood and guts' etc.

Go to your average Hackney Marshes type leagues and you see the emphasis all the time is on 'strength', 'passion' etc. Guile, creativity, tactical nous are NOT valued as they are in many other countries.
Sherwood - a very 'passionate' player but one who most will remember was semi-mediocre for us, though I did like him more than most - is another in that typical mantle who values 'guts', 'blood and thinder' etc and probably has the same attitude in the game as those who valued the Robsons and Inces over the Hoddles and Gazzas (and quite frankly I struggled to bring those names into it, so few have there been and so few are promoted in English football generally).

Our capitulation at Chelski was down to a poor mistake by Verts, following shortly on from slack defending that led to the penalty situation...the rest again poor individual errors that were more likely imo due to Chelski tiring us by making us chase their shadows.
Put it this way, did you think TS had a plan to combat them if they went a goal up?
Did you think TS had/has a plan for when we go a goal down AND a man down?
In fact, Dnipro still looked dangerous to me when THEY were a man down:eek: - the Ramos factor (and btw we often looked good with ten men with him imo)

Now since TS's show of 'passion' what have we seen? Two big games and two defeats where yes we showed good 'passion' but next to no tactical nous or creativity.

So basically the players 'showed some balls' and more 'running about a bit' but due to not having the tactical nous, system or plan instilled by the manager or creativity still got dingdonged. The fact that you were happy to see all this 'passion' even though tactically/creatively we are going backwards is why I used your post as an example of people who watch English football always think players showing 'passion' are 'good players.'
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

So Kane started ahead of Soldado on Thursday? Ok, perhaps saving him for Sunday...then he doesn't get on until the last 10 mins????

Perhaps Soldado has told TS something about what he thinks of his tactics??
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

So Kane started ahead of Soldado on Thursday? Ok, perhaps saving him for Sunday...then he doesn't get on until the last 10 mins????

Perhaps Soldado has told TS something about what he thinks of his tactics??

Or just pointed out that he's a c&#@?
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Ok here goes:

English football over many decades has often had a mistrust of using players who have skill, vision and the ability to use both whilst beating a player: often seen as 'fancy dans', 'luxury players', 'those who probably can't do it on a wet Tuesday night in Stoke'.

Yep 'none of this fancy malarky, keep it simple shun' has ruled the roost for years.

Great post and totally agree.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Levy's problem has never been knowing when to pull the trigger, he is usually right too, sentimentality should be kept out of it- so I think the analogies are rather unfair. What he is not good at is getting the appointment right in the first place.

I'd say it actually sits a little further than that mate…AVB was a fine appt IMO, but he needed to be backed properly. He wanted Moutinho, he didn't get him He wanted Damiao, he didn't get him. He wanted Villa, he didn't get him…Willian…Contrao…all were there and all could've been had, but Daniel likes to play a little game here and try for a bit more of a bargain. It's such a shame. It's why even if LVG is in, you have to wonder if Daniel can support him in a way he needs to be supported?

I will say that some absolutely agree with you re: AVB, and some were upset at what they felt was a lack of due diligence during the interview process...
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think the managers are to blame. Our attack has been predictable and defensive shape has been poor. I have to say that is the manager's fault not Levy's. IMO Levy provided a good enough team to challenge for top 4 most punters would have bitten your hand off at the start of the season.

This is also fair comment from certain perspectives…
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd say it actually sits a little further than that mate…AVB was a fine appt IMO, but he needed to be backed properly. He wanted Moutinho, he didn't get him He wanted Damiao, he didn't get him. He wanted Villa, he didn't get him…Willian…Contrao…all were there and all could've been had, but Daniel likes to play a little game here and try for a bit more of a bargain. It's such a shame. It's why even if LVG is in, you have to wonder if Daniel can support him in a way he needs to be supported?

I will say that some absolutely agree with you re: AVB, and some were upset at what they felt was a lack of due diligence during the interview process...

Er all those players you mentioned are massively expensive and complex deals for a club like ours. You talk about Willian and Moutinho as though they really should be here already when the chances of signing any of the players you mentioned was very small. If thats the kind of backing AVB required to be a success then he was a bad appointment.

I'm sure Sherwood or anyone could be relatively successful if they were given Moutinho, Damiao, Willian, Hulk and all these guys but we needed someone to build something out of the younger players and up and coming players we WERE able to sign
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Sorry but,.. give over you tart...

Whats your hang up with being English, what's that got to do with it, why would you mention that, it's your hang up not anyone elses.

And last weeks capitulation at Chelsea had everything to do with bad attitude, **** all to do with tactics, please tell me otherwise. It's your forum to prove me wrong as I clearly am with your victriotic reply.

What capitulation?

We were at 0-0 for the majority of the game gave away a stupid goal followed by a penalty decision from GHod knows where. The last two goals were in the 88th and 89th minute once we'd given all to get back in to the game and were both caused by individual errors from Sandro and Walker.

I wouldn't call it a capitulation more a self destruction and I agree that conceding in the 88th and 89th minute has nothing to do with tactics more to do with individual players lack of quality.

Its about time we started looking at the squad and saying "perhaps they aren't the Gods we make them out to be" and not blaming the manager for every little problem.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd say it actually sits a little further than that mate…AVB was a fine appt IMO, but he needed to be backed properly. He wanted Moutinho, he didn't get him He wanted Damiao, he didn't get him. He wanted Villa, he didn't get him…Willian…Contrao…all were there and all could've been had, but Daniel likes to play a little game here and try for a bit more of a bargain. It's such a shame. It's why even if LVG is in, you have to wonder if Daniel can support him in a way he needs to be supported?

I will say that some absolutely agree with you re: AVB, and some were upset at what they felt was a lack of due diligence during the interview process...

Did he openly say he wanted all these players or was it paper speculation, I'm struggling for quotes to back this theory.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

it was fair enough for the board to say sorry Andre, Moutinho, Willian, we can't afford to get that done

what they should have done though was say, we can get this guy and this guy who are similar players

instead we got Paulinho and Chadli
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Er all those players you mentioned are massively expensive and complex deals for a club like ours. You talk about Willian and Moutinho as though they really should be here already when the chances of signing any of the players you mentioned was very small. If thats the kind of backing AVB required to be a success then he was a bad appointment.

I'm sure Sherwood or anyone could be relatively successful if they were given Moutinho, Damiao, Willian, Hulk and all these guys but we needed someone to build something out of the younger players and up and coming players we WERE able to sign

I agree, laughable some people think we ever stood a chance signing the likes of Hulk he alone must be on £150,000 plus a week
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd say it actually sits a little further than that mate…AVB was a fine appt IMO, but he needed to be backed properly. He wanted Moutinho, he didn't get him He wanted Damiao, he didn't get him. He wanted Villa, he didn't get him…Willian…Contrao…all were there and all could've been had, but Daniel likes to play a little game here and try for a bit more of a bargain. It's such a shame. It's why even if LVG is in, you have to wonder if Daniel can support him in a way he needs to be supported?

I will say that some absolutely agree with you re: AVB, and some were upset at what they felt was a lack of due diligence during the interview process...

This is exactly the problem. Levy just won't go the extra yard to bring these players in to fully back the manager he appoints.

However if it's the case that Levy will not pay the wages then he shouldn't be appointing that manager in the first place. Appoint a manager who can work within a certain wages ceiling. And if that means lowering our expectations so be it. It's hard to swallow but that's the way it. It's all about the money spent and it's been that way for some time now. Harry couldn't sustain his initial success because Levy wouldn't back him in the transfer windows.

We just can't do it on the cheap.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

This is exactly the problem. Levy just won't go the extra yard to bring these players in to fully back the manager he appoints.

However if it's the case that Levy will not pay the wages then he shouldn't be appointing that manager in the first place. Appoint a manager who can work within a certain wages ceiling. And if that means lowering our expectations so be it. It's hard to swallow but that's the way it. It's all about the money spent and it's been that way for some time now. Harry couldn't sustain his initial success because Levy wouldn't back him in the transfer windows.

We just can't do it on the cheap.

Not only that but he'll sell their best players as soon as big money comes his way. No manager, no-matter who he is will never be given the opportunity to build a team at our football club.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

This is exactly the problem. Levy just won't go the extra yard to bring these players in to fully back the manager he appoints.

However if it's the case that Levy will not pay the wages then he shouldn't be appointing that manager in the first place. Appoint a manager who can work within a certain wages ceiling. And if that means lowering our expectations so be it. It's hard to swallow but that's the way it. It's all about the money spent and it's been that way for some time now. Harry couldn't sustain his initial success because Levy wouldn't back him in the transfer windows.

We just can't do it on the cheap.

I have heard AVB agreed to work within a transfer structure and to try and promote youngsters to the 1st team, but then did a u-turn and started demanding the lieks of Hult and Mountinho. If thats true Levy cant get the blame for that.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Our biggest problem is that we don't buy players to fit a system - we adapt our system to the players we buy.

It's been a problem for years, long before AVB or Sherwood.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Our biggest problem is that we don't buy players to fit a system - we adapt our system to the players we buy.

It's been a problem for years, long before AVB or Sherwood.

Swansea perfect example of that, only hire managers that play 433 and its worked well for them.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Our biggest problem is that we don't buy players to fit a system - we adapt our system to the players we buy.

It's been a problem for years, long before AVB or Sherwood.

tickle my balls with a feather, works once in a while when you stumble across a genius like Bale.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

read this in the comments section on the guardian. made me laugh quite a lot.

Alright, I've had enough of this. Let's clear this up now.
1. It's not Sherwood's team. True, but nobody pushed him into the job. He wanted it so badly that he spent months briefing off the record (Hytner, I'm looking at you) against AVB in order to get him fired. So if he wasn't up to managing this squad — and frankly, he isn't — he should have stayed in the shadows.

2. You can't blame him for showing his feelings, he's passionate. So ****ing what. I'm pretty certain that Arsene Wenger, Brendan Rogers and bless him, that hopeless **** David Moyes are all passionate. But they have class and tact and personal dignity. This cretin is disgracing an already bruised and sullied football club that is half a step from a traumatic coma.

3. Arsenal were lucky. Really? I think we were lucky not to get a good 0-4 hiding. If Ramsey and Ozil had been fit (and the latter had fancied it, not a given) then we could have been humiliated. "Papering over the cracks" translates as "I don't know what else to do, we threw everything at 'em."

4. Jorge Jesus has no class. So I thought I'd show him what class looks like by trying to pick a ****ing fight with a man ten years older than me.

5. Sagna: I threw the ball at him to show I was passionate. Yes, and also to show what a classless bell end you really are. Didn't you see that prick Pardew last week? What does that tell you, Timmy?

6. The players don't care/won't work hard enough/don't have any passion/are playing for their futures, etc. Or… they're mostly at a much higher technical and
professional standard than you ever experienced in your lifetime, and the game has moved on immesurably since you won your medal with Blackeye Rovers in 94/95, when you could still pass back to the goalkeeper when you got in trouble.

7. I'm not an actor. Really? Then why is half of your touchline strategy all about your theatrical, "passionate" displays? Could it be that you're not an actor because you don't know the play and haven't learned your lines? Could it be that your are completely out of your ****ing depth and your rage is a pathetic attempt to disguise your very real anguish and fear that you might be rumbled any second?
Seriously, I saw you play for Blackburn and Spurs. You were decidedly average. I seem to remember you smoked cigarettes at the time: very professional of you.

8. And finally, **** off back to Hertfordshire and take your passion and guts with you. You ****ed up my football club by getting a much better coach fired so that you could take his place.
 
Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Seems this turned into a Levy/Club/AVB thread instead of a TS thread

my question, if TS loses 2 of next 3 games, do people

- Give him until end of season?
- Give him next season?
- Get rid of now?

Because 4th is over, Europa is over and we may struggle to keep 5th (that is failure)
 
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