Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

[Libero]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Whoever comes in, we need another forward, a Left back and a wide midfielder on the left. Daley Blind was a good shout definitely at LB and would link well with Vertonghen. I would go for Griezmann wide left, he would cost but he has only 2 years left on his contract so they have a decision to make there. Up front I would go for Doumbia who has 18 months left on his contract or Bony.

Those 3 signings would give us a proper balance imo and if it leaves us in + net spend then so what? If we don't make the right decisions this summer and keep pace then we are going to properly fall behind. We don't need a massive turnover of players, as had been said and those 3 positions do need looking at more than anywhere else in the team currently.

 

[Raziel]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Whoever comes in, we need another forward, a Left back and a wide midfielder on the left. Daley Blind was a good shout definitely at LB and would link well with Vertonghen. I would go for Griezmann wide left, he would cost but he has only 2 years left on his contract so they have a decision to make there. Up front I would go for Doumbia who has 18 months left on his contract or Bony.

Those 3 signings would give us a proper balance imo and if it leaves us in + net spend then so what? If we don't make the right decisions this summer and keep pace then we are going to properly fall behind. We don't need a massive turnover of players, as had been said and those 3 positions do need looking at more than anywhere else in the team currently.

Agree with the 3 position areas ..

 

[Libero]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Agree with the 3 position areas ..

But not neccessarily the said players haha?!

People have mentioned about having a philosophy, a blueprint of sorts and for me I want us to retain proper wingers. I want us to go 4-4-1-1 with the one behind being someone who can drop into Midfield and bulk it up in those games where you dont want to get overrun but still allow your wide players to cause an issue. That way we can retain our danger from the pace in wide areas that we have so long been associated with and reatin our specific style whilst not being so open as to get pummelled every time we play a side considered better than us.

As an example, my team if we signed those players would be:

--------------------Lloris------------------------

---Walker------Kaboul-----Vertonghen----Blind---

---Lennon-----Sandro-----Dembele----Griezmann
(Paulinho)

-------------------Eriksen-----------------------

------------------Adebayor---------------------
(Bony/Doumbia/Soldado)

With Paulinho swapping with either Dembele/Sandro as required. Sometimes I would even play Dembele behind the forward instead of Eriksen.
Obviously Soldado doesn't seem to click with a one up top but I am sure that 4-4-1-1 would suit him slightly better and also allows to go with 2 up top if required easily enough during a game.

 

[Raziel]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

But not neccessarily the said players haha?!

People have mentioned about having a philosophy, a blueprint of sorts and for me I want us to retain proper wingers. I want us to go 4-4-1-1 with the one behind being someone who can drop into Midfield and bulk it up in those games where you dont want to get overrun but still allow your wide players to cause an issue. That way we can retain our danger from the pace in wide areas that we have so long been associated with and reatin our specific style whilst not being so open as to get pummelled every time we play a side considered better than us.

As an example, my team if we signed those players would be:

--------------------Lloris------------------------

---Walker------Kaboul-----Vertonghen----Blind---

---Lennon-----Sandro-----Dembele----Griezmann
(Paulinho)

-------------------Eriksen-----------------------

------------------Adebayor---------------------
(Bony/Doumbia/Soldado)

With Paulinho swapping with either Dembele/Sandro as required. Sometimes I would even play Dembele behind the forward instead of Eriksen.
Obviously Soldado doesn't seem to click with a one up top but I am sure that 4-4-1-1 would suit him slightly better and also allows to go with 2 up top if required easily enough during a game.

Don't know enough about the players to make a true comment.

My challenge with 1 up front is you need one of your wingers (like Bale did last year) or one of your midfielders (Lampard/Mata) to be fairly prolific with the goals (at least 10+), not sure if you side can do that.

I still believe against lower level teams and perhaps in Europe, we should go two up front, maybe it's just a variation of your team where you sacrifice a winger, put eriksen wide and have a second striker in the hole.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

But not neccessarily the said players haha?!

People have mentioned about having a philosophy, a blueprint of sorts and for me I want us to retain proper wingers. I want us to go 4-4-1-1 with the one behind being someone who can drop into Midfield and bulk it up in those games where you dont want to get overrun but still allow your wide players to cause an issue. That way we can retain our danger from the pace in wide areas that we have so long been associated with and reatin our specific style whilst not being so open as to get pummelled every time we play a side considered better than us.

As an example, my team if we signed those players would be:

--------------------Lloris------------------------

---Walker------Kaboul-----Vertonghen----Blind---

---Lennon-----Sandro-----Dembele----Griezmann
(Paulinho)

-------------------Eriksen-----------------------

------------------Adebayor---------------------
(Bony/Doumbia/Soldado)

With Paulinho swapping with either Dembele/Sandro as required. Sometimes I would even play Dembele behind the forward instead of Eriksen.
Obviously Soldado doesn't seem to click with a one up top but I am sure that 4-4-1-1 would suit him slightly better and also allows to go with 2 up top if required easily enough during a game.

One thing with that though is that we have about the narrowest home pitch in the league, so that automatically handicaps such an approach (especially as everyone else plays 5 across the midfield). For that reason alone I think we'd be better learning to create through congestion by better drilled movement.

 

[Millsy_Yiddo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

One thing with that though is that we have about the narrowest home pitch in the league, so that automatically handicaps such an approach (especially as everyone else plays 5 across the midfield). For that reason alone I think we'd be better learning to create through congestion by better drilled movement.

The counter argument to that would be that due to having the narrowest pitch in the league we need to create as much width as possible as this is what creates the little space there is in amongst the congestion.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Are you available in the summer?

I currently have a very secure job flipping burgers. Why would I take the step down?

 

[Gutter Boy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

The counter argument to that would be that due to having the narrowest pitch in the league we need to create as much width as possible as this is what creates the little space there is in amongst the congestion.

I'd love to see the stat for the % of goals we score from crosses. I think it would be incredibly low.

Width is important for pulling people out of the centre (which is why width from fullbacks is the new vogue), but in itself it has been fairly neutralised as an attacking method (cough Moyes).

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd love to see the stat for the % of goals we score from crosses. I think it would be incredibly low.

Width is important for pulling people out of the centre (which is why width from fullbacks is the new vogue), but in itself it has been fairly neutralised as an attacking method (cough Moyes).

Crossing in general is a very low return choice of style. I'd be surprised if any team posts up good numbers from it.

 

[thfcsteff]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Don't know enough about the players to make a true comment.

My challenge with 1 up front is you need one of your wingers (like Bale did last year) or one of your midfielders (Lampard/Mata) to be fairly prolific with the goals (at least 10+), not sure if you side can do that.

I still believe against lower level teams and perhaps in Europe, we should go two up front, maybe it's just a variation of your team where you sacrifice a winger, put eriksen wide and have a second striker in the hole.

I think whatever happens, the key issue this year has been the tempo at which we don't play and the speed of thought in midfield/direction. One thing I always felt AVB was trying to do, was develop a side who could transition quickly, effortlessly and with enormous speed (besides having players who could interchange on the pitch). It's why he must've been gutted when Modric was sold, a player he wanted at Chelski, because Modric is absolutely a fulcrum of such style, a classic cycler of the ball, a quick, fluid player who dictates the tempo of matches. Bale obviously wasn't replaced, he's irreplaceable, but Modric was for me a monumental loss and one fro which we have not ever properly recovered.

One thing Sherwood DID try to do, was address this. Bentaleb, although not some people's favorite player, is of this ilk. He is not near Luka's standard, and frankly might never be, but he is a tidy mover of the ball. The problem lies in the fact that rarely do we break with any speed, and rarely do we offer fluid options going forward. The goal against Cardiff was exactly what we need to be doing, quick fluid movement from deep, smart pass and move, and bang! Goal. That it was Soldado, in a deep position on the transition, who dictated the entire move came as no surprise to me; the bloke's been looking for it all season.

I think a fit Lamela could be very useful in this regard. And I believe Paulinho can absolutely work in this scenario, we do not use him properly at all and he has thus spent most of the season looking lost. But whoever comes in is going to need a world class cycler, a Modric-esque player. We also need to make a decision on Townsend. Do we believe or do we not? If we believe, he needs to be playing week in week out. Otherwise replace.

So much more to say…another time...

 

[Libero]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Don't know enough about the players to make a true comment.

My challenge with 1 up front is you need one of your wingers (like Bale did last year) or one of your midfielders (Lampard/Mata) to be fairly prolific with the goals (at least 10+), not sure if you side can do that.

I still believe against lower level teams and perhaps in Europe, we should go two up front, maybe it's just a variation of your team where you sacrifice a winger, put eriksen wide and have a second striker in the hole.

I agree with your points completely which is why I went with a 4-4-1-1 so that you can immediatly switch to 4-4-2. I wouldn't mind playing 3-5-2 personally but I am not sure that I would trust Walker to be of sufficient quality offensively for that to occur and be a success and obviously the left back position is already a problem.

 

[Libero]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

One thing with that though is that we have about the narrowest home pitch in the league, so that automatically handicaps such an approach (especially as everyone else plays 5 across the midfield). For that reason alone I think we'd be better learning to create through congestion by better drilled movement.

We managed to play well enough in terms of results and attractiveness for 4-5 seasons with 2 out and out wingers and we can do so again, regardless of pitch width. We need players who are happy to go on the outside, not just one in the whole squad.

And it isn't just about being able to cross from those positions either. If you beat the full back as a winger, you are going to advance and someone is going to have to come across to neutralise your threat, pulling their back line about and creating space and chances for your team.

 

[Raziel]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think whatever happens, the key issue this year has been the tempo at which we don't play and the speed of thought in midfield/direction. One thing I always felt AVB was trying to do, was develop a side who could transition quickly, effortlessly and with enormous speed (besides having players who could interchange on the pitch). It's why he must've been gutted when Modric was sold, a player he wanted at Chelski, because Modric is absolutely a fulcrum of such style, a classic cycler of the ball, a quick, fluid player who dictates the tempo of matches. Bale obviously wasn't replaced, he's irreplaceable, but Modric was for me a monumental loss and one fro which we have not ever properly recovered.

One thing Sherwood DID try to do, was address this. Bentaleb, although not some people's favorite player, is of this ilk. He is not near Luka's standard, and frankly might never be, but he is a tidy mover of the ball. The problem lies in the fact that rarely do we break with any speed, and rarely do we offer fluid options going forward. The goal against Cardiff was exactly what we need to be doing, quick fluid movement from deep, smart pass and move, and bang! Goal. That it was Soldado, in a deep position on the transition, who dictated the entire move came as no surprise to me; the bloke's been looking for it all season.

I think a fit Lamela could be very useful in this regard. And I believe Paulinho can absolutely work in this scenario, we do not use him properly at all and he has thus spent most of the season looking lost. But whoever comes in is going to need a world class cycler, a Modric-esque player. We also need to make a decision on Townsend. Do we believe or do we not? If we believe, he needs to be playing week in week out. Otherwise replace.

So much more to say…another time...

Agree .. thoughts for another thread, is the tactics thread still around?

 

[Bullet]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

And it isn't just about being able to cross from those positions either. If you beat the full back as a winger, you are going to advance and someone is going to have to come across to neutralise your threat, pulling their back line about and creating space and chances for your team.

Agreed, wide men aren't there just to deliver traditional crosses, they are to pull the defence around and get in behind. When we don't play with width the opposition sit back and smoke a pipe while we push softly against their solid centre.

 

[Spursify]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think whatever happens, the key issue this year has been the tempo at which we don't play and the speed of thought in midfield/direction. One thing I always felt AVB was trying to do, was develop a side who could transition quickly, effortlessly and with enormous speed (besides having players who could interchange on the pitch). It's why he must've been gutted when Modric was sold, a player he wanted at Chelski, because Modric is absolutely a fulcrum of such style, a classic cycler of the ball, a quick, fluid player who dictates the tempo of matches. Bale obviously wasn't replaced, he's irreplaceable, but Modric was for me a monumental loss and one fro which we have not ever properly recovered.

One thing Sherwood DID try to do, was address this. Bentaleb, although not some people's favorite player, is of this ilk. He is not near Luka's standard, and frankly might never be, but he is a tidy mover of the ball. The problem lies in the fact that rarely do we break with any speed, and rarely do we offer fluid options going forward. The goal against Cardiff was exactly what we need to be doing, quick fluid movement from deep, smart pass and move, and bang! Goal. That it was Soldado, in a deep position on the transition, who dictated the entire move came as no surprise to me; the bloke's been looking for it all season.

I think a fit Lamela could be very useful in this regard. And I believe Paulinho can absolutely work in this scenario, we do not use him properly at all and he has thus spent most of the season looking lost. But whoever comes in is going to need a world class cycler, a Modric-esque player. We also need to make a decision on Townsend. Do we believe or do we not? If we believe, he needs to be playing week in week out. Otherwise replace.

So much more to say…another time...

I couldn't agree more! Especially your point about Bentaleb. Yes he is kinda, (and I say that lightly) being used for that Modric position. My only concerns are that most of his passes are side to side. Not seen that killer through-ball pass, that could have Robbie on the end of it. But then I would drop Bentaleb tomorrow if I had a fit and raring-to-go Lamela floating behind the front two.

 

[Spursalot]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

So, what has changed since we got rid of avb?


Not much really. We have the occasional flash of brilliance game, a lot of tightly fought dull games and we still get thrashed by the top teams.


I'm struggling to see what Tim is trying to do. Avb had a system, granted it didn't work in the end, but at least he had something he was trying to implement. Tim.. Well I don't have a clue what his plan seems to be.

 

[Millsy_Yiddo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd love to see the stat for the % of goals we score from crosses. I think it would be incredibly low.

Width is important for pulling people out of the centre (which is why width from fullbacks is the new vogue), but in itself it has been fairly neutralised as an attacking method (cough Moyes).

I agree with you about crossing % goals being low. That's not the sole reason for my suggestion though. Full backs providing width tends to lend itself to teams parking the bus against us. Your full back has to come from deep so teams can generally sit back and allow you to come onto them. As we both know, we are notoriously bad at breaking teams down when they do this.

With an intelligent winger constantly occupying the full back and pulling them into positions they don't like to be in, the opposition back 4 is forced to think about and work to keep their shape. This is where mistakes happen. The more mistakes we force the opposition back 4 to make, the more likely we are to score goals.

 

[spurs' magna carter]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

According to a couple of people on SC tempers flared in the dressing on Saturday.

Afternoon all

Now this is in no way me trying to be an itk as I have absolutely no connection to anybody in THFC but I have heard that was some quite high tempers in the dressing room after the game against the chavs on Saturday.

This info has come from a girl at work who's husband is a spurs fan and a moderator on another spurs site. Apparently he was talking to another monitor (hope your keeping up!!) who works at the training ground.

Apparently there was some angry exchanges and squaring up in the dressing room due to Tim's post match interview. Now I'm a realist and expect, or rather hope that nobody was holding hands singing songs or doing the hokey kokey after that performance so it might (if indeed anything happened) be nothing.

Like I said this is no itk just stuff I've taken with a pinch of salt but was really just wandering if anybody else had heard anything??

I've heard Dawson was laying in to a few who didn't like it, and Tim took Dawson's side, that's why he was so angry in the interview.

 

[Jordinho]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

So, what has changed since we got rid of avb?


Not much really. We have the occasional flash of brilliance game, a lot of tightly fought dull games and we still get thrashed by the top teams.


I'm struggling to see what Tim is trying to do. Avb had a system, granted it didn't work in the end, but at least he had something he was trying to implement. Tim.. Well I don't have a clue what his plan seems to be.

It looks like he's from the Harry Redknapp school of tactics. Just put out different XIs and see if any of them work

 

[Nigeyman]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

According to a couple of people on SC tempers flared in the dressing on Saturday.

​

​

A massive barney was needed imo.

if true of course. we can only hope what needed to be said was said and that players resolve to be more positive from now on. Sunday really is our last chance for the league. 4th does seem like a pipe dream but we can all hope that if we somehow do manage a win...maybe just maybe it could push us on for a few more results.