Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

[Millsy_Yiddo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

We have no idea that it didn't. Not sure why we should assume Timmeh has become a saint in the years since he used to **** off our club whenever the opportunity presented itself.

I know we don't. That is why I would suggest we come to neither conclusion. We know that FDB has said Spurs would be a good club for him, we know that Tim Sherwood has said he wouldn't do that in the press. That's all there is to be said.


If we had concrete evidence he touted himself for AVB's job, then fair enough (although even then, that's not in the press) you could make your 'look at Timmeh, he's soooooo two faced type comment', but we don't.

I genuinely don't remember him being openly critical of us in the past. That's not to say he wasn't though. Have you any links to quotes and things he has said? Again, this isn't me trying to defend him by saying 'if you can't prove it, it didn't happen', just interested to see what he actually said.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Who knows. Unfortunately I'm not Abramovich's advisor.

It could easily have been he had money to spend and wanted to get younger, possibly even better, players in that could challenge for trophies with AVB as manager. When he saw AVB didn't have what was required he got rid.

So he did want the old players replaced? Then he didn't support the manager when he tried to do so. Anyway, this thread is about Timmeh's failings, not how badly AVB was treated. There's another thread for that somewhere.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

That's a big jump in logic there. Just because he's been critical of the way the club is run and how the team has performed (hands up who on here has never done either) it does not mean that every innuendo or smear on his character is true by default.

Like him or loath him, he appears to have done a good job since he came back here as a coach, or at least the people running the club seem to think so.

I would agree with you that he lacks experience for his current job and I suspect that he only got it because other more experienced candidates were unavailable. So far he is doing alright, not perfect, there are certainly areas where we need to improve but I am sure that we would have taken the results since AVB left if offered them, no matter who the coach was.

If Sherwood manages to stear us to 4th this season, I would rank it as our best achievement in the Premier League era. Not because of our performances because they have been lukewarm all season but because of how competitive the league is this year.

I know many may want to assess otherwise, but to me he was a dingdong in the past and until he proves otherwise I'll consider it a fairly valid character judgement. And that's a lens through which I'll judge whether he's done other things which are a bit dingdongish as his past behaviour (and a couple of reports from journos close to AVB) is all we have.

As for the competitiveness, I'm not so sure. Utd have been terrible - that's one of the four places wide open. Liverpool have destroyed a few teams but if they carry on at this rate all season they'll finish on 76 points - I just can't see that. I know there's been a few people saying that all season but I cannot see Liverpool getting to that tally - they have to drop some points soon.

As for us, we're on for 71-72 points at the rate so far this season. If that gets 4th I'll be incredibly surprised, but if it does is that necessarily better than getting 72 points last season? Or does it just mean that Utd have dropped out for a season?

I suspect 73-74 points will be needed for 4th this year and if we get it then great, but it's not as if we've dislodged a powerhouse in doing so, Utd (Moyes) did that to themselves.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

So he did want the old players replaced? Then he didn't support the manager when he tried to do so. Anyway, this thread is about Timmeh's failings, not how badly AVB was treated. There's another thread for that somewhere.

Have you joined AVB's official fan club? It doesn't matter how you cut it, AVB failed at Chelsea and he failed at Spurs. People who are involved in the club day to day who know more than us, saw how he was failing. Had he shown more promise I'm sure the poor results would have been overlooked and he'd have been given more time.

He's a strategist, not an effective leader.

Although this is Sherwood's thread, because some are so smitten with AVB, it affects their judgement regarding TS. TS is defined against AVB. So it is relevant. The greater manager (and possibly mistake) was HR. Still we are 3 points off 4th. Maybe Sherwood has more balls than HR and might galvanise the team and finish the season well. Time will tell.

If Sherwood does do well, will you be pleased? Will you admit that he's done a good job?

 

[milo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I would argue that it is harder to finish 4th in a more even league than one where one or two clubs run away with it. This season, you have to go quite a way down the league before you find an easy game and even then there are clubs who have taken points off teams competing for the title.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Have you joined AVB's official fan club? It doesn't matter how you cut it, AVB failed at Chelsea and he failed at Spurs. People who are involved in the club day to day who know more than us, saw how he was failing. Had he shown more promise I'm sure the poor results would have been overlooked and he'd have been given more time.

He's a strategist, not an effective leader.

Although this is Sherwood's thread, because some are so smitten with AVB, it affects their judgement regarding TS. TS is defined against AVB. So it is relevant. The greater manager (and possibly mistake) was HR. Still we are 3 points off 4th. Maybe Sherwood has more balls than HR and might galvanise the team and finish the season well. Time will tell.

If Sherwood does do well, will you be pleased? Will you admit that he's done a good job?

If Sherwood does well I'll be very pleased. I'd still want him replaced with a professional in the summer though.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

If Sherwood does well I'll be very pleased. I'd still want him replaced with a professional in the summer though.

Someone who looks and speaks like a professional

Hey if you are going to dish it out you can take it.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I would argue that it is harder to finish 4th in a more even league than one where one or two clubs run away with it. This season, you have to go quite a way down the league before you find an easy game and even then there are clubs who have taken points off teams competing for the title.

I guess that depends on what you view as an easy game (highly subjective unfortunately).

Last season I would have viewed every match outside of the top 4 as one we should win at home and at least draw away. I don't think the standard of the PL has increased much (except Liverpool), but I do think that we are far weaker without Bale. Obviously I see matches as much harder to win now we have Timmeh in charge - some may see them as the same or even easier.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Someone who looks and speaks like a professional

Hey if you are going to dish it out you can take it.

I'd be happy with someone who's managed before! Someone who's won stuff before would be really good. Someone who's won stuff at a high level even better.

 

[Joesh]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think if Tim gets us CL football with all thats gone on, it would rank as best achievement in the PL era. You couldnt knock it because of Utd's failings. I would imagine though that if we did it, it would be more like Di Matteos CL win where you dont quite know how he did it and obviously a lot of luck would need to be involved.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'm simply looking forward to the end of the season. There is a lot to play for and we've a bunch of young promising players. It is a big ask for them to gel into a team while needing to deliver results - and fans want us to win every possible game. So TS has a tough remit. So far he's doing the most important thing - getting the team winning. If he continues this, and we see signs that the team unit is improving eg better passing and better balance between defensive and attack, then there will be every reason for him to get the job full time.

We're not expected to do anything this season, we're not favourites for 4th and the Europa cup is a long shot. So the pressure should be off, but sadly for TS it really isn't. One bad result and the vultures will be circling.

 

[camspur]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think if Tim gets us CL football with all thats gone on, it would rank as best achievement in the PL era. You couldnt knock it because of Utd's failings. I would imagine though that if we did it, it would be more like Di Matteos CL win where you dont quite know how he did it and obviously a lot of luck would need to be involved.

Certain people on here would be saying it was all the good work AVB did that helped Sherwood get to that point.

I'm neither pro nor anti Sherwood but saying you can't support him as manager due to the way he looks or talks is plain stupid, let him be judged by his record which at the moment is quite good.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'm simply looking forward to the end of the season. There is a lot to play for and we've a bunch of young promising players. It is a big ask for them to gel into a team while needing to deliver results - and fans want us to win every possible game. So AVB has a tough remit. So far he's doing the most important thing - getting the team winning. If he continues this, and we see signs that the team unit is improving eg better passing and better balance between defensive and attack, then there will be every reason for him to keep the job.

We're not expected to do anything this season, we're not favourites for 4th and the Europa cup is a long shot. So the pressure should be off, but sadly for AVB it really isn't. One bad result and the vultures will be circling.

:-k

 

[SpurMeUp]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd be happy with someone who's managed before! Someone who's won stuff before would be really good. Someone who's won stuff at a high level even better.

No doubt.

However, that someone started out somewhere, where someone in charge recognised their talents and hunger. TS seems to have the hunger, as a player you need plenty of commitment and desire to play at the top.

We will look for clues and debate whether he's got the ability. Ultimately he'll be judged on results. But no one knows. One has to be agnostic regarding TS, its the only logical position.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Certain people on here would be saying it was all the good work AVB did that helped Sherwood get to that point.

I'm neither pro nor anti Sherwood but saying you can't support him as manager due to the way he looks or talks is plain stupid, let him be judged by his record which at the moment is quite good.

Nobody has said that, you're making things up (or repeating someone else who did).

 

[milo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I guess that depends on what you view as an easy game (highly subjective unfortunately).

Last season I would have viewed every match outside of the top 4 as one we should win at home and at least draw away. I don't think the standard of the PL has increased much (except Liverpool), but I do think that we are far weaker without Bale. Obviously I see matches as much harder to win now we have Timmeh in charge - some may see them as the same or even easier.

I'd agree with that. I'd add Southampton and Everton to the difficult to beat list but maybe this is offset by Swansea dropping back.

It's an amazing league this year, there's a bigger gap between 9th and 10th than there is between 10th and 20th. It is tight in the top half too but hopefully we will see Everton and Man United fall further back into the mix and we can concentrate on the clubs ahead of us.

 

[camspur]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I'd be happy with someone who's managed before! Someone who's won stuff before would be really good. Someone who's won stuff at a high level even better.

So would I but unfortunately they are few and far between.

At the end of the day I want a manager who helps Spurs win whether its AVB, LVG, FdB or "Our Timmeh" I don't really care.

 

[Superhudd]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Tim Sherwood can put his starting one striker up his royal high and mighty tea towel holder. That is all.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

well that just sums it all up really doesn't it?

kind of begs the question - why do you bother getting involved in the same debates all the time if you aren't actually interested in what these people have to say for themselves? - seeings as you've clearly already decided why they think what they think...

What can I say I'm drawn to these debates like a bee to honey

It doesn't mean I'm not interested in what people have to say, quite the opposite actually, I wouldn't keep posting in the thread if I wasn't interested.

I'll try to put it another way, If Liverpool finish above us this season then they would have done very indeed regardless of the fact that we haven't been at our best. They've got the best player in the league but I still feel we have the better squad.

 

[GrimsbyYid]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I've ****ged him of a lot, but we have been great today!!