Thomas Frank - Former Head Coach

[Gazza Dazzla]

Must remember not to mention Ange in a post again without mentioning something negative about his time here, apologies GG!

 

[Mikey10]

I grew up in a Telegraph reading house and while like you being the polar opposite of my views it did at least have a very good sports section but now, I wouldn't use it as bog roll.

Yeah, the in-laws always get it so would pick it up for the sport when at theirs (when they had Jonathan Liew writing for them, amongst others). That section is of as dreadful standard as the rest now.

 

[Mikey10]

Must remember not to mention Ange in a post again without mentioning something negative about his time here, apologies GG!

Excellent! It'll balance out the posts that seem to gloss over the normalisation of a losing culture in the PL, the gaslighting of fans and the dreadful football that we all had to endure for 18 months!

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Their approach hardly builds confidence that the next guy will fare much better. Hope that I'm proved wrong, but I'm pretty sure that we need a Poch-style clear out of a lot of these numbskulls.

Yeh and I can't be siding with players who seemingly appear weak mentality wise just because the manager is unpopular, we are where we are in massive part because of them. They need to get us out of this sh1t and prove something if this was just about the manager, I suspect it wasn't just that, we shall see

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

I'd say Emery is quite the contrast from Wenger and then early Arteta was quite the contrast to Emery

Conversely: Mourinho to Nuno to Conte to Ange to Frank - a run of 5 managers with only Ange being one that doesn't fit stylistically

This is a good point, Ange was the odd one out and I think that probably shows he was never viewed as a long term appointment, rather a ‘what is the club crying out for right now’ choice because we needed leadership, unity, and even Levy said we wanted to get our Tottenham back.

As a seperate point I think it’s slightly bizarre that we’ve been determined to go down this reactive manager route, whether it’s Paratici or Lange advising on that. But more so I think that by appointing Frank the board failed the ‘what is the club crying out for?’ test with Frank. The players weren’t desperate for a complete 180. They liked the cut of the old guy’s jib. After going through hell fire together last year they were put into an immense amount of transition that they then had to deal with, that they weren’t really asking for. Certainly not to that extent.

 

[Legohamster]

It will all come out now, but the eye and ear test told most of the story anyway...

https://archive.ph/fPz9d

Just backs up the thought some of the playing squad are a disgrace as a well as Frank not being up to it.

In a relegation battle and doing this?

Whoever is next needs to wipe out that changing room and stop the rot.

A squad with a large number of dislikable players.

 

[braineclipse]

There have been a lot of posts about TF. Without forensically going into each one I can't confirm or deny if that's true. But I am sure for some it's not far off.

To me arguing against a perception of what can't be confirmed or denied rather than against what people are actually saying seems like a good way to increase polarisation.

Then again I find it borderline incomprehensible that someone wouldn't see injuries for example as at the very least a significant factor in our problems this season.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I'd say Emery is quite the contrast from Wenger and then early Arteta was quite the contrast to Emery

Conversely: Mourinho to Nuno to Conte to Ange to Frank - a run of 5 managers with only Ange being one that doesn't fit stylistically

Emery and Wenger both play a possession-based style, I’d say there’s more similarities than with the coaches we have appointed. I don’t know enough about early Arteta tbh but they’re certainly a front foot team now, even if they rely more on set pieces than Wenger’s or Emery’s teams do.

Our choices of coaches and managers seemed reactionary and a response to results, league position or perceived short-term needs. To my eyes, there seems to be more of a shared continuation at clubs like Liverpool and Arsenal. It’s resulted in squad composition getting pulled in multiple directions as coaches change.

 

[billyiddo]

Emery and Wenger both play a possession-based style, I’d say there’s more similarities than with the coaches we have appointed. I don’t know enough about early Arteta tbh but they’re certainly a front foot team now, even if they rely more on set pieces than Wenger’s or Emery’s teams do.

Our choices of coaches and managers seemed reactionary and a response to results, league position or perceived short-term needs. To my eyes, there seems to be more of a shared continuation at clubs like Liverpool and Arsenal. It’s resulted in squad composition getting pulled in multiple directions as coaches change.

Wenger was an attacking idealist vs Emery's structural pragmatism. About as chalk and cheese as you can get. It's why Arteta & Edu had to gut the squad that the previous setup had started to put together over the 2 years Emery was there and it took them a couple of seasons to do that before they started to see progress - that doesn't describe a situation where the manager came in to a team that was in line with how we wanted to play

 

[robp135]

Move this clam to the general forum!

 

[Jurgen the German]

Wenger was an attacking idealist vs Emery's structural pragmatism. About as chalk and cheese as you can get.

Emery’s Villa team play out from the back to the point where their fans say they have their hearts in their mouths from what I’ve seen. Certainly nowhere near the contrasting styles of Poch to Jose or Conte to Ange or Ange to Frank.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Emery’s Villa team play out from the back to the point where their fans say they have their hearts in their mouths from what I’ve seen. Certainly nowhere near the contrasting styles of Poch to Jose or Conte to Ange or Ange to Frank.

They also happily go long periods without the ball, often in the 30% of possession this season when I have seen them

 

[billyiddo]

Emery’s Villa team play out from the back to the point where their fans say they have their hearts in their mouths from what I’ve seen. Certainly nowhere near the contrasting styles of Poch to Jose or Conte to Ange or Ange to Frank.

All sorts of teams with contrasting philosophies can and do play out from the back - it doesn't really say anything here.


Ange & Frank both play a high number of crosses - does that make them similar managers stylistically?

 

[Mikey10]

Apologies if already posted. A fairly balanced assessment.

Tottenham’s soaring dreams for Thomas Frank quickly hit the buffers of grim reality | David Hytner

Supposedly a pragmatic upgrade on Postecoglou, the Dane’s relationship with fans unravelled after early cup exits and league defeats in which they showed negligible attacking threat

www.theguardian.com

 

[clownfoot]

I'd say Emery is quite the contrast from Wenger and then early Arteta was quite the contrast to Emery

Conversely: Mourinho to Nuno to Conte to Ange to Frank - a run of 5 managers with only Ange being one that doesn't fit stylistically

I made a point when we hired Frank about the way we hire managers being very reactive to who they are replacing.

Frank was described as being adaptable and tailoring the team formation to who we play, which was at odds with Ange’s ‘this is how we play’ approach.

Ange was an attack first think about defending later coach, which was at odds with Conte and Mourinho mindsets of defensive play.

Mourinho and Conte were ‘proven winners’ which was a reaction to Pochettino being close but falling short of winning.

Pochettino was a coach who would develop young talent, which was the opposite of AVB who wanted to buy ready made players.

Levy was the deciding factor in all these appointments and seemed to go for what was missing from the person just sacked rather than going for what we needed. We’re in new territory now as we don’t know what sort of coach the Nepos or VV are after

 

[Fatso Jason]

dan burn impressive to be fair, he must be nearly 60

Just backs up the thought some of the playing squad are a disgrace as a well as Frank not being up to it.

In a relegation battle and doing this?

Whoever is next needs to wipe out that changing room and stop the rot.

A squad with a large number of dislikable players.

One or both of the 2 who blanked him as they walked off at the end of the game are on my short list for the meme gang!

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

I made a point when we hired Frank about the way we hire managers being very reactive to who they are replacing.

Frank was described as being adaptable and tailoring the team formation to who we play, which was at odds with Ange’s ‘this is how we play’ approach.

Ange was an attack first think about defending later coach, which was at odds with Conte and Mourinho mindsets of defensive play.

Mourinho and Conte were ‘proven winners’ which was a reaction to Pochettino being close but falling short of winning.

Pochettino was a coach who would develop young talent, which was the opposite of AVB who wanted to buy ready made players.

Levy was the deciding factor in all these appointments and seemed to go for what was missing from the person just sacked rather than going for what we needed. We’re in new territory now as we don’t know what sort of coach the Nepos or VV are after

These guys were front and center in the Frank appointment, let’s not kid ourselves here.

 

[clownfoot]

These guys were front and center in the Frank appointment, let’s not kid ourselves here.

That is true, the statement put out of Ange’s sacking was the first that Levy didn’t have his name on, so from that point on it was a committee

 

[billyiddo]

I made a point when we hired Frank about the way we hire managers being very reactive to who they are replacing.

Frank was described as being adaptable and tailoring the team formation to who we play, which was at odds with Ange’s ‘this is how we play’ approach.

Ange was an attack first think about defending later coach, which was at odds with Conte and Mourinho mindsets of defensive play.

Mourinho and Conte were ‘proven winners’ which was a reaction to Pochettino being close but falling short of winning.

Pochettino was a coach who would develop young talent, which was the opposite of AVB who wanted to buy ready made players.

Levy was the deciding factor in all these appointments and seemed to go for what was missing from the person just sacked rather than going for what we needed. We’re in new territory now as we don’t know what sort of coach the Nepos or VV are after

Agree on our approach somewhat, just not that Arsenal are an example of the type of succession planning we should be looking at - they've done similar (mismatched appointments) but have just landed on something that works in spite of that

 

[Glenda's Legs]

Move this clam to the general forum!

Maybe start a poll to see if everyone agrees?