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The Goon Thread
- Thread starter Jordinho
- Start date
all manager's "lie" to an extent. i dont see how wenger is any different here.
the truth of the matter is, arsenal (as a club) are not willing to spend as much money as the likes of chelsea or barcelona. therefore, its inevitable that they are not going to be as succesful as those clubs. but if you expect wenger to say this, then youre mad. hes just giving the fans what they want to hear so they can dream and continue to support the club. this is the same with every other club.
look at the title winners in the pl over the past few seasons, and look the teams that have finished in the top 4 too. its always the same bunch of teams. and surprise, surprise, they are the richest teams in england too. football is a very simple game at its core. the more money you spend, the better you will do. however, you cant expect a clubs or a manager of a club to come out and say "we spent the 4th most money in recent years, so as fans, you should adjust your expectations accordingly".
just like you wouldnt expect levy or mopo to say "realistically, we cant do much better than 5th or 6th". fans want to hear what they want to hear, and you cant blame any manager for feeding them that imo.
the truth of the matter is, arsenal (as a club) are not willing to spend as much money as the likes of chelsea or barcelona. therefore, its inevitable that they are not going to be as succesful as those clubs. but if you expect wenger to say this, then youre mad. hes just giving the fans what they want to hear so they can dream and continue to support the club. this is the same with every other club.
look at the title winners in the pl over the past few seasons, and look the teams that have finished in the top 4 too. its always the same bunch of teams. and surprise, surprise, they are the richest teams in england too. football is a very simple game at its core. the more money you spend, the better you will do. however, you cant expect a clubs or a manager of a club to come out and say "we spent the 4th most money in recent years, so as fans, you should adjust your expectations accordingly".
just like you wouldnt expect levy or mopo to say "realistically, we cant do much better than 5th or 6th". fans want to hear what they want to hear, and you cant blame any manager for feeding them that imo.
and stuff about wenger "being arrogant", or Albert Einstein's “insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results” quote being attributed at wenger is departed beyond belief.
arsenal success (or lack of) is simply down to finances, and its cringeworthy when people think they are being intelligent whilst quoting einstein in regars to wenger.
the truth of the matter is, einstein isnt fit to lace wengers boots
arsenal success (or lack of) is simply down to finances, and its cringeworthy when people think they are being intelligent whilst quoting einstein in regars to wenger.
the truth of the matter is, einstein isnt fit to lace wengers boots
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
Right on cue
milo
Jack L. Jones
I think that the amazing thing about Arsenal is that they would not need to match Emirates Marketing Project, United or Chelsea to greatly improve their chances this season. He has built a decent side but they clearly need strengthening in a couple of positions to mount a serious challenge.
My understanding is that Wenger has got incredibly cautious in the transfer market, to the extent that he is very reluctant to spend. He never had these concerns early in his tenure. A complicating factor is that his player analysts are meant to be based in the States.
My understanding is that Wenger has got incredibly cautious in the transfer market, to the extent that he is very reluctant to spend. He never had these concerns early in his tenure. A complicating factor is that his player analysts are meant to be based in the States.
i disagree. I think they need quite significant investment if they want to match the teams above them. when they lost henry, they were still probably the 3/4th best team. same when they lost fabregas too. when they added ozil they were still the 3rd or 4th best team. and they were still no better when they added alexis. the same is probably going to be the case with cech too.
one or two players simply wont make much difference. arsenal need to invest heavily in a number of consecutive windows if they want to be up there with the likes of city and other super elite european teams imo. the thing is, if they added 2 or 3 elite players, and they slotted into the arsenal team seamlessly, then yeah they probably would be as good as Emirates Marketing Project. but thats not how football works. they need to buy about 5/6 elite players and hope that 2 of them come off.
in short, you need to be able to afford to speculate (and be wrong) on players of the claibre of torres, shevchenko, robinho, di maria, falcao etc to find enough quality players that work well enough together to be consistently challenging for titles. if you consider how much this would cost in terms of transfer fees and wages, you can see why the likes of kroenke and levy are not really willing to spend more than they currently are.
none of this really matters. arsenal can really only afford to have the 4th best set of players in the pl. and thats why they finish around 4th most years. their player analysts could be in zimbabwe, it really wouldnt matter.
milo
Jack L. Jones
It matters if they are slow to react and this hampers them in the market, especially when combined with an incredibly cautious manager.
of course they are in with a shout if they have a good season and city, utd and chelsea have off seasons. thats always been the case though imo. just like how we have a chance of top 4, if we have a good year and if a couple all of the top 4/5 teams have off seasons.
Baleforce
Les Bennett
kind of a hard sell to the board
"if we go through this season with this squad where will we finish?"
"4th"
"what about if we get a couple of injuries, could Spurs or Liverpool realistically nip in ahead of us?"
"ha ha ha ha ha, you are tres amusing Mr Kroenke"
"ok, how about if we spend 100m and increase our wage budget by 200k a week, where will we finish?"
"4th"
"if we go through this season with this squad where will we finish?"
"4th"
"what about if we get a couple of injuries, could Spurs or Liverpool realistically nip in ahead of us?"
"ha ha ha ha ha, you are tres amusing Mr Kroenke"
"ok, how about if we spend 100m and increase our wage budget by 200k a week, where will we finish?"
"4th"
don't think this really matters tbh. the football player market at the level that arsenal are shopping in is a free market where everyone has good levels of information on what is going on. if arsenal dont spend its because they didnt want to.
arsenal could be fast to react or slow, but if they spend the 4th most money, i have no doubt that their average league position over a decent sample size will be around 4th.
Disagree, starting this season I would have put Scum as potential 3rd place
Looking at the start of season (the one positive of window actually being open while season starts), I would say Scum had a shot at 2nd (Cheat$ki look off balance), add two players e.g. a top quality Striker and an effective midfielder (ala MS & Pedro), would have been less than 55M even if overpaying and they would potentially have a legitimate shot at challenging.
The fact is, Scum & Wenger have no ambition beyond status quo, only adjustment to that in last 8 years has been the decision to actually put out a full squad to win FA cup to keep the negative PR re their lack of ambition/success minimized.
this is the unfortunate truth imo.
fans, pundits, journalists, pseudo-intellectuals like rafa honigstein etc can discuss tactics, grade a teams performance in a transfer window etc etc, but football at the level that arsenal are in is really a lot simpler than people make it out to be. if we (as fans) werent emotionally invested in our teams (or football in general), i think we would quickly be able to realise this. unfortunately, we delude ourselves at the start of every season by thinking that if our manager is a tictacs genius, we could finish higher than we should. and tbh, im no different lol
the gap between ms&pedro and the current options at arsenal is almost minimal. and when you factor in that they will have to adapt too, there no real reason to suggest why those guys would get arsenal any higher up in the league table. they could just as easily flop like torres or di maria too
- Disagree, Scum have not had a CM with significant defensive ability and are you comparing Pedro to who (Walnutt? really?)
- Even if you believe that, the squad depth it would have created would have strengthened them considerably
- Why buy any player? they always can flop
Fact is, Scum are within fiscal range of competing, but don't want to ..
Real question, is why is his name off the thread? no question previous title made more sense
obviously no one is perfect. but in regards to football management, i dont think theres any massive flaw in what wenger has done in recent years. i would say this about a number of other managers too. including poch
every year people are quick to point of all these tactical flaws at arsenal. and make them out to be massive errors in judgement by wenger. but if this were the case, why do the likes of us and liverpool find it so hard to overthrow them? barcelona didnt have a cm with "significant defensive ability". i didnt see them struggling too much. barcelona competed very well against teams in their financial bracket without this dcm. just like arsenal perform very well in their financial bracket too.
pedro, alexis, walcott, ox. theres really not much in it. it all comes down to which players will suit arsenal's style best and fit in well. soldado can look a semi pro player at tottenham, but look a world beater at the right club. you're underestimating the importance of a player being at the right club for himself.
their squad depth in attacking midfield is fine. tbh their squad depth in general is world class.
no doubt they can compete if they want to. but i dont think kroenke has any need for a life insurance policy atm.