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Son Heung-Min

We have 31 players so far for 22 European places
Of course we can have more in the league
We have to be much more ruthless
But… Sonny have earned the right to choose. I’ll stand behind that
 
Lilbaz said:
In previous seasons where we weren't playing so high up the pitch he had no space to run into, and finished 17th in the league cause the whole team struggled to even pass the ball to each other.
If he should have done better what about everyone else?
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Well of our starting forwards he missed the most chances
 
Lilbaz said:
A player who still got 11 goals and 12 assists last season.
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That's bang average across all competitions. Seven goals in the PL, a talented young forward could be playing and putting in at least those numbers and it would be more productive to go with them than a guy who is past his best.

If he is staying, I hope the captaincy is given to someone else and that he is mainly used as a sub....
 
harr1984 said:
That's bang average across all competitions. Seven goals in the PL, a talented young forward could be playing and putting in at least those numbers and it would be more productive to go with them than a guy who is past his best.

If he is staying, I hope the captaincy is given to someone else and that he is mainly used as a sub....
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In a system which clearly didn't suit him...


As long as he only plays on merit I think it's a sensible move - i certainly don't think it's a certainty he's finished at this level based off the last year or so and if it turns out he isn't then letting him go would work out worse than being lumbered with him for another year.
 
billyiddo said:
In a system which clearly didn't suit him...
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But also highlighted the changes in his technique and game as he has got older
We ain’t gonna go back to be a counter attacking side again
And son is 2 years older since we saw him play somewhere like his best
It has Hugo vibes all over it for me
Kept him a year too long too
 
Bedfordspurs said:
But also highlighted the changes in his technique and game as he has got older
We ain’t gonna go back to be a counter attacking side again
And son is 2 years older since we saw him play somewhere like his best
It has Hugo vibes all over it for me
Kept him a year too long too
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See my edit above
 
billyiddo said:
See my edit above
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As i said earlier, he has earned the right to choose
But for the club it’s a £40m cost/gamble (assuming the rumoured £30m fee is accurate of course)
Maybe I’m a fool but I look at Sonny, Richy and potentially Romero leaving and adding that to the obvious sales we would have a real cash uplift for buying exactly what we need for Thomas
We have been horrendous at selling and have held on to so many players way way too long
 
billyiddo said:
In a system which clearly didn't suit him...


As long as he only plays on merit I think it's a sensible move - i certainly don't think it's a certainty he's finished at this level based off the last year or so and if it turns out he isn't then letting him go would work out worse than being lumbered with him for another year.
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Regardless of system, which by the way I can't wait for next season and all the trophies we will be winning because according to some most of the team have been held back by big bad Ange and his system - He received the ball shed loads of times facing up a defender when in past years he had the sharpness to either run away from a defender or be quick enough shifting the ball to the side and getting his shot away whereas now he either loses the ball, plays it safe or his shot is just poor.

It's natural for someone who relies heavily on speed and sharpness to decline like this, unfortunately his shooting which has been exceptional has declined too. I'm afraid this isn't on Ange, footballing old age gets to everyone....
 
harr1984 said:
Regardless of system, which by the way I can't wait for next season and all the trophies we will be winning because according to some most of the team have been held back by big bad Ange and his system - He received the ball shed loads of times facing up a defender when in past years he had the sharpness to either run away from a defender or be quick enough shifting the ball to the side and getting his shot away whereas now he either loses the ball, plays it safe or his shot is just poor.

It's natural for someone who relies heavily on speed and sharpness to decline like this, unfortunately his shooting which has been exceptional has declined too. I'm afraid this isn't on Ange, footballing old age gets to everyone....
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Hence my Hugo comment
People thought it was how we played rather than age
The amount of times last year son has chances that previously he would smash but now tickled them was quite scary
That penalty va wolves stood out for me as this is how he is finishing now
All good things come to an end
 
harr1984 said:
Regardless of system, which by the way I can't wait for next season and all the trophies we will be winning because according to some most of the team have been held back by big bad Ange and his system - He received the ball shed loads of times facing up a defender when in past years he had the sharpness to either run away from a defender or be quick enough shifting the ball to the side and getting his shot away whereas now he either loses the ball, plays it safe or his shot is just poor.

It's natural for someone who relies heavily on speed and sharpness to decline like this, unfortunately his shooting which has been exceptional has declined too. I'm afraid this isn't on Ange, footballing old age gets to everyone....
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However anyone views Ange and his time here i think that it's a widely discussed/accepted truism that how he wanted his wingers to play vs what Sons game is doesn't match up with one another - so with that in mind a new manager with different ideas on how to set a team up could see Son improve to a level that he is a worthy squad player. That's hardly an outlandish suggestion.
 
billyiddo said:
However anyone views Ange and his time here i think that it's a widely discussed/accepted truism that how he wanted his wingers to play vs what Sons game is doesn't match up with one another - so with that in mind a new manager with different ideas on how to set a team up could see Son improve to a level that he is a worthy squad player. That's hardly an outlandish suggestion.
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Son might often have started out wide but he was also found centrally plenty of the time and had ample opportunities to do the things he was so good at in years gone by.

His formerly exceptional traits have been exposed and his game has diminished. I don't have a problem with him being a squad player, mainly to help the young left wingers we have.....
 
harr1984 said:
Son might often have started out wide but he was also found centrally plenty of the time and had ample opportunities to do the things he was so good at in years gone by.

His formerly exceptional traits have been exposed and his game has diminished. I don't have a problem with him being a squad player, mainly to help the young left wingers we have.....
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He's past his peak, that much is true - but I just feel how much he has tailed off has been made to look worse via not fitting the tactics. Could be wrong but I think there's some logic there at least.
 
billyiddo said:
He's past his peak, that much is true - but I just feel how much he has tailed off has been made to look worse via not fitting the tactics. Could be wrong but I think there's some logic there at least.
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There is a possible logic
But his speed has gone. That’s is visible, unless of course it was injury related. I’d wager that’s age
I agree the tactics have an impact but he still had a lot of shots that were frankly… weak.
 
Did some quick checks to see how his numbers compare to previous seasons (prem only)
Shots per 90 mins
24 - 2.40
23 - 2.56
22 - 2.50
21 - 2.54 (best season in front of goal)
20 - 1.95
The years before that with an average of around 3 plus shots per game and last year was his second worse for us since he joined for shots

His Xg
24 - 7.91 vs 7 scored
23 - 12.98 vs 17 scored
22 - 9.6 vs 10 scored
21 - 16.98 vs 23
20 - 11.02 vs 17
Again previous to that he out scoring his Xg by about 3 goals per season ish and last year was his worst since 16/17 for his xg. Per 90 it was his 3rd best for us so he is having the chances

His Xa (such a flimflam stat)
24 - 9.04 vs 9
23 - 13.34 vs 10
22 - 6.33 vs 6
21 - 7.85 vs 7
20 - 9.51 vs 10

It was his 3rd best season for us creatively

His minutes played reduced last year to 2135 vs previous years where he averaged around 3000 minutes so in theory.., in theory…. He is fresher.

He was playing a wider role but that would explain his creativity increase.
 
billyiddo said:
He's past his peak, that much is true - but I just feel how much he has tailed off has been made to look worse via not fitting the tactics. Could be wrong but I think there's some logic there at least.
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Yeah of course there's logic to that I agree - but Son is no longer a player good enough that you look to play a system that gets the best out of him.

Hes one of my all time favourites, but I would have real concerns if Son was anything more than a bit part player next season. Would much rather Tel/Odobert/Moore having the time to develop on the pitch....
 
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