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Roberto De Zerbi *OFFICIAL*

Robspur12 said:
I think RDZ is a very good coach and he was my first choice to take the job after I think the second Conte season before we settled on Ange.

I cooled on him a bit after he fell out with Brighton. Plus didn't like the way he appeared to justify Mason Greenwood's actions. I have got a teenage daughter and witnessed domestic abuse first hand as a police officer; so I completely understand people's concern about it and we shouldn't belittle it. Words are important especially coming from someone in a high profile position.

That said if someone has truly atoned for a mistake I also believe in second chances. If that was RDZ's intention, although clumsy, I can understand that

I will support him while he's the Spurs manager but I'm sure the Greenwood question will not go away. I do hope he comes out strongly against domestic abuse as he is a mentor now to a team of young men.
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It’s also worth noting that English is not his first language, and things can sound different in translation so what sounds clumsy to us native speakers it can often lose a bit
 
Robspur12 said:
I think RDZ is a very good coach and he was my first choice to take the job after I think the second Conte season before we settled on Ange.

I cooled on him a bit after he fell out with Brighton. Plus didn't like the way he appeared to justify Mason Greenwood's actions. I have got a teenage daughter and witnessed domestic abuse first hand as a police officer; so I completely understand people's concern about it and we shouldn't belittle it. Words are important especially coming from someone in a high profile position.

That said if someone has truly atoned for a mistake I also believe in second chances. If that was RDZ's intention, although clumsy, I can understand that

I will support him while he's the Spurs manager but I'm sure the Greenwood question will not go away. I do hope he comes out strongly against domestic abuse as he is a mentor now to a team of young men.
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I certainly wouldn't want to belittle the subject matter, it's an important issue. I don't agree he justified Greenwood's actions by what he said, saying he 'paid a heavy price' is as fact - he did. At no point did he suggest what Greenwood did was ok, but spoke of his personal experience of the guy which is fair enough when he was undoubtedly constantly asked about the player. It's a difficult position for a manager to be in - What would you expect halo wearing Poch to say? That Greenwood is a disgusting human being? I think he like most managers would have said something similar, Getafe's manager wasn't any different.

Personally I haven't seen anything said from him regarding Greenwood to not want him at my club for non footballing reasons but that's just me - With sensitive issues there are bound to be plenty for and against these things. If we were talking about signing Greenwood that would be a different matter - like most I've heard the audio and it's horrific listening. I sincerely hope he is rehabilitating himself, but wouldn't want him doing it anywhere near our club.....
 
demotw said:
It’s also worth noting that English is not his first language, and things can sound different in translation so what sounds clumsy to us native speakers it can often lose a bit
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Is there not a second layer here?

This happened in France, presumably De Zerbi replied in French, and this was then translated into English?
 
MartyFunkhouser said:
Or like the 50%+ of women who live with domestic abuse she is overcome by the complexities of the situation
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Well then he should obviously be hanged, along with anybody who gives him a second chance.

Would be nice to come on this forum without having to read the Moral High Ground World Championships.
 
NoLimits01 said:
I haven’t followed this any more than what’s been posted on this site, but isn’t she still with him and now have a child together?

edit: Seen that kb beta me to it
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That is correct.

It doesn't change how disgusting his actions were.
Those actions also mean he's that person anymore.
I wouldn't want to have a coffee with him, or certainly not without a lot of assurance he is no longer that person.

However, his actions don't mean he should be vilified forever or have his employment affected.
There is a fair bit of faux righteousness on here around this; I bet a lot of us have work colleagues or clients that have done hideous things, and we get to choose part of our relationship with them. Anyone that hasn't left their job/stopped buying from a supplier that employs someone whose actions are below their standards is a hypocrite...... and that's every single one of us.

Love or loathe him, love or loathe the system, he isn't convicted of a sexual offence; those are the rules our society has, so the extent to which judgement and influence can be imposed is limited to a social one.
In the context of football, that would be having nothing to with any football activities related to him. I doubt many people on here can claim to actually do that, or any extension of it.
IE anyone that has watched a football match with Joey Barton in, or Paul Gascoigne in, etc etc

It's not a comfortable truth, and one many people don't seem ready to admit to themselves, but it a truth.
 
Lemonade Money said:
Well then he should obviously be hanged, along with anybody who gives him a second chance.

Would be nice to come on this forum without having to read the Moral High Ground World Championships.
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Yeh because thats what anyone has said FFS..............those that have heard the audio who are normal human beings rightly state it doesn't sit well with them. I haven't read one part that even suggests he should be banged up, just that people wouldn't want him here.

If your reaction to that Audio is one that is different, then maybe that says more about you than people taking part in some WC of morals
 
monkeybarry said:
That is correct.

It doesn't change how disgusting his actions were.
Those actions also mean he's that person anymore.
I wouldn't want to have a coffee with him, or certainly not without a lot of assurance he is no longer that person.

However, his actions don't mean he should be vilified forever or have his employment affected.
There is a fair bit of faux righteousness on here around this; I bet a lot of us have work colleagues or clients that have done hideous things, and we get to choose part of our relationship with them. Anyone that hasn't left their job/stopped buying from a supplier that employs someone whose actions are below their standards is a hypocrite...... and that's every single one of us.

Love or loathe him, love or loathe the system, he isn't convicted of a sexual offence; those are the rules our society has, so the extent to which judgement and influence can be imposed is limited to a social one.
In the context of football, that would be having nothing to with any football activities related to him. I doubt many people on here can claim to actually do that, or any extension of it.
IE anyone that has watched a football match with Joey Barton in, or Paul Gascoigne in, etc etc

It's not a comfortable truth, and one many people don't seem ready to admit to themselves, but it a truth.
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Nope, anyone that hears that audio and dares say it doesn't sit right with them is apparently part of the moral high ground world championships.
 
It will be nice when we are back to playing football again and not discussing a player who will never play for us, quite looking forward to the Sunderland game now.

Hopefully will see some tactical insights and potential lineups soon :)....
 
harr1984 said:
I don't agree he justified Greenwood's actions by what he said, saying he 'paid a heavy price' is as fact - he did. At no point did he suggest what Greenwood did was ok, but spoke of his personal experience of the guy which is fair enough when he was undoubtedly constantly asked about the player. It's a difficult position for a manager to be in - What would you expect halo wearing Poch to say? That Greenwood is a disgusting human being? I think he like most managers would have said something similar, Getafe's manager wasn't any different.
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I don't want to get drawn too deeply into this debate. As I say it will follow him so we can't ignore it.

People read things differently and the views of those who believe he didn't say enough to condemn domestic violence, (while at the same time supporting his player), should be listened to. It seems the narrative these days in some quarters is that views which indicate concern around violence, racism or hate speech mark out the holder of such views to be looney lefties or snowflakes. Usually this comes from people who cannot make themselves empathise with the victims of these things.

In reality, people challenging speech in a reasonable way, has seen society move towards becoming more progressive in my life time.

And it is possible to do both, condemn the action while defend a repentant player. He could have prefixed his defence of Mason Greenwood by saying something along the lines of "I have spoken to MG about this and firstly let me say he has expressed regret for those actions. He is asking for a second chance etc... " This is an emotive issue that needs to be handled with care. There are real victims who may not have seen justice served in their cases. As I say words matter. And if RDZ comes out strongly against domestic violence, I would absolutely applaud him and I'm sure it would unite the fan base.
 
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ShipOfGoldblum said:
What do you think Manchester United’s motives were in commissioning a civil investigation, other than mitigating legal risk and protecting a balance sheet asset?

Do you think that an investigation commissioned by a business concern is ever going to step outside of its terms of reference and come up with findings that damage the business’s interests?
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Irrelevant of the motivations of the investigation, there are fudged statements and strong statements. And they did not have to go into the specifics in any public announcement. At the end of the day we have a criminal case dropped due to new material coming to light and the withdrawal of witnesess. That is the CPS statement. And we have the internal Man Utd investigation, which concluded that the material posted on social media did not articulate the full picture and they were confident he did not commit the actions he was accussed of. We haven't heard any further from those involved and so that's what we have to go on. We don't do trial by assumption, speculation or media in this country and therefore labelling De Zerbi as an apologist for behaviour that all facts available suggest did not actually occur (or at least the facts are far more complicated than some like to make out). "How can he play him, speak about him with sympathy" etc. You are talking about a man talking about a man that as far as evidence goes, hasn't actually been evidenced to have done anything at all.
 
Gazza Dazzla said:
Who do we think are the big winners and losers in our squad under RDZ then?

What formation is he going with?
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Vicario likely leaving in the summer anyway, but DZ likes a ball playing keeper so he would be out if not already. Will be interesting to see if Kinksy gets a look in (might do anyway if Vic not recovered from his op?)

Surely looking to upgrade CM and forward options, but right now anyone who can kick a ball is in with a shout of an opportunity :D .....
 
Robspur12 said:
I don't want to get drawn too deeply into this debate. As I say it will follow him so we can't ignore it.

People read things differently and the views of those who believe he didn't say enough to condemn domestic violence, (while at the same time supporting his player), should be listened to. It seems the narrative these days in some quarters is that views which indicate concern around violence, racism or hate speech mark out the holder of such views to be looney lefties or snowflakes. Usually this comes from people who cannot make themselves empathise with the victims of these things.

In reality, people challenging speech in a reasonable way, has seen society move towards becoming more progressive in my life time.

And it is possible to do both, condemn the action while defend a repentant player. He could have prefixed his defence of Mason Greenwood by saying something along the lines of "I have spoken to MG about this and firstly let me say he has expressed regret for those actions. He is asking for a second chance etc... " This is an emotive issue that needs to be handled with care. There are real victims who may not have seen justice served in their cases. As I say words matter. And if RDZ comes out strongly against domestic violence, I would absolutely applaud him and I'm sure it would unite the fan base.
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Indeed, words could have been chosen better but 1) He was not speaking in English, I would never totally rely on translation in these instances 2) That for me is not enough to campaign against a manager coming here

But I agree with your general post mate.....
 
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