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Relegation Battle Watch

Harry_Perkins said:
Relegated once with Southampton that I can recall? Nowhere near with anyone else. The QPR turnaround is something else. If he pulls it off, possibly a greater escape than the one with Pompey when he went back there and certainly with us (although the real impressive feat there was nearly getting us into Europe from that position but that is another discussion).

4 points from the first 13 and then 19 from 16 since he went to QPR. Over 29 games that ppg would currently leave them safe in 10th on 34 points. And it looks all the more impressive when you look at who they have played over that period. All the current top 10 with the exception of Arsenal and Everton. No wonder they have swotted aside Southampton and Sunderland with relative ease.

You don't have to like Redknapp to accept that the guy is probably in the top 5 best premier league managers in the last 10-15 years or so. Are there 5 other managers would have won a major trophy (so not including the league cup) in that time combined with 5th and 7th place finishes with a minor outfit like West Ham and two 4th places in quite succession with a club that hadn't managed that since the mid 80s? You'll be doing well. I'd say only Ferguson, Moyes and maybe Mourinho have more impressive CVs in the premier league.
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top 5 best managers?!!!
SAF
wenger
jose
moyes
benitez

thats off the top of me head
 
Villa v QPR is massive. If Villa win they have a nice cushion. A QPR win and I think they definitely get out of it
 
Did anyone really think that QPR would go down when Redknapp was appointed? I certainly didn't and still don't. He's a good manager and got a squad of players there that should be at least mid table, they're mostly very good players, just playing with no confidence, that's Harry's forte ! On top of that he got a transfer window in as well and spent about 20m. No way should QPR be going down with that squad.
 
I thought he would save them when he took over. But then they had a lot of draws when wins were needed so by a few weeks ago I thought they were doomed. Now I think its in the balance again. While there is plenty of time to catch Villa or Southampton, both could also go on a good run, as could Wigan given their previous.
 
africanspurs said:
top 5 best managers?!!!
SAF
wenger
jose
moyes
benitez

thats off the top of me head
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I wouldn't have Wenger ahead him for the last 8 years or so anyway. Redknapp has at least won a major trophy in that time with relative minnows and generally done well with less resources. Mourinho a better manager maybe but really that much of a better record in the PL? He managed Chelsea at a time when they were spending very hard. Nothing extraordinary about winning the league in those circumstances. Moyes i agree because of the sheer consistency he had acheived with relative little resources but in fact Redknapp has done much the same over the years, with 4 different clubs, and won a major trophy along the way too. When Moyes does that he'd be well ahead of him.

I thought I'd get a more incisive reply than this. Just coming up with names of guys who've won stuff with big clubs like Chelsea, Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool etc is perhaps something of a compliment to Redknapp.
 
Harry Perkins - what is it about Redknapps career that makes him stand out so much to you?

his best achievement, in my eyes is his second season with us when he pipped City to 4th with a team which included Jenas, Huddelstone, Crouch and Bentley - outside of that it's largely been par for the course really - pay premiership wages in the championship to get Portsmouth promoted and generally finish more or less where they should - have West Ham, with the best crop of youngsters outside of the Scholes/Beckham era, to the Uefa Cup places one season (before quitting the year the better ones left and they looked odds on to be relegated) - hardly the stuff of genius is it :-k

great cup win with Portsmouth tbf but as with any cup run good fortune played a big part (what was their run to the final exactly?)
 
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billyiddo said:
Harry Perkins - what is it about Redknapps career that makes him stand out so much to you?

his best achievement, in my eyes is his second season with us when he pipped City to 4th with a team which included Jenas, Huddelstone, Crouch and Bentley - outside of that it's largely been par for the course really

great cup win with Portsmouth tbf but as with any cup run good fortune played a big part (what was their run to the final exactly?)
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Well they certainly beat Man Utd away on that run! I think what you say used to be true about the FA Cup but not in recent times. Not much luck has been involved. Look at the monopoly the top 4 have had on it! FA Cup winners in the last 15 years anyone? Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Emirates Marketing Project (post takeover, of course) and...Portsmouth under Redknapp! Not bad company to be in! So that is one fairly obvious standout acheivement.

On top of that, he took over Pompey facing the drop to the old 3rd division, avoided that, got promoted (for the first time in how many years?), established them in the top flight, got them into Europe (first time ever?), sacked/left for political reasons and they then collapsed under allan perrin (was is?), came back facing almost certain drop, kept them up and then went on to 9th and 8th place finishes in his last two seasons there. All that... par for the course? Are you sure?

West Ham much the same. A yo-yo club in the period before Redknapp. Finished 5th when the only two of their excellent crop of youngsters to come through at that stage were Lampard and Rio. The rest of the squad was put together on a shoestring: Hislop, Pearce, Ruddock, Di Canio, Foe, Kitson, Lomas, Sinclair, Berkovic, Wright, Minto, Keller, Hartson... a squad that probably cost less than the 16 million we paid for Rebrov and Thatcher around in the same period. Got them back into Europe for the first time in how long? Established them back in the top flight when they'd been up and down how often? Again, not much par for the course about his time there.

Tottenham is well established. Broke the Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man Utd monopoly on the top 4. Only Moyes has done the same but Redknapp then repeated the feat up. So the only managers to finish top 4 twice in the last 15 years, anyone? Mourinho, Mancini (due to bankrolling), Wenger, Ferguson, Bobby Robson (i think?)...? Again, not bad company to be in.

To anyone who looks beyond just the managers who win the major trophies, and you really have to when only a few clubs have won the Fa cup, premier league or European trophies over the last 15 years, Redknapp is right up there. The only reason he did not get a top job before Spurs was because was English and seen as old skool and unfasionable.
 
Forgot to add to the above: English CL quarter finalists since it was started in 1992? The 4 usual suspects... plus Tottenham under Redknapp? The club bankrolled to tune of 1 billion have had two pops at it to date and can't get even get out of the group! LOL.
 
Portsmouth par for the course - yes for sure - they recruited and paid for Premiership level players when they were in the Championship and rightly got promoted and then on to mid table security while the money lasted, it's far too so simplistic to say oh plucky little Portsmouth in the Premiership what an achievement. . . if you actually look at it they were where the money they spent dictated they'd be.

similar scenario at Spurs - took a fairly strong yet unbalanced squad of players playing well below themselves - added 50 million net + worth of transfers over two windows and people think finishing 4th is some incredible unimaginable feat, it was good but not quite the success it was made out to be.

West Ham, as i said had a great core of youth players come through and done well adding to that, similar to Spurs really - provided with the real quality of a side and added the more menial players to balance it all out - once the more talented players moved on West Ham suffered and he left part way through the season it looked like they were to be relegated i believe

i think Redknapp is the type of manager who will solve a problem by buying better players rather than getting more out of what he has got, which if it brings success and is sustainable is fair enough but i have a lot more respect for managers which work to make their teams better than the sum of their parts, of which there are many to choose from id imagine


(overly harsh on his time at Spurs there tbf - it was a good performance from him overall but i don't think that we finished any higher than we should have really in that period)
 
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they recruited and paid for Premiership level players when they were in the Championship and rightly got promoted and then on to mid table security while the money lasted, it's far too so simplistic to say oh plucky little Portsmouth in the Premiership what an achievement. . . if you actually look at it they were where the money they spent dictated they'd
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Not sure this follows really. Here is their promotion winning squad:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002%E2%80%9303_Portsmouth_F.C._season#section_5 only about 6 or 7 ex-premiership and 3 of those had been there when they'd finished 17th the previous season. Sure they spent enough to be challenging minimum but he won it by a good margin.

West Ham, as i said had a great core of youth players come through and done well adding to that, similar to Spurs really - provided with the real quality of a side and added the more menial players to balance it all out
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With respect, this is West Ham we're talking about here. No one signs world beaters regularly at clubs like this. The likes of di canio, sinclair, lomas and the others listed were more than good value for a club like west ham. It is daft to say they managed 5th on the basis of the still raw rio and lampard and then 'menial' players.
 
onlyme said:
QPR need 3 wins just to get more than 30 points. They and Reading are doomed.
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This neglects that 17th and safety could be a relatively low total. Perhaps 36 points maximum, depending on the results between the teams involved down there. QPR are currently 4 points behind the team they play next week with better goal difference. It is more or less turning into a 6 team mini-league seperated by 7 points with the top 3 staying up. QPR are the form team of the group and probably have the easiest run-in but the road is running out. I reckon they'll be involved until the last day minimum, probably needing results elsewhere to go for them.
 
Harry_Perkins said:
This neglects that 17th and safety could be a relatively low total. Perhaps 36 points maximum, depending on the results between the teams involved down there. QPR are currently 4 points behind the team they play next week with better goal difference. It is more or less turning into a 6 team mini-league seperated by 7 points with the top 3 staying up. QPR are the form team of the group and probably have the easiest run-in but the road is running out. I reckon they'll be involved until the last day minimum, probably needing results elsewhere to go for them.
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Interestingly Liverpool have to play 4 of those 6 in the remaining games. Sometimes it can work against you having to play the bottom teams in the latter stages.

I know we have to play Stoke and Swansea away which are tough games, but visits to Southampton and Villa at this stage of the season, for me, are equally as tough
 
Harry_Perkins said:
Relegated once with Southampton that I can recall? Nowhere near with anyone else. The QPR turnaround is something else. If he pulls it off, possibly a greater escape than the one with Pompey when he went back there and certainly with us (although the real impressive feat there was nearly getting us into Europe from that position but that is another discussion).

4 points from the first 13 and then 19 from 16 since he went to QPR. Over 29 games that ppg would currently leave them safe in 10th on 34 points. And it looks all the more impressive when you look at who they have played over that period. All the current top 10 with the exception of Arsenal and Everton. No wonder they have swotted aside Southampton and Sunderland with relative ease.

You don't have to like Redknapp to accept that the guy is probably in the top 5 best premier league managers in the last 10-15 years or so. Are there 5 other managers would have won a major trophy (so not including the league cup) in that time combined with 5th and 7th place finishes with a minor outfit like West Ham and two 4th places in quite succession with a club that hadn't managed that since the mid 80s? You'll be doing well. I'd say only Ferguson, Moyes and maybe Mourinho have more impressive CVs in the premier league.
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He took Bournmouth down as well, just need to do your homework.
 
parklane1 said:
He took Bournmouth down as well, just need to do your homework.
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Having got them promoted in the first place. Hardly a major blot on the copybook. Which leaves Southampton who were already in deep trouble when he went there. Every other club was left in a stronger position.
 
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Harry_Perkins said:
Having got them promoted in the first place. Hardly a major blot on the copybook. Which leaves Southampton who were already in deep trouble when he went there. Every other club was left in a stronger position.
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So i guess it does not count then :ross:
 
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