Rathering intereting news story i thought some of you should read

[Baleforce]

i'm not saying you should, i'm saying its a choice, but it seems to me like most english people don't realise this and see it as a one way door

 

[scaramanga]

Yep,good thinking,because for capitalism to flourish some level of unemployment is not required or anything is it ? You right wing ****er.

Not really, no - that's just an unsubstantiated rumour made up by pinko hippies with nothing better to do with their time.

A steady flow of immigration will do instead of unemployment just fine if you're after a downward force on unskilled labour costs.

 

[monkeybarry]

I'm married to a non eu migrant and know a hell of a lot more.
One thing I can tell yu is that is certainly not a free ride in the UK and of all the non eu migrants I know, I would hire most of them over brits in a heartbeat

I also consider them to embrace UK culture far more than the.lazy, ignorant, self righteous brits.

 

[monkeybarry]

But is this really true? I have had opportunities to go abroad and work, but for family reasons haven't wanted to... being close to elderly parents in law is important to me... why should I have to leave the country to get away from the place I call home? Emigration is not an option for me and should be a worry to the rest of the UK if more people like me do see it as an option.
I pay a lot of tax into this country's coffers, I have never claimed dole, I have never claimed a benefit... about 50% of my income goes in tax and national insurance. If more people like me leave, then there'll be a damn sight less tax take in this country to support the benefits culture 'rights movement' that has emerged in the UK in the last 20 years.
Like JGL I feel I have a right to question whether the impact of the EU and benefit tourism is good for UK PLC... my feeling is that on the whole it sucks... and, on the whole the Biased Broadcasting Company do not tell the masses 'news' that does not fit with their broadly socialist agenda.

So yes, the option is there. It's choice that means you have not left.

 

[THFC]

So yes, the option is there. It's choice that means you have not left.

I think asking people to go against the very intrinsic nature that is their very being as a solution to facilitate those perceived to be benefit tourists amongst other things will, and should never be an option.

 

[THFC]

Basically it should never come to the head of 'well just leave' as a solution because that is not solving any of the scandal that is the current situation.

 

[Craig_J]

Doesn't bother me whether this article is right. If it wasn't for foreign migrants coming here the NHS would pretty much be dead anyway.

And I doubt these numbers are true. I don't think I've met any unemployed foreign migrants at all. In fact all the polish, lithuanian and pakistani kids at my school either went into further education or STRAIGHT (in every sense of the word) into work whilst many of the British kids don't want a job. Perhaps also unsurpisngly these British kids who don't want a job and have never had one (or had one and gave it up 2 weeks later) are usually the more racist one's who complain about foreigners being here!

 

[monkeybarry]

I think asking people to go against the very intrinsic nature that is their very being as a solution to facilitate those perceived to be benefit tourists amongst other things will, and should never be an option.

Totally valid point , i think I have just reached the point where I am fed up with how stagnant uk life is, and that is down to an overflated and propped up housing market and bailed out banks.

Add a generation of Brits that have an entitlement culture and lash out at anyone that comes and tries to make a life here, moving is a good option.

Granted none of that related to the original post.

Got a bit ranty there!

 

[THFC]

Totally valid point , i think I have just reached the point where I am fed up with how stagnant uk life is, and that is down to an overflated and propped up housing market and bailed out banks.

Add a generation of Brits that have an entitlement culture and lash out at anyone that comes and tries to make a life here, moving is a good option.

Granted none of that related to the original post.

Got a bit ranty there!

I agree, it has come to that point and I think it is a major failing when so many things have been allowed to get out of control by wishy washy politics

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Totally valid point , i think I have just reached the point where I am fed up with how stagnant uk life is, and that is down to an overflated and propped up housing market and bailed out banks.

Add a generation of Brits that have an entitlement culture and lash out at anyone that comes and tries to make a life here, moving is a good option.

Granted none of that related to the original post.

Got a bit ranty there!

I agree with you actually. The is a danger that people think i care only about the lies we were told about immigration. For me the lack of reform in the pension system is the biggest problem with this country. Non of the parties including UKIP are going to do anything about it because they want the people reaching retirement ages vote.

The EU is the second biggest problem and is just strangling the country and how i think most people on this site would like to live.

The point you make about lazy brits is valid in my opinon, im very good friends with a number of latvians and have links with that country now. They are hard working good honest people, whether the true cost of them being here once you take in the added pressure on housing schools etc is as good as the left make out i have very large doubts.

Also one huge problem for this country is a biased t.v. company who only report what its directors(usually failed labour MP's) want it to report. The BBC a £180 tax that we really should not have to pay.

 

[Hootnow]

Have to say, I had a higher opinion of the DT than to believe they would print sensationalist ******** like that.

And I never realised just how racist the people who comment on Telegraph stories really are. :lol: Are a large number of British people like this but these people finally feel able to unleash their hatred behind the anonymity of a screen?

 

[Hootnow]

Interestingly, when Full fact asked for the data from the department of health, to try to clarify whether or not non-UK national use is a major problem or not, their request was denied. Their subsequent internal report regarding the costs of treating non-UK nationals was £100 million or so.

I don't trust either number because, frankly, the data isn't there. Which rather brings us to the question of where these claims on all sides are coming from, often with such confidence, regarding health tourism?

The discourse surrounding the EU has become incredibly one sided in this country, around an issue that I personally think is very complicated and which has many advantages and disadvantages. I'm almost rather eager to see us leave the EU and perhaps for the EU to disband like some want so that we can see the great effect this will have on our economy and that of Europe.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

The discourse surrounding the EU has become incredibly one sided in this country, around an issue that I personally think is very complicated and which has many advantages and disadvantages. I'm almost rather eager to see us leave the EU and perhaps for the EU to disband like some want so that we can see the great effect this will have on our economy and that of Europe.

Well Europe over the next decade is going to struggle anyway and us being in the EU is not going to change anything except maybe giving more money in bail outs to Greece and Ireland. The last 1 billion goes to Ireland this year of the 5 billion we promised them, would rather it stayed in the country and went to paying down our debt or building hospitals.

We need to look beyond Europe we as a country are at our best when we engage with the world and not act like little englanders and get stuck in a small little area of the world like europe.

 

[Hootnow]

We still do 50% of our trade or so with the EU I believe and multiple business leaders from across the world have fired off warning shots regarding the impact of us leaving the EU and what it means for their thoughts regarding staying in the UK. This is still a huge trading block, with around 20% of the world's GDP and 4 of the world's top 10 economies by GDP. The decisions it makes if it stays together will inevitably end up affecting the British economy.

I agree we should always be looking beyond Europe and looking to do trade with the rest of the world, especially the growing Eastern economies. However, let's not pretend that at the very least a sizeable minority of those who want us to leave Europe (and I certainly do not class you in this category) are the very definition of Little Englanders?

 

[Craig_J]

But is this really true? I have had opportunities to go abroad and work, but for family reasons haven't wanted to... being close to elderly parents in law is important to me... why should I have to leave the country to get away from the place I call home? Emigration is not an option for me and should be a worry to the rest of the UK if more people like me do see it as an option.
I pay a lot of tax into this country's coffers, I have never claimed dole, I have never claimed a benefit... about 50% of my income goes in tax and national insurance. If more people like me leave, then there'll be a damn sight less tax take in this country to support the benefits culture 'rights movement' that has emerged in the UK in the last 20 years.
Like JGL I feel I have a right to question whether the impact of the EU and benefit tourism is good for UK PLC... my feeling is that on the whole it sucks... and, on the whole the Biased Broadcasting Company do not tell the masses 'news' that does not fit with their broadly socialist agenda.

What about families in Poland and other EU countries? Have you ever looked into how much they earn back home? They can work 50 hours a week at 2.50 an hour and take home 125 pound a week, as the lady who lives in my block of flats used to do a cleaner. Here she works the same ammount of hours, doing the same job. She takes home 309 pound a week. The company she works for are delighted, no one else wanted the job till she came along!

Polish people, and in many other eastern european countries are used to working long hours. They're also used to being poor. That's why when they come to the UK they are grateful for the money they earn, why they're harder workers than in the UK. In Poland they expect you to work hard for so little. That's why they're hard workers who aren't afraid to take long hours. They're just grateful that they've gone from so little so much!

Like I said in my earlier post, I'm a British lad. I turned 20 no long ago. Quite a few of the people from my school are now on benefits, a few have realised that's not the way to go, but still many have no urge to work what so ever. This is British kids. All of the eastern european kids at school, and pakistani kid as well, have gone STRAIGHT into work without a moments hesitation, or are studying to become a carpenter, bricklayer, painter and decorater, electican, chef, gone to university etc...

Also, if you want the best way to find out about sociological things is to conduct the research yourself. My town has a very high Polish population and when I was doing A levels what I noticed is that if you went down the pub on a weekday between 10am and 3pm guess what language everyone was speaking? ENGLISH. And guess what accent this was? BRITISH. Not just one day, but every day between the same sort of hours. You could hear them talking about their dole money, complaning about the government making them do vountary work. It was laughable!

Yeah I'm proud to be British and I want out Britain as it is. I want a load of scrounging lazy people (who are usually 40+) and I want them to carry on raising more British kids who aren't interested at all in finding a job!!!

No, I don't want a load of eastern europeans coming over here with their high work effort, arriving on time, working long hours, putting elbow grease in and then being grateful for the fact they've got a stable job with a decent wage. Why would I want that?! Now I'm off to read the Daily Mail and, all kinds of Murdoch run tosh and take in all of these (and this is being polite) extremley weak and clearly manipulated statistics, take it in and then get in a panic about the "welfare tourists" in this country, not from my own experience, but because that's what I paid the papers to make me think!

 

[inkpenspur]

What about families in Poland and other EU countries? Have you ever looked into how much they earn back home? They can work 50 hours a week at 2.50 an hour and take home 125 pound a week, as the lady who lives in my block of flats used to do a cleaner. Here she works the same ammount of hours, doing the same job. She takes home 309 pound a week. The company she works for are delighted, no one else wanted the job till she came along!

Polish people, and in many other eastern european countries are used to working long hours. They're also used to being poor. That's why when they come to the UK they are grateful for the money they earn, why they're harder workers than in the UK. In Poland they expect you to work hard for so little. That's why they're hard workers who aren't afraid to take long hours. They're just grateful that they've gone from so little so much!

Like I said in my earlier post, I'm a British lad. I turned 20 no long ago. Quite a few of the people from my school are now on benefits, a few have realised that's not the way to go, but still many have no urge to work what so ever. This is British kids. All of the eastern european kids at school, and pakistani kid as well, have gone STRAIGHT into work without a moments hesitation, or are studying to become a carpenter, bricklayer, painter and decorater, electican, chef, gone to university etc...

Also, if you want the best way to find out about sociological things is to conduct the research yourself. My town has a very high Polish population and when I was doing A levels what I noticed is that if you went down the pub on a weekday between 10am and 3pm guess what language everyone was speaking? ENGLISH. And guess what accent this was? BRITISH. Not just one day, but every day between the same sort of hours. You could hear them talking about their dole money, complaning about the government making them do vountary work. It was laughable!

Yeah I'm proud to be British and I want out Britain as it is. I want a load of scrounging lazy people (who are usually 40+) and I want them to carry on raising more British kids who aren't interested at all in finding a job!!!

No, I don't want a load of eastern europeans coming over here with their high work effort, arriving on time, working long hours, putting elbow grease in and then being grateful for the fact they've got a stable job with a decent wage. Why would I want that?! Now I'm off to read the Daily Mail and, all kinds of Murdoch run tosh and take in all of these (and this is being polite) extremley weak and clearly manipulated statistics, take it in and then get in a panic about the "welfare tourists" in this country, not from my own experience, but because that's what I paid the papers to make me think!

I'm not really sure how this relates to the post I made? I was simply pointing out that emigration for me personally was not an option. Emigration is a bit of a sieve... it tends to appeal to those in a country who are looking to better themselves and to seek a better life for their families than the country they currently reside in. So those who come here from Poland (with which I have zero issue at all) tend to be the brighter, more able Poles who then work bloody hard over here, pay taxes and contribute their share. Good luck to them. As a result of history, there is a huge Irish and Scottish diaspora around the globe where in centuries past, the Irish and Scots left their homelands to seek a better life overseas, heading off for the US, Australia, Canada and so on... much as the Poles are doing now. But you survive in your new host country by hard graft and determination.

It appears to me that the adventurous, pioneering spirit has been lost from the 'native' young of the UK... and they are quite happy to sit around waiting for benefits to be given to them as a right. Sorry, benefits are earned, they should not be an expectation or a right.

I base my view on the world from a vast number of resources, and personal experience as I got off my **** and travelled in the late 80's when there were also bugger all jobs around and gained experience overseas, but I always wanted to return to the land of my birth and my family (and Spurs). Any paper, whether the Times, the Sun, the Mail of the Guardian have an angle that they spin, that is their editorial right, and as a reader I am sure you can see this. My beef with the BBC is that they are meant to be impartial, favouring neither one political party over another. I have simply come to the conclusion that they are now a partial organisation, burying viewpoints that do not tow the party line...

 

[clownfoot]

Surprise surprise, the Tory party are focusing on immigration, and portraying hard working people as the enemy. It is a fundamental bi-product of capitalism that the poor will go wherever there is money to be made. How could anyone resent a person trying to better their lives? Oh wait, the main aim of the Conservatives is to keep the rich wealthy as the poor deserve to be poor.

Do people not remember the campaigns that this party have ran in the past?

http://cameron-cloggysmoralcompass.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/is-british-conservative-party.html

Institutionalised racism, but in 2013 it is cleverly masked by layer upon layer of media friendly language.

I work for the NHS, what do people think is a bigger threat to the NHS? Immigration or the slow, underhand way that it is being auctioned of to private companies?

 

[scaramanga]

Surprise surprise, the Tory party are focusing on immigration, and portraying hard working people as the enemy. It is a fundamental bi-product of capitalism that the poor will go wherever there is money to be made. How could anyone resent a person trying to better their lives? Oh wait, the main aim of the Conservatives is to keep the rich wealthy as the poor deserve to be poor.

Do people not remember the campaigns that this party have ran in the past?

http://cameron-cloggysmoralcompass.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/is-british-conservative-party.html

Institutionalised racism, but in 2013 it is cleverly masked by layer upon layer of media friendly language.

I work for the NHS, what do people think is a bigger threat to the NHS? Immigration or the slow, underhand way that it is being auctioned of to private companies?

I think the biggest threat is the lack of competition leading to huge bloating and inefficiency.

I agree that selling the NHS off slowly and underhand is a bad idea, the quicker it's done the better for all of us.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

We still do 50% of our trade or so with the EU I believe and multiple business leaders from across the world have fired off warning shots regarding the impact of us leaving the EU and what it means for their thoughts regarding staying in the UK. This is still a huge trading block, with around 20% of the world's GDP and 4 of the world's top 10 economies by GDP. The decisions it makes if it stays together will inevitably end up affecting the British economy.

I agree we should always be looking beyond Europe and looking to do trade with the rest of the world, especially the growing Eastern economies. However, let's not pretend that at the very least a sizeable minority of those who want us to leave Europe (and I certainly do not class you in this category) are the very definition of Little Englanders?

Do we really do 50% of our trade with Europe are you sure on that. Because you know if you sell for example to New Zealand and ship goods to there but the container ship they are on stops in Europe say Rotterdam first then those goods you sold to New Zealand actually count as being sold in Europe because they stopped at a port in Europe. I am actually quite up to speed on this as i have had similar dealings myself in the last 2 months.

Also though a fair share of our trade comes from within the EU we have trade agreements with most EU countries just like the EU did with America recently, something we already had. To break any of these trade agreements would break International law and also be stupid because they trade at a deficit with us, they need us more then we need them.

If only the pro EU lot could take off their little englander hats and see that we do not need to be tied to the EU and the are other countries that seem to manage it well without being stuck to outdated working practices and ever increasing demented proposals such as the amount of time off a father can have when his missus has a baby. I do not know anyone running a small business who would employ a woman of child bearing years.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Surprise surprise, the Tory party are focusing on immigration, and portraying hard working people as the enemy. It is a fundamental bi-product of capitalism that the poor will go wherever there is money to be made. How could anyone resent a person trying to better their lives? Oh wait, the main aim of the Conservatives is to keep the rich wealthy as the poor deserve to be poor.

Do people not remember the campaigns that this party have ran in the past?

http://cameron-cloggysmoralcompass.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/is-british-conservative-party.html

Institutionalised racism, but in 2013 it is cleverly masked by layer upon layer of media friendly language.

I work for the NHS, what do people think is a bigger threat to the NHS? Immigration or the slow, underhand way that it is being auctioned of to private companies?

The biggest threat to the NHS is labour getting back in and finishing the job it started and sending us completely over the edge. The sooner the NHS is replaced by a private health service the better.

Do you honestly think the NHS was any good under the 13 years of Labour? i do not think it is much better now and im not defending the tories because i am not one. Honestly the amount of bad things that were going wrong with the NHS and labour knew about it. Do not have time to post all the links to the stories tonight, but im sure you aware of them. Not sure how anyone can defend the NHS.

The NHS might be safer in Labours hand then the tories but when labour had control of the ship the ship was sinking, that had nothing to do with immigration. But mass immigration and what it really costs this country is just another way of how the left and socialists have no idea how to handle money.