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Politics, politics, politics

The EU is "ready to improve" its offer on the Irish border, Michel Barnier has said as he warned the "moment of truth" was nearing for Brexit negotiations.

The UK and EU both want to avoid a hard border - meaning any physical infrastructure like cameras or guard posts - but can't agree on how.

The EU's negotiator has now shifted his tone, saying he is ready to offer new proposals to help break the deadlock.

It comes as Theresa May tries to win support for her plans from EU leaders.

The UK prime minister will use a dinner in Salzburg on Wednesday to sell her strategy - the so-called Chequers plan - for future co-operation with the EU to the bloc's 27 other leaders.

Why is the Irish border an issue?
After Brexit, the 310 mile border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland will become the UK's border with the EU.

At the moment, thousands of people cross it every day for both work and pleasure - as do goods, like food and medicines, being delivered across the two countries.

As part of the EU single market and customs union, these products do not need to be checked for customs and standards, but when the UK leaves these two arrangements, this all changes.

Nobody wants a hard border for the checks - in fact the 1998 Good Friday agreement, which helped bring peace to Northern Ireland, got rid of security checks as part of the deal, and police in Northern Ireland have warned reinstating them could make crossings targets for violence.

But there is no agreement between the UK and EU, or between Leavers and Remainers, about the answer.

Privately, EU officials say those checks could be carried out by British or EU officials, or by health inspectors rather than customs officials, to "de-dramatise" the border issue.

Mrs May has insisted there needs to be "friction-free movement of goods", with no customs or regulatory checks, between Northern Ireland and the Republic, in order to avoid a hard border there.

Six months to go
There are just over six months to go before the UK is due to leave the EU on 29 March 2019.

Negotiations are at a critical stage, with both sides hoping for an agreement on the terms of the UK's withdrawal and future trade relations by the start of November at the latest.

Speaking on Tuesday, Mr Barnier said the talks were in the "home straight" but there were still significant areas of disagreement - such as on the role of the European Court of Justice in enforcing the withdrawal agreement and intellectual property issues, including geographical protections for food and drink.

"October is the key point in time - it is the moment of truth," he added.

Has the EU shifted position on Ireland?
That remains to be seen although the tone certainly seems to have changed.

The BBC's Europe Editor, Katya Adler, said Mr Barnier's comments could be interpreted as a "concerted effort" by EU leaders to try and help Mrs May ahead of Wednesday's talks, but they will still not be "compromising their principles or red lines".

The EU is still insisting on its own "legally operationally backstop" - what it describes as an insurance policy to prevent the return of physical infrastructure on the border in the event no other solution can be found.

Brussels put forward a proposal in February that would see Northern Ireland stay aligned with the EU in key areas, effectively staying in the customs union and single market and not needing those border checks.

But the UK insisted this was unacceptable as it would split Northern Ireland off from the rest of the UK.

Mr Barnier is now saying that the backstop should focus on a "set of technical checks and controls" to make sure standards are met and customs are paid, and not be about a sea or land border.

BBC Northern Ireland business editor John Campbell said that the fact the EU was prepared to "improve" the language of the backstop was not news as it had been talked about before - so "we need to wait and see what any improvements might amount to".

How is the UK likely to respond?
The UK put forward rival backstop proposals in June, which would see the whole of the UK staying in a customs union with the EU after the end of the proposed Brexit transition period in December 2020.

Mr Barnier's latest comments are likely to be welcomed by Tory Brexiteers, who don't like the idea of a backstop and believe that a solution can be found by using "established" technology and "modifying" existing customs arrangements.

However, Mr Barnier still refers to additional physical checks being necessary.

This still apparently leaves him at odds with Mrs May, who has warned that any system of physical checks, even if done remotely, would constitute a border,

Can deal be done in time?

The UK is hopeful of progress at the two-day gathering in Salzburg - which is an informal meeting to discuss migration and other challenges facing the EU rather than a formal summit.

Unconfirmed reports have suggested key figures such as Germany's Angela Merkel and France's Emmanuel Macron are keen to reach some form of agreement that can be signed off at an one-off summit in November.
 
Preferable to people like Gove who offer to sign a legal agreement on the basis that they plan to weasel out as soon as it's politically expedient to do so.

To be fair to Gove what he said made sense. How you can have an agreement on a situation and expect it to stay the same for ever more. Hell the EU don't do that.

I personally think we should have already been ignoring some of the EU rules just like France and Germany do.

So what if we sign trade deals with non EU countries boohoo. We're only looking after ourselves which is what ever proper modern country should do.
 
To be fair to Gove what he said made sense. How you can have an agreement on a situation and expect it to stay the same for ever more. Hell the EU don't do that.

I personally think we should have already been ignoring some of the EU rules just like France and Germany do.

So what if we sign trade deals with non EU countries boohoo. I'm a only looking after ourselves which is what ever proper modern country should do.

we do ignore a lot of EU rules - off the top of my head the clean air rules. I think its true that we take more care over what we sign up to as we intend to follow to the letter but we do ignore a fair few ourselves.

On the second point you think we should have had our own trade deals while in the EU and using the fact others break other rules to justify? it's a false equivalence... I know I stabbed that guy but Frenchie didn't pay his library fine.
 
To be fair to Gove what he said made sense. How you can have an agreement on a situation and expect it to stay the same for ever more. Hell the EU don't do that.

I personally think we should have already been ignoring some of the EU rules just like France and Germany do.

So what if we sign trade deals with non EU countries boohoo. I'm a only looking after ourselves which is what ever proper modern country should do.
I know.
It's almost as if negotiating and signing lots of new deals is really complicated and are influenced by the deals already negotiated elsewhere
 
I said a year ago we would not be leaving the EU, project fear, an elite that dont care for the views of the real people. It will not happen.

But what will happen to Europe over the coming decades will be traced back to this point when democracy died.
 
I said a year ago we would not be leaving the EU, project fear, an elite that dont care for the views of the real people. It will not happen.

But what will happen to Europe over the coming decades will be traced back to this point when democracy died.

Seems like we are leaving. What is going to stop that happening? As things stand, we are on course for a Hard Brexit.
 
I think a Norway deal is a disaster. Even if it does stop the free movement of people.

We will have positioned ourselves as subservient to the EU, which to them is a ridiculous boost.

People like to play it down, but we are a massive asset to the EU, and we will have just given them the keys and told them to drive, we will just be in the back seat.

I would much rather a hard brexit, and whatever follows, than that.

Do you own a home? Or know people working in banking or areas that export goods or services to the EU? Or for that matter, do you use the NHS or care about people who use state education? A Hard Brexit would have an impact on the value of housing in the UK imo, it would cause the pound to fall (with all imports being more expensive including imported food if it flows through the new customs). The UK would lose some, possibly lots, of jobs, and the Exchequer would have less to spend on services for us, while having to spend fresh money on new customs arrangements, and new trade and regulatory departments to deal with the UKs new setup. And at the end of it, our 50m consumers would still be behest to US or EU regulations as we are too small to set trading standards that the world will follow. Only China has the potential to crash that party. If Norway is a "disaster" how would you describe a scenario where everyone in the UK is poorer, there are less jobs and public services sufer?

This has been the folly of Brexit from the start. Soft Brexit leaves no one happy, and Hard Brexit is a position effectively imposed on Leavers (despite their bold claims/lies of us dictating terms pre-vote). HB is actually the disastrous scenario for the UK. Yet people stoically continue trying to do the wrong thing - leave the EU - 'righter'.
 
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Poorer but happier suits me. I'd take a 5% or 10% drop in salary or house price in exchange for a more planned economy and a stable/slightly shrinking population
would you take a 5 -10% drop in salary in exchange for a reduction on workers rights, reduction on environmental rights and an increase in Multinationals power? Without the handbrake of the EU we will head towards the US way of things (this is the way we have been heading for decades)
 
would you take a 5 -10% drop in salary in exchange for a reduction on workers rights, reduction on environmental rights and an increase in Multinationals power? Without the handbrake of the EU we will head towards the US way of things (this is the way we have been heading for decades)

This line of thinking doesnt really make sense to me.

I do understand it would be very typical of the Tories to do exactly that, but then we would vote in a party that opposes these methods, wouldnt we?

Labour would be up against that sort of practice straight away.

Its not like the EU is the only thing stopping the evil government from abusing us, the whole point of democracy is we can change the things we dont like.
 
UKIP aiming to be 'radical, populist' party
  • 5 hours ago
UKIP should become a "radical, populist party" standing up for free speech against the "politically-correct thought police", says its leader.

Its "interim manifesto", unveiled on the eve of its conference, also urges a "clean exit" from the EU.

Leader Gerard Batten said the policies unveiled aimed to help "the people who form the backbone of Britain".

He is the fourth person to lead UKIP since Nigel Farage quit in the wake of the 2016 EU Referendum.

The party has also suffered a funding crisis and was saved from insolvency by public donations.

Under Mr Batten's leadership, membership has increased from a low of around 18,000 to approximately 24,000, according to UKIP, but critics have accused the party of becoming too right-wing.

BBC political correspondent Alex Forsyth said UKIP has allowed controversial online video bloggers to join and is considering whether to allow the former EDL leader Tommy Robinson to become a member.

Its interim manifesto includes sections on free speech, political correctness and Islamic extremism, as well as the NHS, defence, education and policing among others.

It urges a "complete and total withdrawal from the European Union", and says UKIP will keep fighting to make the UK an "independent, self-governing, sovereign state", regardless of any Brexit deal reached.

In it, Mr Batten says UKIP will "promote and defend our national and individual freedoms" adding: "We are determined to protect our freedom of speech and the right to speak our minds without fear of the politically correct thought-police knocking on our doors."

The manifesto covers a wide range of policy areas, from the NHS and transport to fisheries and small businesses, with policies including:

  • A limited points-based immigration system
  • NHS health cards for British citizens to prevent 'health tourism' & free parking at hospitals
  • An extra £2bn a year for adult social care & £500m a year for mental health
  • Abolition of stamp duty and inheritance tax
  • Introduction of new grammar schools
  • Scrapping the overseas aid budget
  • Scrapping guidelines on 'subjective' hate crimes
  • Scrapping the climate change act, stopping subsidies for wind turbines and solar voltaic arrays and seeking to rejuvenate the UK's coal industry
  • Scrapping the BBC licence fee in favour of voluntary subscription
  • Repealing hate speech guidelines, the Equality Act 2010 & shutting down the Equalities and Human Rights Commission
Mr Batten is due to address party members on Friday morning when the UKIP conference opens in Birmingham, as the party celebrates its 25th anniversary.

Unveiling its "interim manifesto", which he said would be "built on in the months and years to come", Mr Batten said: "These policies are aimed at helping the people who form the backbone of Britain: ordinary workers and taxpayers, the unemployed who would like to work, and small and medium-sized business owners.

"Its purpose is to make UKIP a populist party in the real meaning of the word - one whose policies are popular with voters."

UKIP saw its popularity collapse in the 2017 election after securing only 594,068 votes - down from 3,881,099 in 2015.

The party leadership has changed hands six times since the 2016 EU referendum, with Mr Farage returning temporarily when his successor Diane James quit after less than a month at the helm.

Paul Nuttall succeeded her in November 2016 but quit following the 2017 general election - and Steve Crowther became acting leader.

Henry Bolton was elected leader in September 2017 but was ousted following controversy over racist messages sent by his partner.

Mr Batten took over in February but has said he intends to resign after a year.
 
Brexit: What's behind Donald Tusk's Instagram diplomacy?
By Joey D'Urso and Larissa KennellyBBC News
  • 6 minutes ago
_103524791_tusk.png

Donald Tusk rejected Theresa May's Brexit proposals at an EU summit this week and posted on his Instagram story shortly afterwards.

"A piece of cake, perhaps?," said the head of the European Council, alongside a picture of him and May at the summit in Austria. "Sorry, no cherries."

This provocative post was Tusk's idea and is part of a wider strategy to appeal to young people via the app, an EU source has told the BBC.



What the fudge is wrong with him?
 
This line of thinking doesnt really make sense to me.

I do understand it would be very typical of the Tories to do exactly that, but then we would vote in a party that opposes these methods, wouldnt we?

Labour would be up against that sort of practice straight away.

Its not like the EU is the only thing stopping the evil government from abusing us, the whole point of democracy is we can change the things we dont like.

I don't think we will oppose these methods, I am basing this on the past 30 years with a move away from a mixed economy and towards free market and zero hour contracts etc. I am not saying this move is undemocratic but moving further towards the US is far more likely than GB vision of Brexit. Why are we moving this way? My opinion is FFP doesn't represent the will of the people very well (right wing partys get around 40% of the votes and get in power vs 60% center left - pulled the numbers out of my ass but its around these levels), short term thinking of the average person and the popular press is largely neo con.

I think the EU has acted as a handbreak and having a supranational body with the power to enforce us to carry out commitments we make is a positive of the EU, these are commitments we make so it is democratic. A big problem with governments is the short term overrides long term (they need to be elected) in the UK especially this is the case. Things like clean beaches we agreed that we wanted but when it came at a cost we allowed pollution to continue, signing up to this commitment with the EU put a cost to not enforcing this and we were then held accountable.
 
My genuine hope is that through Brexit people will be much more engaged, and therefore Politicians will need to be much more in line with this. They will need to have proper policies, and deliver, or else...

Instead of the politics of today where its all just spin.

UKIP, above, are already trying to grab the nettle on this sort of thing. I dont agree with all of their policies (of course!) but I do like the fact they are putting things out there they believe in.

Id like to see more of this from all of them. Give us something to vote for.
 
My genuine hope is that through Brexit people will be much more engaged, and therefore Politicians will need to be much more in line with this. They will need to have proper policies, and deliver, or else...

Instead of the politics of today where its all just spin.

UKIP, above, are already trying to grab the nettle on this sort of thing. I dont agree with all of their policies (of course!) but I do like the fact they are putting things out there they believe in.

Id like to see more of this from all of them. Give us something to vote for.

Do you honestly think anything will change? Why will people suddenly engage more? It’s not like the EU have been running much in the UK and there will be a sudden change as there was say in South Africa when democracy was opened up to all. Will be same old, but poorer with less to spend on UK infrastructure and public services.


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