And she believes that Tommy Robinson’s protest marches are not hate fuelled.
She is abominable.
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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)
- Thread starter SpurMeUp
- Start date
She is abominable.
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
I think she is very impressive there.
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Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
You made a claim that you read a post on here that said “everyone on benefits were taking advantage of the system”.
I don’t think it happened. I suspect that there were more likely posts on here that suggested some on benefits were taking advantage of the system.
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
There 100% needs to be a wider4 conversation about hate in this country.
The Golders Green stabbings is indicative of whats been happening in the country over 10 years. Synagogues, Churches, Mosques, communities of all kinds are being attacked.
My hope is that politicians stop targeting sides in hope to attracting their favour and go after the universal hatred thats brimming.
The reticence to call out bigotry wherever it exists stuns me
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
No I said it was suggested, I didn't make a direct quote and it has been suggested on here, plenty of times and made in broad terms and not specifics. The same when people moaned about free meals for kids, been plenty of why should I when others get free generalisation.
People have made broad comments and claims about Muslims and immigrants without specifics and specifying. @LutonSpurs not that he needs me to defend or highlight is has been racial abused and had major assumptions laid at his door for being a Muslim, plenty said about Pakisatanis in the same conversation.
Lets get rid of all immigrants and replace with British workers was another major claim on here, self soothing was the claim, I think that Bat or Rat fella copped a ban, but I don't think he was making much of an effort to be specific about "some"
With all due respect mate, if you don't think people have made wide and generic claims about people in society they don't rate on this forum over the last 10 years or so you haven't been paying as much attention as you maybe think you have.
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johnola
Dean Richards
Well fairer to those inside the edifice and intolerant of those that choose not to be. It’s worked for the vast majority of their population. My mates families lives in rural China have been utterly transformed since he moved to the U.K. twenty five years ago. The infrastructure is incredible.
They don’t get bogged down in personality politics they get on with what they beleive needs to be done.
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
I don’t think it has. I think you’ve made it up.
The other things you said may well have happened. and that happening to @LutonSpurs is abhorrent and I hope the person that did that was dealt with appropriately, but that has nothing to do with the other point you made. I suspect you’re reaching for those other things because you know that nobody had actually suggested that everyone on benefits was taking advantage of the system as you originally claimed
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
Not made up at all, been plenty of extreme views on here and I am making the wider point that people have made and continue to make wider and sweeping statements about all kinds of things without being specific.
Out of interest if your critical eye is sharp about what's said on this forum, why not step in and comment on bullying when the racism was flying in the direction of a long time poster? Is it a case that maybe you dont see everything on here OR you didnt fancy it?
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Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
There probably have been extreme views, I don’t doubt it, I don’t tend to visit the cheese room forum often for that very reason (for example I found out yesterday that I’m part of the parasite class
)If I’d seen racism in any thread that I read then I absolutely would’ve stepped in. Though, saying that I’ve seen a bit of bullying on Silly in this thread these past couple of days and haven’t stepped in so maybe I need to do better?) I just don’t believe that somebody commented that everyone on benefits was taking advantage of the system as you claimed that’s all.
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Robspur12
Johnny Morrison
I don’t understand her comparison to 1930s Germany other than win some favour with frightened members of the Jewish community. This is not state sponsored antisemitism as in 1930s Germany. What I’m seeing is anger towards Israel and its wars in the Middle East. And extremists exploiting opportunities presented by this to target all Jews. It’s appalling. But there are also extremists who want to target the Muslim community as we saw with the disorder in Epsom recently.
What is actually needed are calm heads and people who really care about uniting communities rather than dividing them. Imams and Christian religious leaders speaking out against antisemitism and Rabbis publicly calling out the Tommy Robinson Judeo-Christian sham. These community leaders need to stand together and say to the extremists not in our name. What we don’t need are opportunistic politicians; sadly the Tories have learnt nothing.
Edit: although more needs to be done by the government, antisemitism and anti Muslim hate cannot be solved by Government alone. Action is needed at Community level. Much more unification of communities rather than divide and rule.
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MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
Thats cool, that's cool and answers my question.
You can believe what you like, thats your right, but I can categorical say that there have have been sweeping posts about people who claim benefits and recently about free school meals. Maybe unintentional but it 100% happens like many subjects on here.
thfcsteff
Ricky Villa
I've been to China a couple of times (main cities only). It is a very different attitude and approach to life. Which can be said for many Asian countries in fairness.
Part of the reason personality politics came about en masse (IMO - and not going back to JK and other 'starters' of it) is that the seeds of distrust in our political systems were mined heavily be folks claiming it was 'swampy' and that we needed to 'get away' from 'traditional politics'. It's why we have seen the rise of Grifter International -everywhere really- and in all manners and ways.
I agree, the Chinese gvmt get on with what they believe needs to be done; whether that is the same as the vast majority of people I do not know. Subjugation or choice? Again, I don't know.
She has just now on the radio characterised Tommy Robinson marches as being very different from the pro-Palestinian marches, as whilst the latter target Jewish people, Tommy Robinson marches generally just "descend into squabbles with the police", often due to other groups turning up and getting involved.
Absolutely steps need to be taken to deal with anti-Semitism, but it's not a case of one hate is more 'deserving' than another and in trying to (rightly) highlight one atrocious attitude and set of actions that need to be dealt with she has immediately undermined another equally atrocious attitude and actions against a different segment of our society.
You are right that so much more needs to be done at community level but our politicians and other people with voices that are heard need to be responsible for the hate they engender or for the hate that they brush under the carpet by referring to "squabbles".
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
Post of the year
johnola
Dean Richards
I reckon someone born in China on the same day as me will have seen their standard of living go through the roof with that well set to continue - and having grown up in that system there would be comfort within it. They also have improved national security and opportunity.
Compared to England, I would argue apart from double glazing and digital services, living standards have barely moved as our population has increased dramatically with less to go round.
So there can be little contest in who is happier. And for those born today that gap in improvements will be much much wider - so I doubt very much the democratic system looks better to them. We however cannot live without democracy as we think it makes us free - but we aren’t really are we - there are always a myriad constraints - family, work, finances, moralities and religions that we have to navigate around.
I cannot see how they don’t win in the long run.
Robspur12
Johnny Morrison
Agreed. What is happening to the Jewish community now is horrific and has to be tackled head on. I completely understand why the community is fearful, they are being targeted. I am glad Starmer is convening a high level meeting on antisemitism. I hope he is inviting interfaith groups to that meeting because they have a part to play. I personally also hope groups like Stop the war are part of the conversation too.
But what responsible politicians must do is while acknowledging the concerns of the Jewish community, condemn all hate crime because otherwise you risk polarising people making the situation even worse for the Jewish and Muslim communities.
March organisers like "Stop the war" must do more to prevent their marches incubating anti semitism, even though many of the organisers themselves are decent well meaning people. I think banning the marches themselves should not be the first step and would likely be unhelpful as it would create resentment amongst decent people angry at the plight of Gazans or Iranian people. But in the same vein flags on lamp posts designed to intimidate communities and talk of religious crusades is massively unhelpful and will just sow more division.
thfcsteff
Ricky Villa
All fair debate points, but ones I don't really feel especially qualified or comfortable agreeing or disagreeing with simply based on the fact I have not lived in China and therefore I could not possibly say whether the Chinese people are happier or not. There is just too much of a variable; which sector of the population? Urban? Rural? Both?
When it comes to the word 'democracy', well, I have had questions about it for decades, specifically around the fact that in most countries, increasingly you need a millionaire's warchest to even get a seat at the table. To be heard? We're talking big money and plenty of connection.
Winning is certainly a matter of perspective and requires the starting point to be specific and clear. Me? I don't own a house, work my own hours (ironically meaning I probably work more), live in a beautiful part of the world and have made the trade-off between large material comforts in exchange for doing what I enjoy, having a larger degree of control over my time than many, and enjoying the beauty of my surroundings. Within that frame I have managed to raise two children and have been married for nearly 28 years. We do (and did) build a fairly strong pension and 401k (not Rockefeller but we'll be OK) but we try to live our lives for the time we're actually living as opposed to get too lost in the weeds of future tripping/panicking, which is particularly helpful at trying times like these. I feel my biggest victory has been to know who I am and realise early doors that I would've been incredibly unhappy trying to live a conventional life. So my wins are not necessarily material and cannot be measured by a fleet of cars or a large house.
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
This is it, 100% this is it. You need to drive communities together and you do that by having a common goal in hate. Its a lie for the rhetoric to be spun by political parties that "this is not happening anywhere else" when in the last 10 years a mosque was driven into, Muslim shop keepers are having to lock themselves in for safety, Chinese restaurants are being defaced in the hate drive against immigrants, us Jews being used as race baiting tolls by people like Tiny Tommy and Farage. The common enemy to everyone is bigotry and hatred and I think someone with profile and sense needs to start balancing their rhetoric rather than appeasement of voting intent.
Muslims don't matter as much as other minorities. I am so happy anti semitism is getting the attention it deserves. It needs to eff off. However it isn't the same for Muslims. Literally a Muslim man was stabbed by the Golders Green attacker a couple of hours before. But the media have erased that victims name for a simple reason. He was Muslim.
Robspur12
Johnny Morrison
I hear you mate. And it's awful that any community feels that way. It's for politicians to speak truth to power rather than just seek to get more votes.