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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

AuroRaman said:
Farage believes in one thing only and that is how many zeros he can accumulate on the right hand side of his bank balance. I have heard him brazenly say this on more than one occasion.

It’s saddening that the people who support him most are the ones he holds the most disdain towards.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
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He could believe the world is run by lizards for all I care.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Can one of the remoaners who is so in love with the evil EU explain to me why it is ok for European countries to have a insurance based health service but not ok for us.
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Because the EU is a collection of sovereign nations who make their own laws. It is therefore fine for each nation to decide the setup of its health care system. What the EU does is ensure if you're on your holidays in Spain and need medical care, you can for free, without taking out travel insurance as you'd have to in the US or anywhere else.

Danishfurniturelover said:
As for Farage the is a movement in general left leaning society to try and turn him into the devil. He is far from that, he believes in independence, he has always said this country has a duty to accept asylum seekers as they differ from general immigration. And that general immigration should be on a visa points based system like so many other countries in the world.

The far left like to try and turn someone into a monster, you see it every time a republican becomes president. Your so it with Maggie who with the passing of time you can see her mistakes but she was still streets ahead of Kinnock at the time and the country agreed.

I as long as he still wants some separation from Europe voting Corbyn. I want fresh ideas and a more society orientated country and think he offers that.

As for fracking I am mixed on it. Would probably allow 10 year licences while we get true green technology up to speed, wave turbine technology and the like.
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Farage does get a bad press. But then he does use immigration as a tool. Its a very cheap and potentially dangerous trick to get votes. It was used in Brexit and he's used the race card all his career to make a name for himself. His denial of global warming is fascinating. When Farage is pushed on it, he really does not look comfortable with his stated position, denying global warming. Who would be? So why take such a contrary position against all science, and against all the young who have so much to lose? Why wouldn't you want to protect nature and the place we live?

Well to me the answer is he has benifited from Russian funding. And part of the brief is to deny global warming. As Russia is wholly dependent on selling oil and gass. It is funny, look accross the globe at different right wing movements - most share the same setup. Use immigration and almost subtally, without making too much fuss, deny global warming. In this day and age it is not hard to move money from a national government (Russia) secretely to political benificaries - with no trace. So maybe the conspiracy theories and evidence about Aaron Banks (married to a russia spy, being sold gold mines on the cheap by russia) funding Farrage are true. Why else would a sensible and relatively clever man deny global warming?
 
parklane1 said:
You are not daft enough to believe that most of the M/Ps in power do not do the same?????
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There’s a difference. My experience, and I know one that is shared by many who have spent time with them is that the majority of MP’s have a genuine belief in what their party stands for. They have an unwavering belief in themselves and what they believe is right for their constituency/region/nation/globally.

I’ve been in awe of MP’s who I categorically oppose on all fronts when in their company because believe it or not, a lot of them care. Some I would even go far to say are determined to be of service to others and believe in promoting change for the greater good (their view of ‘the greater good’ at least).

Farage is not an MP of that ilk. He is a business man and a fudging brilliant one. Because he doesn’t stand for anything he has the freedom to say what he pleases and is treated like a Demi-GHod for it by his supporters. Other MP’s have to tow a very fine line and behave in a certain manner which he is not shackled by. This is considered a ‘breath of fresh air’ but he is laughing in the faces of those that think that. All the way to the bank.

Farage cares less about Brexit than me; and I am at the very most apathetic towards it.





Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
 
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AuroRaman said:
There’s a difference. My experience, and I know one that is shared by many who have spent time with them is that the majority of MP’s have a genuine belief in what their party stands for. They have an unwavering belief in themselves and what they believe is right for their constituency/region/nation/globally.

I’ve been in awe of MP’s who I categorically oppose on all fronts when in their company because believe it or not, a lot of them care. Some I would even go far to say are determined to be of service to others and believe in promoting change for the greater good (their view of ‘the greater good’ at least).

Farage is not an MP of that ilk. He is a business man and a fudging brilliant one. Because he doesn’t stand for anything he has the freedom to say what he pleases and is treated like a Demi-GHod for it by his supporters. Other MP’s have to tow a very fine line and behave in a certain manner which he is not shackled by. This is considered a ‘breath of fresh air’ but he is laughing in the faces of those that think that. All the way to the bank.

Farage cares less about Brexit than me; and I am at the very most apathetic towards it.





Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
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I am sure they are a few MPs who are honest/brave/sincere, but if you honestly believe that the majority are that way then all i can say is we will agree to disagree. It may have been that way a couple of decades ago but in todays politics its " what is in it for me" first and formost.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Because the EU is a collection of sovereign nations who make their own laws. It is therefore fine for each nation to decide the setup of its health care system. What the EU does is ensure if you're on your holidays in Spain and need medical care, you can for free, without taking out travel insurance as you'd have to in the US or anywhere else.
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Any grown adult without travel insurance has failed life. It comes for free with just about every bank account, home insurance policy, job, etc.

You'd have to live in a fudging cave to avoid having travel insurance by mistake.
 
parklane1 said:
I am sure they are a few MPs who are honest/brave/sincere, but if you honestly believe that the majority are that way then all i can say is we will agree to disagree. It may have been that way a couple of decades ago but in todays politics its " what is in it for me" first and formost.
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Have to agree, look at how much money some have made and hidden in family business.

You can't tell me that Osbourne and DC were not lining their own pockets and thinking about their own financial futures when at the helm, The Blairs reinvented using their power to make money
 
the dza said:
So May will surely go soon. Who will replace her and is there any way a General Election will be avoided now?

Grieve was just on newsnight. He said that if a PM were to try and get a no-deal Brexit, he would vote no-confidence in the government. So even if Tory MPs and members bring us a PM who actively tries for a no-deal Brexit, it seems likely Parliament would then produce a no-confidence vote in the government and bring about a General Election. Perhaps the new leader will pre-empt this and call for a GE right away.
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Grieve doesn't have the numbers (his allies, bar Ken Clarke, went to Change) if the new PM gets the DUP back on board by moving back to Canada+
 
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Gutter Boy said:
Grieve doesn't have the numbers (his allies, bar Ken Clarke, went to Change) if the new PM gets the DUP back on board by moving back to Canada+
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Seeing as most of the clearing bonds that threatened to leave the city have backed down it is quite clearly the best option. Is one I said just after the referendum, not sure why they in charge could not see it. Dont think we will get it or anything close.

We were never likely to leave the EU and I imagine people that wish to bring down the government will vote it out of the house.
 
scaramanga said:
Any grown adult without travel insurance has failed life. It comes for free with just about every bank account, home insurance policy, job, etc.

You'd have to live in a fudging cave to avoid having travel insurance by mistake.
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You can even get it with a terminal illness though it is more expensive. Funny enough in January I am off to China for 6 weeks for medical treatment, you should have seen the reaction from a so called specialised insurance company when they tried to price that in for the year, you would think as medical tourism increases they would have come across that before.
 
DTA said:
You can't be serious!!

The fact that he hasn't released a manifesto means that you HAVE to look at his views points on things like the NHS.

There is talk already if he does well enough in these polls that their will be a partnership between the Brexit party and the Tories under a hard Brexiter. If he doesn't do well that talk is finished. So voting for him makes that much more likely... which risks the NHS and Fracking and climate change denial etc etc.

Brexit and hard Brexit doesn't have anything to do with the NHS are you having a laugh?

Hard brexit makes a deal with the US much more likely, to do a deal with the US we almost certainly have to (amongst other things) open up the NHS to American insurance and drug companies... That will be the beginning of the end for the NHS.

And guess what? That is what Farage and other hard Brexiters want. They have said it openly.
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He.is.a.one.policy.one.note.one.issue person.

His Party is The Brexit Party.

Literally so single policy and short sighted they put it in the name. They are openly not even looking for longevity because there is only one cause.

And its not the NHS, its getting us out of Europe.

As dza points out above, chances are a Hard Brexiteer will fail - or at the very least have to go through a GE. Where, guess what!? There will be manifesto, on wide ranging topics - including the NHS Im sure - which we can vote on in full knowledge of what they mean.

Now? Voting for an MEP in the European Parliament has fudge all to do with the NHS.

I know you think youve got this really enlightened thing going on, only you can see the connections etc, but you are absolutely majoring in the minors on that one.

As I have said, repeatedly, if the NHS goes it will be fundamentally down to Labour and Tory mismanagement over decades. It will have nothing to do with Nigel Farages views. A man who is the very definition of protest vote, on a single matter, and no more. He never even made it as an MP did he? People are smarter than you think, they know exactly what he is. And what he is for.

If we get to a deal with the US on the NHS - caveat, big if, getting ahead of yourself there - it will again be nothing to do with Farage, but instead because its been on course like this for a long time. The NHS is failing, possibly beyond repair, and that lands squarely on Labour and Conservative heads.

And certainly nothing to do with voting in the european elections for a person whose platform doesnt even mention such things.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
He.is.a.one.policy.one.note.one.issue person.

His Party is The Brexit Party.

Literally so single policy and short sighted they put it in the name. They are openly not even looking for longevity because there is only one cause.

And its not the NHS, its getting us out of Europe.

As dza points out above, chances are a Hard Brexiteer will fail - or at the very least have to go through a GE. Where, guess what!? There will be manifesto, on wide ranging topics - including the NHS Im sure - which we can vote on in full knowledge of what they mean.

Now? Voting for an MEP in the European Parliament has fudge all to do with the NHS.

I know you think youve got this really enlightened thing going on, only you can see the connections etc, but you are absolutely majoring in the minors on that one.

As I have said, repeatedly, if the NHS goes it will be fundamentally down to Labour and Tory mismanagement over decades. It will have nothing to do with Nigel Farages views. A man who is the very definition of protest vote, on a single matter, and no more. He never even made it as an MP did he? People are smarter than you think, they know exactly what he is. And what he is for.

If we get to a deal with the US on the NHS - caveat, big if, getting ahead of yourself there - it will again be nothing to do with Farage, but instead because its been on course like this for a long time. The NHS is failing, possibly beyond repair, and that lands squarely on Labour and Conservative heads.

And certainly nothing to do with voting in the european elections for a person whose platform doesnt even mention such things.
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I'm sorry you can't see the things that are in front of you.

If you think Farage goes away now, You are in for a rude awakening.

One that you contributed to.
 
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DTA said:
I'm sorry you can't see the things that are in front of you.

If you think Farage goes away now, You are in for a ride awakening.

One that you contributed to.
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And theres that patronising again.

Farage goes away when his issue is resolved. Just as UKIP disappeared after the referendum (whatever happened to them eh?).

Lets play a numbers game. Assume the NHS goes. How much of that is because I voted Farage in a EUROPEAN election? 10%? More?
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
And theres that patronising again.

Farage goes away when his issue is resolved. Just as UKIP disappeared after the referendum (whatever happened to them eh?).

Lets play a numbers game. Assume the NHS goes. How much of that is because I voted Farage in a EUROPEAN election? 10%? More?
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Of course not 10%. A tiny amount... But an amount never the less.
 
What are people's thoughts on the next PM then?

For me Johnson and Rudd are the two I'd least like to see - Johnson because of who he is and Rudd because she's the main remainer in the field.

Hunt and Javid seem the grown-ups in cabinet, but both have massive charisma voids.

Part of me would like to see a younger female PM. Thatcher and May have given female leaders a bad name and potentially better role models like Harriet Harman have never been allowed to get to party leader level. Truss seems a bit Osborne-y neo-lib on economics, and I don't know much about McVey or Mordant.

Basically I'd like to see a Canada+ leaver, who is socially liberal, but more economically Keynesian/one nation. I'm not sure who that candidate is.
 
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