*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur vs Everton ***

[thfcsteff]

Twice. He fudged up twice. Show me a 20 year old Ledley King and I'll show you an impulsive young defender who made quite a few errors while learning. In a PL era when teams were far less inclined to punish your mistakes than they are now.

He has a valid excuse, and I don't blame him. If I were to single out players for blame, it would be Ade, for completely failing to do the job he was supposed to do, i.e hold up possession and bring others into the game.

Agreed. He had an absolutely awful, awful game, miserable, and once Dembele went off (which, incidentally, was a decision I agree had to be made) I felt we would look like a 10 man team.

I've read some horrible rubbish on here thus far (only just returned to the thread) but thankfully there are posters like your good self who understand the long-term future of this club. And it does NOT revolve around a mistake from a CB who is learning (and who is not used to consistently playing in front of a keeper like Lloris)...Daniel will also be aware that AVB needs backing in the next two windows.

 

[thfcsteff]

Huddlestone fed a number of good, incisive balls forward and did well under pressure a number of times. He fed Dempsey. Dembele was good on the right too and that was part of the sub. It worked.

The subs worked in general. The team played well, we made Everton look pretty ordinary. An individual error from a young centre back cost us the game. We'll be ok.

=D>=D>

 

[Modric THFC]

Nothing wrong with expecting the team to try and play football - this didn't happen today!Would have preferred to go out there and lose going toe to toe rather trying to sneak it then fail so spectacularly.
When we actually did string some passes together they were on the back foot. Why did it take us scoring for this to happen.

Maybe you're right, we're not good enough anymore but from what I have seen of Everton this season they rely very much on work rate. You give them something to think about and they are far less effective.

Because after we scored our jammy goal Everton were shell-shocked their players seemed beaten thinking this was gonna be one of those games. Then they got a fluke from a long ball. Then theirs and our mentality changed.

 

[kanoute16]

If we lost every game trying (and failing,given our personnel) to play entertaining football, AVB would be out on his ass and derided as the worst manager we have ever had.

Results are what count at Spurs, as of this moment, with the squad we have, in the circumstances we find ourselves in. We need to stay in contention for a top four place come January, to persuade new recruits to join us; we need to finish somewhere in the top five or six to have a chance of retaining our players; and we need to grind wins out, due in no small part to our depleted squad.

AVB has two choices; play a counter-attacking style, win games and survive until he can mould his own side, and stamp his own ideals; or play open, attractive football with a bunch of rapidly tiring players (due to the Europa League) who have rarely played with each other before this season, and inevitably take the many losses that will come with such an approach.

One will see him lose all the fans, and probably get sacked, while the other will see him keep the majority of fans onside while losing those who prefer a continuation of the devil-may-care Redknapp policy. Seems an easy choice to me.

I'm not so bothered about entertaining football, just not the negative bollox I spent years mocking gooners for in GG's time there.
FFS did we actually string any passes together or ever look like we might score, no !

 

[Modric THFC]

The only mitigation I can offer Caulker is that on Thursday he played in front of Friedel, today he's playing in front of Lloris...concentration a tad off, better-safe-than-sorry mentality...I think Lloris should be in goal for ALL our games...

Bang on there's a huge difference playing in front of Lloris you wants to come clear everything himself and Friedel who hangs back.
Decent article about rotating keepers - http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/dec/08/sir-alex-ferguson-manchester-united

 

[Jordinho]

I'm not so bothered about entertaining football, just not the negative bollox I spent years mocking gooners for in GG's time there.
FFS did we actually string any passes together or ever look like we might score, no !

Must have imagined those first 5-10 minutes in the second half where we completely dominated. We weren't exactly steamrolled for the rest of the match either. And those freekicks and corners.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Agreed. He had an absolutely awful, awful game, miserable, and once Dembele went off (which, incidentally, was a decision I agree had to be made) I felt we would look like a 10 man team.

I've read some horrible rubbish on here thus far (only just returned to the thread) but thankfully there are posters like your good self who understand the long-term future of this club. And it does NOT revolve around a mistake from a CB who is learning (and who is not used to consistently playing in front of a keeper like Lloris)...Daniel will also be aware that AVB needs backing in the next two windows.

I've always said that he has too many of those games, Adebayor I mean. Also said he's ultimately not good enough and we should look to improve and sign someone better.

Can't really say I'm surprised that we conceded more late goals and threw more points away sadly. I know we've got injuries, but every club has. People say our defence will improve when Kaboul and Ekotto come back, but I think it's deeper than that. For me it boils down to mentality, (seems to come up frequently) lack of concentration or lack of fitness, possibly a combination of the 3.

Even at 1-0 I would have been happy with a draw because of our tendancy to concede late goals, but to lose the game is gutting!

 

[kanoute16]

Because after we scored our jammy goal Everton were shell-shocked their players seemed beaten thinking this was gonna be one of those games. Then they got a fluke from a long ball. Then theirs and our mentality changed.

OK so lets play football that shell shocks teams then! Pass, move, pass - play with width, stretch, receive the ball pass etc. There was no movement at all today no purpose but to stop them from scoring and we failed.
Why is everyone so content with it FFS?

 

[thfcsteff]

Nothing wrong with expecting the team to try and play football - this didn't happen today!Would have preferred to go out there and lose going toe to toe rather trying to sneak it then fail so spectacularly.
When we actually did string some passes together they were on the back foot. Why did it take us scoring for this to happen.

Maybe you're right, we're not good enough anymore but from what I have seen of Everton this season they rely very much on work rate. You give them something to think about and they are far less effective.

First-half was a stalemate between two very well-prepared sides. Second-half we worked our way onto. If Sig's curler goes in it's 0-2 and lights out. One error and one sloppy bit of defending (thus two moments, details) cost us the game. We will learn to erase those.

I have to wonder what match you were watching versus what your expectations of the side that was out there today were? I actually EXPECTED a win and even went as far as to say I thought Dempsey would prove the match-winner. It was a close call. We lost because of two very important details. We did not lose because of this 'spectacular failure' you're bleating on about. Perspective would be a very good friend for you right now mate...when we have Bale, Kaboul, Ekotto and Dembele in the same starting 11 for a few games in a row, you might even like what you see...

 

[JPG_357]

I just can't help that it's not just 3 points wasted though.

Sure, there are numerous games left in the league but we really need to get this good start. We are pretty much a new team. We have a new manager, a new system with a complete new style of players with Dempsey, Dembele, Vertonghen, Lloris starting. A win here today would have done A LOT more than see us go joint 3rd in the table, it does A LOT more then sends out a message to other teams. It installs confidence. Not many teams have gone to Goodison and got a win. Man Utd lost there. We win there today and we can achieve a lot.

We go into the Swansea game next week in front of home fans knowing that a win would see us 3 points clear in 3rd place above Chelsea and certainly for a few hours before West Brom kick off later. Which then installs MORE confidence into the team and especially AVB going into Stoke at home knowing 3 points can see us go 6 points clear of his old club and keep up with City in 2nd (especially if they end up dropping points at all to Saudi Sportswashing Machine or Reading).

This isn't "oh, it's Everton, who are good at home, we didn't deserve to lose but we didn't expect much anyway". This is stone wall three points lost. Three points dropped. I'm not singling out players because it's the team who fudged it up. Adebayor and Defoe didn't do anything today. Vertonghen was beaten far too often, Walker was beaten and out of position and for some reason taking set pieces. Caulker should have listened to Lloris. I could go on. We should have won this game. In fact it's pathetic that we didn't and a reason why I believe we aren't going to get 4th place this season.

Too many times we feel to try and invite teams on when we are winning. Why? I have no idea. Maybe AVB thinks that if we can withstand a barrage it will make the team feel more united? more confident in seeing out anything. winning dirty?. fudge that. We go to the corner, we waste time. We make sure we get those 3 points by any means necessary. What about the players though? They couldn't care less that they didn't get the 3 points today, it's a job to them. They still get paid. What about the paying away fans though who come to cheer there team to win, only to see fudging errors from PROFESSIONAL fudging FOOTBALLERS fudging up at there job cost us not only two points but fudging 3.

flimflam.

so did Bassong play .. oh wait

 

[Jordinho]

Imagine if we'd set out to outplay them and just attack and gotten a real pasting on the counter. AVB would be getting an absolute battering about not going away to a very difficult opponent, thinking they would just hand us the points.

 

[JPG_357]

and there I was thinking ...the worse that could happen would be to draw.

Adebayor ...didnt take part much,,, by the sound of it...

shoudve kept Pav..................................................................................



maybe we sould have kept Dempsey on?


boy oh boy........when are we going to turn this corner...

thats twice we could have put ourselves in a strong position...


I'm thinking ...if you bet against us in these crucial games you'd win a fortune!

and I must admit to nearly putting on a couple of hudred ...for us to lose or draw..but not win..


andf there was I was thinking...oooops forgot about the obvious...............

we turned the corner by wining four games in a row

 

[JPG_357]

This mentality is what makes us losers. Yes they are good but why not try to play them off the park?
We went there looking to "mug" them, let them play and steal the points. We didn't play today and only held onto the ball after we scored.
A calamity of errors let them back in and once again we folded at the last.

We need some quality and I just cannot see AVB's philosophy ever getting us anywhere. Even after our win against Liverpool I was unhappy that we gave them so much of that game at home.
It's just not good enough and once more we are going to let a good opportunity to get into the CL get away from us.

Why would we expect to play Everton off the park at Goodison - how many teams do that - I would have thought not many

we played exactly the right game, but got beaten at the end - it happens

 

[Modric THFC]

Imagine if we'd set out to outplay them and just attack and gotten a real pasting on the counter. AVB would be getting an absolute battering about not going away to a very difficult opponent, thinking they would just hand us the points.

It will always be something.
At no one is complaining about us not playing 442 today.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Twice. He fudged up twice. Show me a 20 year old Ledley King and I'll show you an impulsive young defender who made quite a few errors while learning. In a PL era when teams were far less inclined to punish your mistakes than they are now.

He has a valid excuse, and I don't blame him. If I were to single out players for blame, it would be Ade, for completely failing to do the job he was supposed to do, i.e hold up possession and bring others into the game.

At least the last two matches have well and truly dispelled the myth that Ade and Defoe can play together. The partnership nullifies both of them.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I'm not so bothered about entertaining football, just not the negative bollox I spent years mocking gooners for in GG's time there.
FFS did we actually string any passes together or ever look like we might score, no !

We did score.
Generally, we've been pretty good at doing that this season. We've certainly scored quite a few more than Everton, I believe.
Point being, we're doing what we can with limited resources. Wait until we've sorted out the gaping Modric-sized hole in midfield before you judge.

 

[JPG_357]

Thing is they dont learn any lessons. Just same mistakes all the time

What you mean the way we defended leads v West ham Liverpool Pana Fulham - those type of mistakes?

The way we lost at Old Trafford after going ahead or Southampton - oh hang on

 

[JPG_357]

The only mitigation I can offer Caulker is that on Thursday he played in front of Friedel, today he's playing in front of Lloris...concentration a tad off, better-safe-than-sorry mentality...I think Lloris should be in goal for ALL our games...

well said

 

[JPG_357]

I'm too drunk now, but tomorrow I'm going to go through this thread and put all the people who are caning us for losing by one goal at Everton on ignore - should cut down on a lot of unnecessary debate for me

why are spurs fans such a moany lot - i really don't understand

it was the same down the pub - do a lot of spurs fans get confused an think we're Barcelona - and I tell you what I doubt Everton would roll over for the tikka taka boys at Goodison, and they certainly don't tend to for any Prem team.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Agreed. He had an absolutely awful, awful game, miserable, and once Dembele went off (which, incidentally, was a decision I agree had to be made) I felt we would look like a 10 man team.

I've read some horrible rubbish on here thus far (only just returned to the thread) but thankfully there are posters like your good self who understand the long-term future of this club. And it does NOT revolve around a mistake from a CB who is learning (and who is not used to consistently playing in front of a keeper like Lloris)...Daniel will also be aware that AVB needs backing in the next two windows.

But will he back him? There's a difference between recognizing a problem and doing something about it, as we can all attest to.