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*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur v Wolverhampton Wanderers ***

Gutter Boy said:
WhIt is the big question. I am someone who absolutely wanted the manager to have at least three quarters of his full squad back to see what we could do then, I won't shy away from that, however I have consistently been critical of the Munn/Lange affair and how they have basically left Ange out to dry on several levels (with Levy in the background of course). There have been critical times in the season to make decisions and we have not, instead shunting Ange out to deal with it. Somewhere in this most fudged up of Venn diagrams, Ange has lost the players. My feeling is that it happened when he had to start mitigating against injuries. I think the players became bewildered TBH. Regardless, the net result is that Ange is done, the players look done, our playing foundations currently look like they're supported by a layer of strawberry blancmange, and this mess is deep. I think Ange's only role right now is to be a punching bag/deflect blows from others above him.
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How often do DOF/CEO of football speak to the public?

It's always (rightly or wrongly) down to the players and managers to speak to the press etc.

Munn should be gone for continuing to back Ange

Edit - you've answered elsewhere !
 
Gutter Boy said:
The 3 with reported attitude issues. But he also rescued the likes of Rose and Dembele from the scrap heap and made them world beaters.

I wouldn't throw anyone out till they've been re-evaluated by the next guy. I don't think we can under-estimate how amateur hour the last 2 years have been.
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I don't see anything in our leadership group that will be turned around.
Certainly the tools are there with spence, grey, Bergvall, vdv, Sarr and even Bissouma for the right guy.
We just need the right guy and to give him the backing to make decisions on who he wants and who he trusts.
 
Grays_1890 said:
Of course but I think Spurs is probably IMO the most politicised club in the league fan wise, there is an underbelly of people (not on here, but there is an element of it) where fans are almost waiting for failure to be vocal and jump over it, we are by far the worst club for that, if its not the team, its the stadium in that respect. Their is a veil of negativity round this club currently and I think in part the fans are playing their part.

As for what is success, I think most of us on here were pretty balanced on what success is and that was small steps forward, many on here said "I would take a step back to go forward" but this is not that, this is as bad as I have seen it at Spurs
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If we won the PL and beat arsenal 5-1 in the CL final I'm sure some of our fans would call that failure.
 
Gutter Boy said:
The 3 with reported attitude issues. But he also rescued the likes of Rose and Dembele from the scrap heap and made them world beaters.

I wouldn't throw anyone out till they've been re-evaluated by the next guy. I don't think we can under-estimate how amateur hour the last 2 years have been.
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The problem is, people try and apply previous trends to the here and now, I don't see an issue with attitudes here, I see a problem of him appointing the wrong captains.
 
thfcsteff said:
Back in the winter I'd like to have seen more 'placed' media with Lange/Munn outlining the process. In January, we should've had further attaking signings lined up IMMEDIATELY, not just cheap risk-free punts in the last mins of the window.Having got Kinsky so quickly it was expected. Last summer I'd like to have seen us edge the fiunds a bit more and sign Eze as well as Gray and Bergvall. I would not have got Odobert, especially as we have Moore coming through. I'd like to have seen us sign that extra CB in the summer as well, might've allowedus to bring Romero back from the summer/short pre-season a little better plus givenus better coverage. I'd also like (and this is hindsight) to have had not overhauled the medical department so drastically; the footballing directorship have to carry the can for that debacle, that is a clear fudge-up on their part. Finally, I'd like to have seen someone savvy enough at the club to take Ange aside, tell him to sit out a conference or two (especially tight after Thursdays) and claim 'under the weather' or something and put Wells up for a couple of conferences here and there, feeding him a script to recite and thus deflecting from the mess.
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Spending more money is always an answer. Fair enough.

Maybe more media appearances of senior figures would have helped, but would it have cut through to the average fan on twitter anyway?

Ultimately, managers will always be judged on results, it doesn’t matter what the long term plan is, if you don’t win games whilst you do it.
 
glasgowspur said:
I don't see anything in our leadership group that will be turned around.
Certainly the tools are there with spence, grey, Bergvall, vdv, Sarr and even Bissouma for the right guy.
We just need the right guy and to give him the backing to make decisions on who he wants and who he trusts.
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Romero can definitely become the Alderwereld of the next 5 years. Son could be a mentor for Odobert/Moore/Yang etc. for another year. Maddison I would cash in on and use Donley to back-up Kulu. I would make Kulu captain though and Gray vice.

I think it's actually easy for the next guy. Double pivot, fullbacks tuck in a bit, a bit of pass and move coaching and boom - we're straight back top 6.
 
Gutter Boy said:
Romero can definitely become the Alderwereld of the next 5 years. Son could be a mentor for Odobert/Moore/Yang etc. for another year. Maddison I would cash in on and use Donley to back-up Kulu. I would make Kulu captain though and Gray vice.

I think it's actually easy for the next guy. Double pivot, fullbacks tuck in a bit, a bit of pass and move coaching and boom - we're straight back top 6.
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I just don't see it with Romero, I'd him closer to Dawson than Toby tbh.
 
Genuine question. Have we ever had a worse season in the league result wise?
Even when we got relegated if you do the math we'd have got 41 points all things equal (amount of games and 3 points for a win).
 
Gutter Boy said:
Romero can definitely become the Alderwereld of the next 5 years. Son could be a mentor for Odobert/Moore/Yang etc. for another year. Maddison I would cash in on and use Donley to back-up Kulu. I would make Kulu captain though and Gray vice.

I think it's actually easy for the next guy. Double pivot, fullbacks tuck in a bit, a bit of pass and move coaching and boom - we're straight back top 6.
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I think people think "its Tottenham it can't happen", loads of self loathing about it.

But I have seen someone in Moyes go into Everton.......a really poor Everton and tweak it to make the resilient on whats needed for that club at that time, they were 1 point above relegation, they are now 18.

Ange biggest issue has been is inability to allow his ego to change his tactics, we are lying if we are pretending someone else coming in could not do better.
 
Lilbaz said:
Genuine question. Have we ever had a worse season in the league result wise?
Even when we got relegated if you do the math we'd have got 41 points all things equal (ammount of games and 3 points for a win).
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We apparently drew a lot more and didn't lose as many as this season.
 
Lilbaz said:
Genuine question. Have we ever had a worse season in the league result wise?
Even when we got relegated if you do the math we'd have got 41 points all things equal (ammount of games and 3 points for a win).
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Its steam rolling towards the worst PL season loss wise. We likely beat 93/94 for that.

20 or 21 losses in 77 might take some beating, but after today, who knows
 
Baleforce said:
Spending more money is always an answer. Fair enough.

Maybe more media appearances of senior figures would have helped, but would it have cut through to the average fan on twitter anyway?

Ultimately, managers will always be judged on results, it doesn’t matter what the long term plan is, if you don’t win games whilst you do it.
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I am not asking for the universe or irrational spending, and I like the young talent model. I do think we needed a bit more experience in that squad, and I was asking for a great player who could fill two positions and is 'camera ready' at the very top level. Had we not signed Odobert, had we declined Werner's 170k a week fee, we'd have ended up spending maybe 20 mill more. The problem is how we insist on structuring our deals and the wage ceiling we won't go through. I will further add that early last summer, when Kimmich was apparently available, I was really hoping we'd sign him as a 'Davids-Naybet' type of signing. I felt we needed that badly with such a young squad.
 
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