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OMT: Might Spurs v Coventry Wednesday 18 September, kick-off 8pm

harr1984 said:
Not bothered about the performance to be honest, since day dot when a manager makes that many changes you get that sort of display. What I'm more bothered about is why he chose to pick that team in the first place after what happened at Fulham last season.

That being said, there is something a little funny and ironic with people whinging on here when we are the better team and don't win, then complain when we aren't the better team with a real mish mash of a line up and win.....
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It's not really ironic because we didn't actually play well in those matches you say people were whinging about. Passing the ball around a lot but not creating any significant chances and then losing to a team who actually did create chances is not being the better team. One team functionally failed at football in that instance.

I'm also not sure how much credit you really want for playing awfully versus a Championship side and just about scraping an underserved win. The two scenarios are nothing at all alike.
 
dingdongo said:
Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but it's all a bit Tottenham that we were debating the merits of going for Neto during the summer because of his imjury record and then Odobert gets injured almost as soon as he arrives 😉
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It's just part of the bedding in process. Gray and Bergvall next.
 
I have said it time and time again, the inverted full backs are not working. The CB’s have no options out wide and the cb’s play between each other and then the keeper. Have the full backs out wide and we create more options and force the opposition to push a few more players forward which creates space for the midfielders and opens the opposition up. At the moment our full backs are running into the middle, sitting next to the striker and just twiddling their thumbs hoping something happens. 2 or 3 times last night Dragusin was really looking for a forward pass but had no options so he inevitably turned and passed back.

I could set up a team to play this Spurs team, pack the midfield and let Son and Johnson have it as they are not going to take on their man, let them play it between the cb’s and keeper and take advantage when they inevitably force it and give the ball away.
 
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DeanoAustin said:
I did wonder earlier in the thread why, when we were doing well last season, the first touch and first intention was always ultra positive and now it's very cautious and safe. Another poster suggested that perhaps the players are terrified of the consequences of taking those risks because we're so exposed at the back.

It's as good an explanation as I've seen because there is a massive difference in our mindset compared to early last season IMO.
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Theory can never trump experience. Ange can try an promote mindset and belief all day but the evidence paints a different story.

Players were committed to the methods were getting results
Players were comitted results were inconsistant, fair enough
Players were committed but the same things kept happening, kept giving up same sort of chances while creating less. You as an indiidual took a risk, didn't work led to a goal it happens
Now, you made a mistake that led to a few 1v1 chances/goals. Results aren't going your way as a team. Automatically you start taking less risks casue you have seen the outcome of what happens when you do. Oh Micky is out..who's gonna catch the striker then, better keep the ball safe etc etc etc

To the point as I said in the match thread, regardless of the oppostion all our games play out the same. Start well, don't score, they realise we're not gonna score and attack, we look shakey, they attack and score.

I think the solution is tactical tweaks, will help push the result button and erase the trauma associated with the current system, doens't need to be massive, tell the full backs to overlap instead for example, get a win from Udogie crossing it to Solanke and you've got a clean(er) slate to work with.
 
This performance is down to Anges decisison to make far too many changes, i posted a couple of days back that after the Fulham game [ in this cup] last season we should not throw in the young kids hoping/expecting to win the game. Sadly he went and did the same thing last night and we were lucky to escape without another defeat

I have said i have no problem with bringing the kids in but we should have done so later in the game when we stood a better chance of leading with the established players to start with. Sadly he did not do so and we ended winning, not sure we deserved it though.

Before any one gets on to me i have no problem with giving the kids/back up players game time but it should be done once we have a better chance of having the lead with the senior players.
 
parklane1 said:
This performance is down to Anges decisison to make far too many changes, i posted a couple of days back that after the Fulham game [ in this cup] last season we should not throw in the young kids hoping/expecting to win the game. Sadly he went and did the same thing last night and we were lucky to escape without another defeat

I have said i have no problem with bringing the kids in but we should have done so later in the game when we stood a better chance of leading with the established players to start with. Sadly he did not do so and we ended winning, not sure we deserved it though.

Before any one gets on to me i have no problem with giving the kids/back up players game time but it should be done once we have a better chance of having the lead with the senior players.
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He won so even though the performance was brick it doesn’t matter
What’s key for him is he has some game time in the legs of certain players
He has to do it some time and this was the best chance before the Irwin game next week
 
Bedfordspurs said:
He won so even though the performance was brick it doesn’t matter
What’s key for him is he has some game time in the legs of certain players
He has to do it some time and this was the best chance before the Irwin game next week
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like i said i have no problem with bringing in the kids for this game but imo we should have started with the regular playets and then introduced the youngsters later in the game. We ended up scrambling to get anything out of the game and lets be honest we were lucky to get the win.

Start with establish players, get the lead and then bring the youngsters in.
 
parklane1 said:
like i said i have no problem with bringing in the kids for this game but imo we should have started with the regular playets and then introduced the youngsters later in the game. We ended up scrambling to get anything out of the game and lets be honest we were lucky to get the win.

Start with establish players, get the lead and then bring the youngsters in.
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The established players though have been part of the issue
I’d Kirk a lot more changes game to game
 
Yiddo said:
I have said it time and time again, the inverted full backs are not working. The CB’s have no options out wide and the cb’s play between each other and then the keeper. Have the full backs out wide and we create more options and force the opposition to push a few more players forward which creates space for the midfielders and opens the opposition up. At the moment out full backs are running into the middle, sitting next to the striker and just twiddling their thumbs hoping something happens. 2 or 3 times last night Dragusin was really looking for a forward pass but had no options so he inevitably turned and passed back.

I could set up a team to play this Spurs team, pack the midfield and let Son and Johnson have it as they are not going to take on their man, let them play it between the cb’s and keepers and take advantage when they inevitably force it and give the ball away.
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I agree. At the moment, once the opposition is set in their defensive shape, having the full backs come inside adds to the congestion there. The reluctance or inability of the wingers to get to the bye line then leads to the recycling and general toothlessness. 75% possession and no shots, on or off target, in the first half is just unacceptable. It bespeaks of a system that is not working, especially as the opposition did have shots on goal with their 25% possession.

Ange talks about us lacking conviction in the final third, but if there is no space there, in part because of the way the players are drilled to play, what are they supposed to do? Shooting from distance would seem to be a (low percentage) option for the likes of Maddison and Son, but there is no sign that is part of the gameplan. Instead, we appear to focus on beating our collective heads against the brick wall that all teams will set up with. hence the possession rich but goal poor results in 3 of our 4 league games.
 
NYSpur said:
I agree. At the moment, once the opposition is set in their defensive shape, having the full backs come inside adds to the congestion there. The reluctance or inability of the wingers to get to the bye line then leads to the recycling and general toothlessness. 75% possession and no shots, on or off target, in the first half is just unacceptable. It bespeaks of a system that is not working, especially as the opposition did have shots on goal with their 25% possession.

Ange talks about us lacking conviction in the final third, but if there is no space there, in part because of the way the players are drilled to play, what are they supposed to do? Shooting from distance would seem to be a (low percentage) option for the likes of Maddison and Son, but there is no sign that is part of the gameplan. Instead, we appear to focus on beating our collective heads against the brick wall that all teams will set up with. hence the possession rich but goal poor results in 3 of our 4 league games.
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The wingers get to the byline all game
We just play it to them so slowly they can’t go anything unless they pull off some skill they don’t really have
However last night the goals came from fast passing and that’s what has to happen more and more
 
parklane1 said:
This performance is down to Anges decisison to make far too many changes, i posted a couple of days back that after the Fulham game [ in this cup] last season we should not throw in the young kids hoping/expecting to win the game. Sadly he went and did the same thing last night and we were lucky to escape without another defeat

I have said i have no problem with bringing the kids in but we should have done so later in the game when we stood a better chance of leading with the established players to start with. Sadly he did not do so and we ended winning, not sure we deserved it though.

Before any one gets on to me i have no problem with giving the kids/back up players game time but it should be done once we have a better chance of having the lead with the senior players.
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We've played with a full first team a hundred times before in similar games, and looked just as bad. I'm 99% sure we'd look exactly the same, no matter who started. We've seen that many, many times before. It ain't who's out there, it's what's in their head!
 
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Kandi1977 said:
We've played with a full first team a hundred times before in similar games, and looked just as bad. I'm 99% sure we'd look exactly the same, no matter who started. We've seen that many, many times before. It ain't who's out there, it's what's in their head!
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Disagree, when you play a lower div team they go into the game with nothing to lose. We should not under eastimte them which we have done in previous games.
 
parklane1 said:
Disagree, when you play a lower div team they go into the game with nothing to lose. We should not under eastimte them which we have done in previous games.
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That’s what what he is saying
Even with a first team we have struggled many times in these games because the mentality isn’t right
 
parklane1 said:
Disagree, when you play a lower div team they go into the game with nothing to lose. We should not under eastimte them which we have done in previous games.
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You can disagree all you like, but those are the facts. We've seen it numerous times, fielding a strong team against lower league opposition, and we've looked exactly like we did against Coventry. There's no denying that. And in all those games, people have been moaning about not playing youngster and fringe players, as those would surely put in more effort.
It's the mindset that is wrong. Maybe not intentionally, but I'm pretty sure it's different than when facing City or similar.
It creeps into the back of the head.
And when you then get on the back foot, it's difficult to recover.
 
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