Moussa Sissoko

[glorygloryeze]

BoL says that constantly playing players is 'conditioning' and makes them fitter.
Pretty obvious to me that if you play a player a massive amount, he will pull something.
We could have rotated our midfield a lot more, in these games we were p1ss1ng e.g. Skipp, Rose, Foyth, Gazzaniga, anyone really

I'm awaiting @BrainOfLevy 's reply on this too...

 

[90291Spur]

BoL says that constantly playing players is 'conditioning' and makes them fitter.
Pretty obvious to me that if you play a player a massive amount, he will pull something.
We could have rotated our midfield a lot more, in these games we were p1ss1ng e.g. Skipp, Rose, Foyth, Gazzaniga, anyone really

Given the metrics done on players we have to assume that Sissoko was not in the 'red zone' therefore his chance of a muscular injury was not high. UNLESS Poch ignored the data and felt it a risk worth taking.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I'm awaiting @BrainOfLevy 's reply on this too...

I honestly don’t know. Maybe Poch has overplayed him and is kicking himself now, or maybe it’s just bad luck. All I do know is that he and Perez are two of the most obsessed coaches as it relates to data around player’s conditionining, so they’re likely to know when someone is about to pull up or not, or who is a big risk.

With that in mind, I’m not sure how playing him late on in games we are winning has done to harm him, if it has. I just don’t know. Again though, the only thing for sure is that Poch and Perez are obsessed by data and conditioning.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

Bournemouth, Cardiff, Everton. 90,90,83 mins.

Games we were tinkling.... definitely an option there to hook him for a rest.

I think Sissoko had to start all those games, if he starts Skipp instead with Sissoko on the bench and we don’t get the result then Poch gets crucified on here.

However I do agree he could have rested him for 20/30 minutes at the end of some of those.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

I think Sissoko had to start all those games, if he starts Skipp instead with Sissoko on the bench and we don’t get the result then Poch gets crucified on here.

However I do agree he could have rested him for 20/30 minutes at the end of some of those.

I dont think he could have, really. Maybe Bournemouth? Even then though they are a side that rallies late in games.

Everton have real quality. Cardiff will kick lumps out of you.

I cant say I ever saw those games and thought Sissoko was ripe to come off.

As Ive been saying for a long time, he has been literally the only option.

 

[Bullet]

I dont think he could have, really. Maybe Bournemouth? Even then though they are a side that rallies late in games.

Everton have real quality. Cardiff will kick lumps out of you.

I cant say I ever saw those games and thought Sissoko was ripe to come off.

As Ive been saying for a long time, he has been literally the only option.

#DisagreeButton

Those games were well won. If not then, when?
It’s not like Sissoko was needed in the last 30 mins of those

 

[StephenH]

#hindsight is brilliant.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

#DisagreeButton

Those games were well won. If not then, when?
It’s not like Sissoko was needed in the last 30 mins of those

You only get 3 subs though, in those games he took off a combination of Kane, Son, Eriksen, Dele and also Sissoko himself for 10 mins. If he doesn’t rest those players, takes Sissoko off instead for longer and then say Eriksen/Kane pulls a muscle against Utd instead then we’d be screaming as well.

It looks like he saved a sub v Cardiff, this is the game he could/should have given Sissoko another 20 minutes I guess.

 

[Bullet]

Yes but at what time, 60 minutes?

The other day Poch subbed someone on 89 and someone else on 92

Trying to run down the clock

Overworking certain players will always come back to bite you, it is reliable

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

#DisagreeButton

Those games were well won. If not then, when?
It’s not like Sissoko was needed in the last 30 mins of those

Sissoko is effective when we are countered against. He is often the last line of defence while we dominate games.

He has often been brought on to close out games, its a strength he has.

Take him out and we could be vulnerable.

And, as Gazza says, Eriksen, Alli, Kane... they all need managing/resting too.

 

[StephenH]

Injuries will always happen!
Harry’s out for at least a month imo and it’s no different from Moussa situation, these things are part and parcel of the game. You can try and minimise them but you won’t stop them.

We such it up and move on!

 

[MKSpur]

Injuries will always happen!
Harry’s out for at least a month imo and it’s no different from Moussa situation, these things are part and parcel of the game. You can try and minimise them but you won’t stop them.

We such it up and move on!

Agree they are part and parcel of the game but things can be done to mitigate the likelihood of them happening.

Kane’s injury couldn’t be avoided, we were chasing the game and he got taken out by the gurning oaf. However if he had sustained the same impact injury against Tranmere there would be no question that bringing him off the bench in that game was an uneccessary risk.

There may be some debate about at what points Sissoko could have been rested given the decimation if our cm pool, but I’m sure he would not have played as many consecutive games if dembele Wanyama or Dier had been available to avoid over working him. I know there is lots of talk about a scientific approach to fitness but even if the training readouts on Sissoko has said he was at risk I’m not sure there were any viable alternative to start this game. I do find it difficult to understand why making early subs when a game is looking like it’s over would not have helped but our conditioning over the course of the season has usually been a strength. We probably struggle to have more than 5 options for centre mid and keep them all engaged but by being without 2 of them all season put us under immense strain when Diers not football related injury took him out.

I’d expect us to replace both dembele and Wanyama in the summer and in pre season we were expecting at least one of them to return to their former levels.

 

[StephenH]

Spilt milk. @MKSpur
There is sweet FA anybody can do.
Injuries will always bite us and other on the bum. We have a 'shallower' squad which doesn't help.
Pochetino & Co looks at the fitness and conditioning 'apparently' ad nauseam.

 

[AdamB]

Spilt milk. @MKSpur
There is sweet FA anybody can do.
Injuries will always bite us and other on the bum. We have a 'shallower' squad which doesn't help.
Pochetino & Co looks at the fitness and conditioning 'apparently' ad nauseam.

Dont really agree with the general point that we have a shallow squad. People often talk about an ideal/large squad size of two per position, plus some kids. We have:

- we have 3 GKs
- we have 4 senior FBs plus a youngster
- we have 4 CBs
- we have senior 5 CMs (Dier, Sissoko, Wanyama, Winks, Dembele) plus a youngster
- we have 5 attackers/wingers/no 10s (plus one useless young player in GKN)
- we have 1 CF (plus a couple who have been less effective).

Only real problem is that our two back-up CFs haven't been effective and we have a lot of injuries in CM.

So I'm not really sure that its shallow

 

[harr1984]

Dont really agree with the general point that we have a shallow squad. People often talk about an ideal/large squad size of two per position, plus some kids. We have:

- we have 3 GKs
- we have 4 senior FBs plus a youngster
- we have 4 CBs
- we have senior 5 CMs (Dier, Sissoko, Wanyama, Winks, Dembele) plus a youngster
- we have 5 attackers/wingers/no 10s (plus one useless young player in GKN)
- we have 1 CF (plus a couple who have been less effective).

Only real problem is that our two back-up CFs haven't been effective and we have a lot of injuries in CM.

So I'm not really sure that its shallow

Indeed. Our backup CBs are Sanchez and Foyth.
One of Winks,Sissoko, Dier wouldnt get in our first choice CM for some games and thats without consideration for Wanyama and currently Dembele
Two from Lucas,Son and Lamela wont get in our team with Dele and Eriksen certanties most of the time.
Our squad is pretty deep realistically without having City type money.....

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

Injuries will always happen!
Harry’s out for at least a month imo and it’s no different from Moussa situation, these things are part and parcel of the game. You can try and minimise them but you won’t stop them.

We such it up and move on!

A muscle pull is very different to an impact injury.

And the instance of muscle pulls can be reduced by managing/analysis.

That's what we're discussing. We can reduce anything down to 'sh.t happens' or 'it is what it is' but then we wouldn't (yes I'm looking at you @StephenH ) spend all day on here discussing the ins and outs of Sissokoooo's arse crack....wtf else have we got to do.?

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

I honestly don’t know. Maybe Poch has overplayed him and is kicking himself now, or maybe it’s just bad luck. All I do know is that he and Perez are two of the most obsessed coaches as it relates to data around player’s conditionining, so they’re likely to know when someone is about to pull up or not, or who is a big risk.

With that in mind, I’m not sure how playing him late on in games we are winning has done to harm him, if it has. I just don’t know. Again though, the only thing for sure is that Poch and Perez are obsessed by data and conditioning.

I honestly don’t know. Maybe Poch has overplayed him and is kicking himself now, or maybe it’s just bad luck. All I do know is that he and Perez are two of the most obsessed coaches as it relates to data around player’s conditionining, so they’re likely to know when someone is about to pull up or not, or who is a big risk.

With that in mind, I’m not sure how playing him late on in games we are winning has done to harm him, if it has. I just don’t know. Again though, the only thing for sure is that Poch and Perez are obsessed by data and conditioning.

What I would add though, is in conjunction with the data, if the opportunities arise where the game is won (not often BUT in our case we've had 3 recently) you'd take those opportunities mainly based on the fact that we were down to the bare bones in that position and the impact of any tiredness injury would trump the risk of imploding when 3-0 up against Cardiff for example.

 

[StephenH]

A muscle pull is very different to an impact injury.

No difference!
Kane had both on Sunday, twisted his ankle and then got kicked on it.
We little choice but play Moussa on Sunday and for that matter since Dier appendix problem.
Wanyama AND Dembele have been as useful as a chocolate fireguard.
Dembele last played 3rd November, Wanyama 10th November.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

No difference!
Kane had both on Sunday, twisted his ankle and then got kicked on it.
We little choice but play Moussa on Sunday and for that matter since Dier appendix problem.
Wanyama AND Dembele have been as useful as a chocolate fireguard.
Dembele last played 3rd November, Wanyama 10th November.

You're on a wind up.

 

[afsoc4life]

Dont really agree with the general point that we have a shallow squad. People often talk about an ideal/large squad size of two per position, plus some kids. We have:

- we have 3 GKs
- we have 4 senior FBs plus a youngster
- we have 4 CBs
- we have senior 5 CMs (Dier, Sissoko, Wanyama, Winks, Dembele) plus a youngster
- we have 5 attackers/wingers/no 10s (plus one useless young player in GKN)
- we have 1 CF (plus a couple who have been less effective).

Only real problem is that our two back-up CFs haven't been effective and we have a lot of injuries in CM.

So I'm not really sure that its shallow

How many of those players are injury prone? we knew of our injury problem in midfield before the season started and decided to proceed without getting better cover. We will eventually unlock GKN. There was a reason we bought him.