Johan Lange - Sporting Director

[Ace Face]

I think Frank's lack of courage cost us,

Seeing how lacking in the cajones department JL and VV both appear to be, it makes absolute sense why they chose TF in the summer.

 

[thfcsteff]

I don't think that's fair. He signed players for specific roles, Palhinha to give steel in midfield as we had conceded so many goals over the last 3 seasons; Kudus to be that game changing player we lacked with Kulu out; Xavi to cover the loss of Madders. He was looking at other flair players like Eze too.

I heard early in the summer that he had turned down both Eze and Xavi as he wanted MGW. I believe he was 'talked around' to Eze and Xavi. He did the hard work in signing Palhinha, agreed. Where I believe he failed was in trusting him to do his job and using him to allow others to do theirs with more freedom.

Look, a lot of fans will want to pin where we are now solely at the door of TF especially as we won the EL last season. My view is that he came into an already wretched situation in the league and couldn't turn it around so was trying make best use of resources at his disposal.

Which goes back to a total lack of planning and scope. If (as a club) we were going to allow the alchemy of winning to be broken up for the pragmatism of rebuilding again (which we did) then there had to be more decisive action earlier. Johnson is a fine example. Due diligence would've already told Frank he didn't want him, so sell him quickly and target replacement whilst stock was high. Want to build a defence you trust? Go and get Nathan Collins, pay whatever is necessary to get the manager players he wants. I thought Frank was pitched as a tactician who could get the most out of a group of players. He must've thought the group was decent given that he took the job. As for making the best of those resources, I would counter that he did not, instead looking to try and make them play the way he wanted us to play. I agree, squad imbalance was initially wholly not his to own.

I think in Ange's first season we saw the best progression of the ball I've seen for a long time at Spurs and TF couldn't replicate that. But we didn't see that last season either. Moves would often breakdown because of poor passing. And of course the best midfield passer has been injured for the whole of the season. As well as other injuries to offensive minded players, meaning he couldn't develop a settled style.

Yup. Injuries and the breakdown of the relationship between Munn and the rest, most certainly cost us big time.

Plus 3 seasons of conceding 60 plus goals before he arrived was always going to come back and bite us on the a*se in the end, in a league where teams are set up primarily not to lose.

I agree with you, and agree with others who say that Kane/Son masked so many issues. They did! So yeah, major problem there...

I think RDZ is a very good coach but if he doesn't make us meaner defensively over his time here, even if we survive this season, we could be back here next season.

I think confidence is the biggest barrier. I really do. We are so fragile and risk-averse.

 

[thfcsteff]

Biss was excluded because eif his lack of time keeping. I know you dislike Frank but you're forgetting the details.

You're right, he was INITIALLY excluded because of time-keeping. Was he then completely frozen out because of time-keeping? How long does punishment for an infraction last? Lets face it, he didn't fancy (or trust) his style of playing. Of course, given the speed with which our board managed to sell Johnson without replacement, why did we not do everything to get Biss out of the club in that window? There was interest from Turkey. If Biss was that big an issue re: discipline, then they should've moved him on quickly.

Bergvall might be worth the risk if he were actually a distributor or a good passer, as yet he's neither so is just a risk in terms of losing possession (he gets dispossessed a LOT).

He's got the potential to be a great player. You either allow him to bloom or you don't. You wouldn't, I would. BTW, he just turned 20, is in his second season with us and has already had a major injury.

 

[thfcsteff]

Bergvall is not a starter for me yet, neither are Muani and Richy. It’s a sign of how poor our offensive options are currently that they are. Biss on his day, can be a decent player but he’s had personal disciplinary under 2 different managers now. Gray is a starter for me, already showing he is a quality player and will be massive for us. If we go down Gray is one of those players we must keep.

FWIW I am not a huge fan of Biss, however it is fact that he is a more adventurous midfielder and takes risks in those areas. Which means he was never someone Frank was going to use, as he proved to us that he did not like taking risks in the central areas.

 

[Lilbaz]

FWIW I am not a huge fan of Biss, however it is fact that he is a more adventurous midfielder and takes risks in those areas. Which means he was never someone Frank was going to use, as he proved to us that he did not like taking risks in the central areas.

Don't think it was about his ability.

 

[Robspur12]

I heard early in the summer that he had turned down both Eze and Xavi as he wanted MGW.

Arguably the right call, MGW is the most influential of those three imho. MGW is a highly progressive player too, a really good passer. But whichever player he was after, I think TF was looking for a better passing option in central midfield than we had already especially with Madders out. Xavi may be that in the future but he hasn’t been that this season. Therefore if you don’t have a decent passer in midfield, you go wide.

 

[Robspur12]

FWIW I am not a huge fan of Biss, however it is fact that he is a more adventurous midfielder and takes risks in those areas. Which means he was never someone Frank was going to use, as he proved to us that he did not like taking risks in the central areas.

A side that is low on confidence doesn’t need someone who is taking unnecessary risks in areas where losing the ball will cost you. For me that’s where Lucas is at the moment. He is clearly very talented but there is more development needed to harness his energy and channel it into becoming a top player.

 

[thfcsteff]

A side that is low on confidence doesn’t need someone who is taking unnecessary risks in areas where losing the ball will cost you. For me that’s where Lucas is at the moment. He is clearly very talented but there is more development needed to harness his energy and channel it into becoming a top player.

I think either believe the confidence was drained by the tactics, or the confidence was drained by the results. I suppose it isn't binary, but as to which initiated which, I firmly believe the tactical approach drained the confidence which also has cost us results. With 6 games to go, you're probably right re: Lucas (albeit I'd go for it now but that's me). With 37 or 36 games to go, I'd have handed the keys to Bergy and seen what developed.

 

[thfcsteff]

Arguably the right call, MGW is the most influential of those three imho. MGW is a highly progressive player too, a really good passer. But whichever player he was after, I think TF was looking for a better passing option in central midfield than we had already especially with Madders out. Xavi may be that in the future but he hasn’t been that this season. Therefore if you don’t have a decent passer in midfield, you go wide.

It was the right call for the manager Frank is, however having failed to get him, why did we not profile similar types of player? Why did we then go back to the type of player he really didn't seem to want? It was awful planning/decision-making/recruitment, and is an area where I have some sympathy for Frank as we clearly did not support his 'first choice' of profile for midfield.

 

[glasgowspur]

I heard early in the summer that he had turned down both Eze and Xavi as he wanted MGW. I believe he was 'talked around' to Eze and Xavi. He did the hard work in signing Palhinha, agreed. Where I believe he failed was in trusting him to do his job and using him to allow others to do theirs with more freedom.





Which goes back to a total lack of planning and scope. If (as a club) we were going to allow the alchemy of winning to be broken up for the pragmatism of rebuilding again (which we did) then there had to be more decisive action earlier. Johnson is a fine example. Due diligence would've already told Frank he didn't want him, so sell him quickly and target replacement whilst stock was high. Want to build a defence you trust? Go and get Nathan Collins, pay whatever is necessary to get the manager players he wants. I thought Frank was pitched as a tactician who could get the most out of a group of players. He must've thought the group was decent given that he took the job. As for making the best of those resources, I would counter that he did not, instead looking to try and make them play the way he wanted us to play. I agree, squad imbalance was initially wholly not his to own.





Yup. Injuries and the breakdown of the relationship between Munn and the rest, most certainly cost us big time.




I agree with you, and agree with others who say that Kane/Son masked so many issues. They did! So yeah, major problem there...





I think confidence is the biggest barrier. I really do. We are so fragile and risk-averse.

Frank fell into the exact same trap Jose did, he looked at that squad and thought no way they are as bad as their PL position.
I can tweak this, get my style embedded, give them a boost and climb the table.
Turns out he was wrong.
In fairness a lot of us thought the same.