googbye top 4

[markysimmo]

That victims game was horrendous. The capitulation. That's what I'll look back on if we don't make it.

Being 1-0 up at 90 mins at Goodison and losing was bad too

 

[Harry_Perkins]

As it stands today mate we've played 2 games less than Arsenal over the same period ...

Scant consolation when we're 4 in 4 and the 2 games in hand are City tomorrow and Chelsea away. We need a huge effort.

 

[billyiddo]

And this year Arsenal are also worse than last season. For the first time in about 20 years, we have a world class player and a match winner and they don't.

Not excusing last season's collapse, but this season should still be viewed as a collapse if we don't get top 4.

Arsenal have a stronger team than last season and we're weaker. finishing behind them last season was much more of a 'failure' as we were by far the better side.

 

[Armchair Expert]

So basically you think they are better than us in all areas of the pitch?

You'd really take Vermaelen and Koscielney over Vertonghen an Dawson/Kaboul?

Just for the record, I don't blame AVB one iota. Levy is the one who needs to answer some questions should we miss out.

Kaboul hasn't played this season.

I think they have a better defensive unit yes. They have conceded less goals! They do have a better midfield, and Giroud has scored more goals than Ade and Defoe combined!!!

Yes, I think they are better than us and will finish ahead of us.

The burden of proof isnt on me: the stats back me up. Its up to you to make a credible case for our defense being better than theirs despite conceding more goals in less games.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Last year we didn't rely on individual brilliance: we had players like Modric and van der Vaart orchestrating play, plus the footballing ability of King and Kaboul at the back.

The two teams are completely different animals.

King was a passenger for the second half of the season, don't know why so many posters want to distort the truth and act like he was himself for the entire season.

We still struggled to break teams down who were stubborn defensively and hit teams with pace, just like this season, and this was with Modric and VDV.

 

[Jordinho]

Thats not what I'm saying at all. You cant say "last year we relied on the individual brilliance of Modric, Adebayor, van der Vaart, Lennon, Bale. Thats just a good team.

What I'm saying is (in reply to the other post) that its possible to level accusations at us this season of relying on moments of briliance (although i dont think that - it was the other posters claim), but last year we were jut a very good all round team.

And this season we're relying on certain players being brilliant. That's how it works for all teams. You try to build a solid foundation defensively and it will always be up to the attacking players to come up with whatever it takes to win. Even Real Madrid and Barcelona rely more heavily on some of their players than others if you look at who has the game changing involvements.

 

[Armchair Expert]

King was a passenger for the second half of the season, don't know why so many posters want to distort the truth and act like he was himself for the entire season.

We still struggled to break teams down who were stubborn defensively and hit teams with pace, just like this season, and this was with Modric and VDV.

I agree, it was down to crap management. There is no way at team containing the players we did last term should struggle breaking teams down. Thats why im arguing last year we under achieved and this year we are slightly over achieving. We had a better side last year.

It sounds like your making the same point as me!!

 

[kanoute16]

Arsenal have a stronger team than last season and we're weaker. finishing behind them last season was much more of a 'failure'

Not what gooners i know seem to be saying.
Many can't believe how we have managed to fudge things up since we beat them.

If what you say here makes you feel better then fine but you are kidding yourself.
Management and organisation of the squad has been poor this season and transfer policy has been abysmal yet again.

 

[Mumorn]

Arsenal a better team than us. We may have some better individual players but as a team they are miles ahead of us.

 

[Armchair Expert]

And this season we're relying on certain players being brilliant. That's how it works for all teams. You try to build a solid foundation defensively and it will always be up to the attacking players to come up with whatever it takes to win. Even Real Madrid and Barcelona rely more heavily on some of their players than others if you look at who has the game changing involvements.

But this year we havent even shared the goals around: Bale has scored loads, everyone else has scored fudge all.

I think Dempsey has about 5, supposed to be considered an attacking threat, Modric probably scored the same as that last year and we used to take the tinkle out of him for being a donkey in front of goal!!

 

[joey55]

Centre mid has been as crippling as the striker situation (which, admittedly, is an absolute joke).

By choice though. Huddlestone hasn't been picked. We were in the top 4 before Bale came into the side in 2009/10. That's with a CM of Hudd and Palacios. We had Crouch as a striker. It's our choice to play Sandro/Parker and Dembele. We have other options, that have proved successful in the past, though our fans often seem determined to forget how good Huddlestone when playing regularly. Dembele/Sandro/Parker are all better than Palacios.

Also since Modric moved to CM, we played 8 games without him. We won 6, drew 1 and lost one.

Basically losing Modric was a blow, but we've proven (and that's the key word) than we can play very successfully without him.

As good as Modric is, our losses weren't as great as Arsenals. They lost the best player in the league, who won more points for his team than any other player. Also I don't think their buys in the summer were as good as ours. But it's pointless saying this, as to admit it would also be admitting something else, that the vast majority of members of this forum don't want to.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Kaboul hasn't played this season.

I think they have a better defensive unit yes. They have conceded less goals! They do have a better midfield, and Giroud has scored more goals than Ade and Defoe combined!!!

Yes, I think they are better than us and will finish ahead of us.

The burden of proof isnt on me: the stats back me up. Its up to you to make a credible case for our defense being better than theirs despite conceding more goals in less games.

There's no burden of proof on me. Rickie Lambert has scored more goals than any English striker this season, does that make him better than Wayne Rooney?

We were better than them last season, but they had one of the best players in the world last season who single handedly carried them. Yes we are not as good as last season, but they have got worse too and we have one of the hottest prospects on the planet, the man Zinedine Zidane says has impressed him more than ANY PLAYER this season, Gareth Bale. You don't seem to acknowledge this.

If I picked a combined North London team, it would probably be 6-5 in favour of us. But they still have a better mentality than us, that's the difference. There is nothing between the teams these days so blowing a 7 point lead on them with 10 games left IS a failure in my view.

 

[Armchair Expert]

Arsenal a better team than us. We may have some better individual players but as a team they are miles ahead of us.

Simple, concise and yet very true.

 

[Jurgen the German]

[/B]

I agree, it was down to crap management. There is no way at team containing the players we did last term should struggle breaking teams down. Thats why im arguing last year we under achieved and this year we are slightly over achieving. We had a better side last year.

It sounds like your making the same point as me!!

Yeah I agree Redknapp made some tactical mistakes, but do you not think the likes of Dembele, Sandro, Bale, Lennon, Defoe and Adebayor should be able to break teams down like Stoke and Norwich at home?

 

[Spursalot]

Yeah I agree Redknapp made some tactical mistakes, but do you not think the likes of Dembele, Sandro, Bale, Lennon, Defoe and Adebayor should be able to break teams down like Stoke and Norwich at home?

Not always no.


People seem to forget that everyone struggles to break teams down from time to time. It's not just us.

 

[Armchair Expert]

There's no burden of proof on me. Rickie Lambert has scored more goals than any English striker this season, does that make him better than Wayne Rooney?

We were better than them last season, but they had one of the best players in the world last season who single handedly carried them. Yes we are not as good as last season, but they have got worse too and we have one of the hottest prospects on the planet, the man Zinedine Zidane says has impressed him more than ANY PLAYER this season, Gareth Bale. You don't seem to acknowledge this.

If I picked a combined North London team, it would probably be 6-5 in favour of us. But they still have a better mentality than us, that's the difference. There is nothing between the teams these days so blowing a 7 point lead on them with 10 games left IS a failure in my view.

So the fact they have, scored more, conceded less and have more points is... what? Irrelevant?

And yes i think Ricky Lambert seems a bloody good footballer. Its just fudging arrogant to be so dismissive of someone who has scored so many. I'd say i'd defintely consider swapping him for Defoe.

What point are you making about Bale? Yes he is an outstanding player and our star performer. And?

 

[billyiddo]

Not what gooners i know seem to be saying.
Many can't believe how we have managed to fudge things up since we beat them.

If what you say here makes you feel better then fine but you are kidding yourself.
Management and organisation of the squad has been poor this season and transfer policy has been abysmal yet again.

strange, most gooners i know think they have been a much better side, this year they play as a team whilst last season they were carried by one individual. i don't know how anyone who watched them last season and this can say otherwise really.

im not trying to kid anyone - it was clear to me last summer that both Chelsea and Arsenal were most likely going to be back in front of us in the pecking order, we regressed as a team whilst they improved - im sure if anyone could bump the season predictions thread from the beginning of last summer you'd have found i was saying exactly the same thing as i am now.

anyone who was demanding top 4 from this team, considering the opposition, had their heads in the sky imv. the fact we're still in with a chance, a good chance of getting it at this stage is a testament to the good work under taken by everyone involved in what is a transitional season for us.

 

[Armchair Expert]

Yeah I agree Redknapp made some tactical mistakes, but do you not think the likes of Dembele, Sandro, Bale, Lennon, Defoe and Adebayor should be able to break teams down like Stoke and Norwich at home?

I can see that lot struggling to break teams down. Where is the incisive passing coming from? none of those players can play players in, or switch the play.

Plus to we should be talking about Parker, not Sandro, as he hasnt been available since Christmas.

 

[Jurgen the German]

But this year we havent even shared the goals around: Bale has scored loads, everyone else has scored fudge all.

I think Dempsey has about 5, supposed to be considered an attacking threat, Modric probably scored the same as that last year and we used to take the tinkle out of him for being a donkey in front of goal!!

I agree 100% that Redknapp made some big mistakes, but who's fault is it that we sold players like Modric and VDV and replaced them with players like Sig and Dempsey?

 

[kanoute16]

Arsenal a better team than us. We may have some better individual players but as a team they are miles ahead of us.

Why don't you ask yourself why though?
Why are they better?

Oh of course, they strengthened where they needed to and bought some attacking players. We just ended up with Dempsey at the eleventh hour because the chairman likes to play roulette with the club at the last minute.